TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker and becoming a Supporting Member. For more info: Support TMC
  1. TMC is currently READ ONLY.
    Click here for more info.

‘18 100D Battery in cold weather problem (Regen related)

Discussion in 'Model S' started by Pwdr Extreme, Dec 3, 2018.

  1. chillaban

    chillaban Active Member

    Joined:
    May 5, 2016
    Messages:
    3,723
    Location:
    Bay Area
    I see the same behavior in my '17 S100D this winter but I didn't see it when I first took delivery of the car.

    I suspect recent software updates have changed the regen limiting behavior to be more prone to limiting regen. One can only speculate why they did this.
     
    • Like x 1
  2. SeminoleFSU

    SeminoleFSU Voluntaryist

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2013
    Messages:
    1,448
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    I'm noticing a difference between my old 2013 P85 and new 2018 100D. Takes longer from start with cold soaked battery to get full regen, and the limited regen warning seems to come on in much warmer temps than my old car. My first thought was more batteries, same heater=longer time to heat up... but looking at Jason Hughes' teardowns of the newly redesigned 100 packs, he mentions a smaller coolant line being used, but instead of 1 now there's 2 so that the warm coolant doesn't have to travel past as many cells before it gets cooled again. If this closed loop system is used to also heat/warm the pack (not sure just a guess) it could mean the thinner diameter coolant lines are also contributing to the issue. This will be much less of an issue once Tesla releases the update where you can set your charge start time based on when you want it to finish... Well it'll solve the issue for 50% of the time at least.. 100% if you have a charger at work.
     
  3. Pwdr Extreme

    Pwdr Extreme Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2016
    Messages:
    317
    Location:
    Bozeman, MT
    I charged to 100% in my garage yesterday morning, it finished about 30 minutes before I left. I turned the heater on in my car an hour before I left, (which showed battery heating on the app) and I still had limited regen for the full 220 miles until I hit a supercharger. Temps were in the mid 20’s.

    What the hell more can I do? Basically, it seems we will just have limited regen once the temp drops below 45 degrees or so, period. Unless we supercharge often.

    The app never shows my battery heating except when I am plugged in with climate control turned on. I’m guessing Tesla wants an income stream from doing brake jobs. LOL
     
  4. MP3Mike

    MP3Mike Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2016
    Messages:
    14,925
    Location:
    Oregon
    What SoC did you start from, and what charge rate do you have? (The charge tapers towards 100% so it will generate a lot less heat going from 90% to 100% than it would for 70% to 80%. Assuming you are more than trickle charging.)
     
  5. Jan Fiala

    Jan Fiala Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2017
    Messages:
    276
    Location:
    Prague
    Thats pretty normal and as per design. Preheating DOES NOT remove the regen limitation completely but only to achieve 30kW regen. The rest will slowly go away with normal (not city) drive.

    On the other hand, two hours of full AC charging (17kW) removes the regen completely even in freezing conditions.
     
  6. SeminoleFSU

    SeminoleFSU Voluntaryist

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2013
    Messages:
    1,448
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    Well you'll obviously be almost completely regen limited at 100% SoC until you pull at least 3-5% (maybe more) out of the battery... but if you did 220 miles and saw limited regen that entire time, then maybe there is something to this... I say that with a grain of salt though because 20 degrees is colder than anything I've had my car in because I live in the South :)

    Perhaps someone should message Bjorn what he's seen with 100Ds? He's a cold weather superstar.
     
  7. Pwdr Extreme

    Pwdr Extreme Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2016
    Messages:
    317
    Location:
    Bozeman, MT
    Started with around 40% charge. Of course it will be limited since it’s at 100% for a little while. But only 15 or 20 miles.

    2 hours of 48 amp charging absolutely does NOT remove regen limiting. Even in my 50 degree garage. 4 hours of 48 amp charging at my office does not remove regen either of its 45 degrees or colder.

    I typically charge from 40% or so to 90% at my office. Sometimes I leave with it still charging at 80ish percent. So pulling it fresh off of full, 48 amp 243 volt charge for 4 hours does not warm the battery enough to prevent regen limiting.
     
  8. SeminoleFSU

    SeminoleFSU Voluntaryist

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2013
    Messages:
    1,448
    Location:
    Atlanta, GA
    #28 SeminoleFSU, Dec 12, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2018
    Yea I just did a quick Chickfila run and yes it was cold last night (not below freezing but my car still is not garaged- it's in carport). The temp is 53 outside right now and I had regen limit the whole way there and back... prob 10m each way stop and go... My old 2013 P85 is still in my muscle memory having drove it 5yrs and 80+k miles... With that being said, my perception is the 100 pack is a lot more regen limited in cold than the 85 was.. Is it software related? Could be. If I hadn't sold my old p85 it would be interesting to compare the behavior of the two esp on the same firmware.. but that's not going to happen now :)
     
  9. N..8

    N..8 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2017
    Messages:
    202
    Location:
    Sanford, NC
    220 miles driven and still limited regen, something is wrong. Sounds like maybe your Battery coolant heater went out or the switching valve isn't working, bring it into the SC
     
    • Like x 2
  10. EVSteve

    EVSteve 110% Solar Powered

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2014
    Messages:
    383
    Location:
    Schnecksville, PA
    I presume you’re referring to Jan’s post regarding two hours at 17kW? 17kW is in the 80A range depending on voltage not 48A.
     
  11. sorka

    sorka Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2015
    Messages:
    7,588
    Location:
    Merced, CA
    You beat me too it. Charge and discharge BOTH cause heat and the 100's increased capacity means the same amount of work is spread over a larger capacity battery.
     
  12. sorka

    sorka Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2015
    Messages:
    7,588
    Location:
    Merced, CA
    Can't you use "Max Battery" to preheat the battery before leaving? I thought non performance models now have the software switch to turn that on?
     
  13. sorka

    sorka Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2015
    Messages:
    7,588
    Location:
    Merced, CA
    The battery heater or the cabin heater?
     
  14. sorka

    sorka Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2015
    Messages:
    7,588
    Location:
    Merced, CA
    My app never shows battery heating even when I've turned on "Max Battery". Cabin heating is not the same thing as battery heating unless there's something new in V9 that I don't know about since I still have V8.
     
  15. Jan Fiala

    Jan Fiala Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2017
    Messages:
    276
    Location:
    Prague
    He is probably speaking of this one year old little heat wave icon on the app climate page which lits when switching on the cabin heating and having a cold battery. This actually is the icon for the battery heater.
     
  16. Pwdr Extreme

    Pwdr Extreme Member

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2016
    Messages:
    317
    Location:
    Bozeman, MT
    Wasn’t aware of max battery other than P models.

    Yes, referring to the icon in the center of the car on the climate page with the red wavy lines. That icon only shows up when plugged in and I turn on climate control.

    I put a call into Tesla, they are “reviewing logs”
     
    • Funny x 1
  17. TMeister

    TMeister Gearhead

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2016
    Messages:
    270
    Location:
    Boise, ID
    I have the same behavior as you have described. The regen limiting has changed between last winter and this one to be more limiting for sure. I do not ever get complete regen driving around if temps are in the 30's or lower. And I have gotten no regen when temps are in the low 20's. Although I do get a little after 20 miles or so in that case.

    Yesterday I supercharged to 96%, had full regen, drove around some and parked for the afternoon for 4 hours in 30 degrees. The car still had full regen after that. But then overnight in the garage at 48 degrees, back to limited regen today. Right now at 48 degrees the car shows 4 bars of limit after sitting 4 hours after a short 10 mile drive. So no change at all since this morning. Outside was in the low 40's.

    I only see battery heating in the app when plugged and temps below 20. Cabin heating (plugged in or not) appears to have no effect on regen limits.
     
    • Helpful x 1
    • Informative x 1
  18. Jan Fiala

    Jan Fiala Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2017
    Messages:
    276
    Location:
    Prague
    This is weird. I just started to drive after preheating and had 5 yellow bars (30 kW regen). Within 20 miles city drive and 50 min the regen limit was gone completely. 30's F.

    100D, 2017
     
    • Informative x 1
  19. sorka

    sorka Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 28, 2015
    Messages:
    7,588
    Location:
    Merced, CA
    Interesting. Never seen it when I use Max Battery which runs the battery heater without heating the cabin.
     
  20. ytwytw

    ytwytw Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2017
    Messages:
    410
    Location:
    Canada
    I have MX100, -3C recent days

    After park my car for whole day, still have half Regen

    30min drive will get full regen

    Never see no regen except park the car outside for 3 days.
     
    • Informative x 1
    • Like x 1

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.
  • Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


    SUPPORT TMC