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As far as I know Muslims (or anyone else) are allowed entry anywhere, including the Western Wall. It's all part of the same complex, since it was the original site of the Jewish temple before the Romans destroyed it in 70AD. After the Muslims conquered the Holy Land in 637 A.D. they built their...

Oops, my bad. I didn't notice that you were asking about the Western Wall. I thought you were talking about the Temple Mount. It's a common misconception (conspiracy theory) that Israel is trying to prevent Muslims from praying at their holy place, so I auto-read it as though you were asking...

In a nutshell, Israel prevents JEWS from praying on the Temple Mount. It is under control of the Muslim Waqf and only Muslims can pray there. Just FYI. "Jewish prayer on Temple Mount is completely forbidden. Jews may enter only to visit the place, and only at limited times. Muslims are free to...

Good article, though I don't agree with the term 'id'. 'Id' implies a lack of rationality. 'Heart' would be more like it. Dreamer, perhaps, dreamer on a grand scale, and with the capacity to make those dreams come true.

Incidentally, when people gang up like that on those who voice an opinion they don't want to hear, when they tolerate no dissent, it makes me question the quality of their investment advice. Reasoned critique makes me value a person more. Mob behavior makes me question everything.

It's good to see such a rational discussion - on such a weird thread, oddly enough! I tried to say stuff along these lines and was called a troll. Yup. Right. There's a level of paranoia that's gone too far. You can't blame everything on the shorts, annoying and disruptive as they are...

I haven't watched TV for at least 10 years. This is the main Tesla site I read. This and Twitter. I don't follow any short sellers. My POV changed because Elon did something not right here, IN MY OPINION. And I feel disillusioned, and I fear for the future of the whole thing.

That's how I feel. Furthermore, I think that might be how many non fans see it. Can I express an opinion about this without being called a troll? It's highly offensive.

Can I PM you my Twitter account, but we'll keep it private?

It's 'doth'. No, not too much. I joined this forum a few days ago because Tesla has been my major passion for years but I've never had anyone to talk to about it except uninterested parties, who thought my interest amusing and a bit ...strange. They didn't get it. After The Tweet I spent a...

(I'm trying this for the third time). It doesn't work like that. You can't simply undo this mess. "Oh, never mind". Nope. When he suddenly tweeted about taking Tesla private, it was a bombshell. Apparently, not only to us, but to his board (though of course I don't know that for certain). This...

My post was not written in the thread and doesn't belong here.

Already replied but I don't see the post for some reason so sorry if this will appear twice. No, you can't just dial things back like that. Elon stirred up this mess for no reason. He tarnished Tesla's reputation by seeking a partnership with SA. He acted in a manner that raises doubt even...

Loss of confidence. Unnecessary turmoil that wears down even the most ardent supporters. News of a distasteful partner, to put it mildly, with which some of us do not want to be associated, and with potentially malevolent intentions. Fatigue. A sense of loss of purpose.

Ah, I see. Yes, I see what you're saying. Makes sense. I find it troubling, though, that so many on this forum are not bothered at all, even mocking me for saying this. I would have thought there'd be more outcry here.

And...? What?

I looked her up yesterday or day before and spent about one minute, perhaps two, reading about her history. She's deranged. Long history of making up stuff and fighting with people. Got her kicked off Twitter I think. I was forced to read, even if very quickly, about all sort of...

That was my point about Iran. When you don't have democracy, things change in an instant. I'm not sure what you're saying in the second part, but I disagree that we can or should forget or excuse or forgive, especially future actions.

Apart from the oppressive regime thing, it's unstable, dependent on the whims of this or that person and on interpersonal intrigue and power struggles. One day someone's king. The next they're hanged in the town square. One day someone professes he's all for modernization, the next he's rounding...

I would be scared to go to Saudi Arabia. Why would I go? I prefer to limit my exposure to theocratic dystopias to books and movies. I like nice democratic countries where I won't be arrested for "moral reasons" or flogged or executed for some crazy charge. Every day here in Oregon (barring...

That's the problem. Elon built something beautiful - you called it the crown jewel of corporations, which I think is apt. Now's he's gone and attached it to something vile. Now what? :(

From the Smithsonian: The First Moments of Hitler's Final Solution | History | Smithsonian But obviously many people were in denial, including many Jews.

No, that wasn't what I was saying. The NYTimes minimized it. You asked when the US knew. It was known, but minimized by the premier newspaper for personal reasons, is part of the answer.

I was very disturbed when I heard the Saudis bought 3-5%. I thought Elon's Tweet 'considering private' was all about blocking them. I don't want Tesla to collapse... :(

From the NYTimes: 150th Anniversary: 1851-2001; Turning Away From the Holocaust

On a personal note, having placed an order (paid 3,500) what do I do at this point? If I do nothing, what will happen? Not sure I want a Tesla any more, though what's the alternative? Driving ICE. Ay. So what happens if I don't respond to a delivery notification? Or should I take some action?

We finally know what Hillary Clinton knew all along – Saudi Arabia is funding Isis Saudis and Extremism: ‘Both the Arsonists and the Firefighters’

To those who forget history. To those who see nothing wrong with major dealings with despotic regimes. An interesting look into the history of GM and Ford Washingtonpost.com: Ford and GM Scrutinized for Alleged Nazi Collaboration Ford and the Führer

That's what I thought too! Saudis buy 3-5%, Elon goes right away to Twitter: "considering going private". I thought he was looking to block any bigger purchase.

This is who you want to fund Tesla? Why the West turns a blind eye to Saudi Arabia's brutality

The bizarre spat with Canada shows Mohammed bin Salman’s true colours | Nesrine Malik

I do care. Please don't tell me what I should or shouldn't care about. Your post confuses matters, and it's hard to parse things apart, but I'll try. I'm not talking about 'who to save'. I'm talking about who might get a large stake in Tesla, a large amount of power in Tesla, and a large...

Seriously? You don't know what "we" Iook like, for one. Second, this is moral relativism gone amok. I could criticize the Norwegians or other Scandinavians for some things, but I still think they're among the most advanced countries we currently have on this earth. I could criticize the US or...

Saudi Arabia Is a Brutal Human-Rights Violator — and Trump Appreciates That

The evil empire of Saudi Arabia is the West’s real enemy Saudi Arabia criticised for 48 beheadings in four months of 2018 Saudi Arabia: six men face having a hand and a foot amputated for 'highway robbery' Most things are simply too abhorrent to link to.

I'm opposed to the death penalty, FYI. I could post here links to Saudi 'justice', but it's too abhorrent. If you can't see the issue, so be it. Luckily we can disagree without one of us being beheaded. I think I'm going to ask Tesla for a refund of my 3,500 (since I placed an order). If you...

I said that in reply to someone who was quoting the New Testament. I was explaining that I haven't read it, and why. Thanks.

You don't compromise with a country that beheads people and crucifies them. It's appalling that I have to explain this.

It's not about religion. If you'd tell me that Egypt was the funder, I'd be: "oh, interesting". Don't see any major problem with that. Though it would be better to keep it in the West, where we have democracies, no?

Sorry, I have no idea what Matthew said. I'm Jewish and haven't read the New Testament. I think we need some moral clarity here. A line in the sand. Right and wrong. No fuzzinness.

Thanks, just emailed Tesla. I posted this thread to have a public voice about this. And to find people commiserate with, because I am in a state akin to mourning.

I've been heavily invested in Elon for years. Financially too, but what I mean here is emotionally. Tesla and other ventures, The whole mission. It's been the one bright spot in this otherwise pretty dismal world. It's been my main passion. I'm to take delivery soon, finally, and I don't even...

I think you’re right. Elon is being ‘coached’ by ‘the others’ but not via inner ear devices. It’s clear he has a neuralink implant (made from unobtanium) with the receiver concealed in his ear. Note how he gets uncomfortable onstage but only when when the moon is waxing gibbous (go search for...

Thank you for the recommendations so far. I should probably visit a shop to see what the options are - I'm a little confused about the whole topic (the various types of wraps and coats).

Not sure if to post this here or in the model 3 forum. Should I cross post? Does anyone know a reliable coater in PDX, preferably in Washington county or in the Lake Oswego area? I'd rather not have to drive into Portland. I've never wrapped or coated any car. Never waxed a car. Never even...

I've read just about every post. I'm just waiting to see what happens. Elon was in a good mood last night, so all's well, I think. I hope the stock goes up to several thousand so I can sell a few shares, then go private with the rest. That's my plan. One thing that really bugs me, though, is...