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1-2 Times A Week Charging

helix757

Member
Mar 21, 2021
16
1
New York, USA
Hello! I am about to pull the trigger on purchasing a Tesla but am in a living situation where home charging will not be a choice.

I have several CHAdeMO chargers via EVgo near my home, and with my driving patterns I see myself having to charge there 1-1.5 times a week with the adapter. The charger is rated for 50KW, is that going to kill my battery with degradation? Im seeing conflicting and vague info on this topic. This is definitely an investment for me that I want to last a while.

Thanks in advance!
 

Black306

Member
Oct 14, 2019
504
727
Sacramento
Personally, I find home charging a big benefit to owning an EV. Without it, it can be a big hassle; worse than dealing with a period fill up of an ICE vehicle.

In your 1-1.5 time per week estimate, are you calculating with advertised range? If so, that’s not the number you should use. (1) Range is estimated using a batteries full charge (ie 0-100%). Typical usage should be between 20-80% or 10-90%. That’s going to drop advertised range 20-40%. (2) Cold temperatures, like the ones during New York winters, are going to drop ranges even further. This is due to batteries not performing well in cold climates and increased power consumption due warming the cabin.

Not trying to sound like a Negative Nancy, but these are serious things to consider. It’ll really suck if you’re stuck with an EV without a convenient way to charge it. It’ll really ruin the experience.
 

jstjohnz

Member
Sep 7, 2020
96
46
Indianapolis
+1 on the comments above. I think spending an hour or more at a Chademo charger a couple of times a week is going to get annoying very quickly. Re your main question, I don't know, it seems like you are somewhere in the middle ground as far as charge rate at 50KW. You should be able to charge at 50KW up to about 85% which would be as high as you would want to go on a regular basis. I suspect there will be some impact on battery life, but not a lot. I'm sure there are fleet Teslas that supercharge multiple times per day.
 
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afty

Member
Mar 13, 2019
120
139
Bay Area, CA
50 kW should be fine for regular charging. Rule of thumb is that it’s safe to charge at up to 1C regularly. 1C = fast enough to charge the battery in one hour. For us that’s ~78 kW.

But I agree with the above posters that there’s a good chance you’ll have to charge more frequently than you expect, and that it will be irritating to have to go somewhere to do it.
 

helix757

Member
Mar 21, 2021
16
1
New York, USA
Personally, I find home charging a big benefit to owning an EV. Without it, it can be a big hassle; worse than with a period fill up of an ICE vehicle.

In your 1-1.5 time per week estimate, are you calculating with advertised range? If so, that’s not the number you should use. (1) Range is estimated using a batteries full charge (ie 0-100%). Typical usage should be between 20-80% or 10-90%. That’s going to drop advertised range 20-40%. (2) Cold temperatures, like the ones during New York winters, are going to drop ranges even further. This is due to batteries not performing well in cold climates and increased power consumption due warming the cabin.

Not trying to sound like a Negative Nancy, but these are serious things to consider. It’ll really suck if you’re stuck with an EV without a convenient way to charge it. It’ll really ruin the experience.
What if I can also charge ~56 hours a week on a 120v? That combined with a 30 minute charge at the EVgo station should yield ~324miles per week. That seems doable — what do you think?
 

Uncle Paul

Well-Known Member
Nov 1, 2013
6,188
6,679
Canyon Lake,CA
For many, local charging is a rite that you can adapt to your lifestyle. When charging get a coffee, read and answer some emails, check the web for things that interest you like this forum.

Many owners discover ways to charge at home, even if it is plugging into a 120V socket over night.
 

Nosken

Member
Jan 15, 2015
776
621
Lincoln, CA
What if I can also charge ~56 hours a week on a 120v? That combined with a 30 minute charge at the EVgo station should yield ~324miles per week. That seems doable — what do you think?
It would probably be better if you gave us what your typical weekly drive pattern consists of in miles and days.
 

afty

Member
Mar 13, 2019
120
139
Bay Area, CA
You could use abetterrouteplanner.com to get a very accurate estimate of the battery use you’ll see on your regular commute, much more accurate than going by EPA range estimates.
 

Black306

Member
Oct 14, 2019
504
727
Sacramento
Great point. I would say at MOST 230-290 per week when I am commuting to university, less when I am not (out of semester)
I’ll assume that means 45-60 miles on a given weekday. With a 110v/15A outlet, you’ll get ~35 miles added with ~8 hrs of charging (low estimate since during colder months it’ll add less miles for the same amount of time and you’ll probably charge for more than 8 hours). So, you’ll be running a deficit each day of the week until you can ‘top off.’ Might be a problem later in the week before you can top off.


Don't forget that EVgo charging costs significantly more than the cost of home electricity and the adapter isn't cheap either.
Very good point.
 

Hexo09

Member
Mar 8, 2021
47
36
Bay Area, CA
If you can charge at home overnight, even on a regular outlet, I wouldn’t give up. It will still give you about 20% of charge if you get home at 6pm and leave it plugged in until let’s say 9am. And if you stay home over the weekend, you might end up being charged up on Monday mornings. Just got to make sure there is no overheating situation.
I personally don’t charge at home for several reasons, but I have free charging (Volta) at work. With WFH, I only go into the office once or twice a week, and it’s been perfectly fine. I drive about 200 miles a week, and obviously we don’t get anywhere close as rough of a winter as you guys here in the Bay Area.
Your situation definitely isn’t ideal, but if a Tesla is the car of your dreams, and if you can for sure plug into a 120V for an emergency situation (or even non-emergency), I would go for it, yolo. If you know that your situation might be better in a few months, just wait.

Edit: Just realized you said 56 hours/week on a 120V. That’s still pretty good if you know for sure that you can use that. That’s about 60-70% worth of charge. So if you drive 200 miles a week during the spring, you would basically stay at the same SOC.
 
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Zaxxon

Supporting Member
Dec 11, 2012
4,650
21,410
Colorado
Having the ability to at least use a regular outlet regularly is a big help. Given your stated weekly mileage, I think you'd be fine using 120V for 8 hours daily and periodically topping up using DC, but you'd have to understand that it won't be as convenient as plugging in at home.

A couple of follow-ups:
  • What is the 120V situation? An outlet at work? Is it truly something that you can use easily every day? Is it a 5-15 or 5-20?
  • Are there any Superchargers nearby? 50 kW sounds good, but Superchargers would significantly reduce your DCFC stop times.
 

helix757

Member
Mar 21, 2021
16
1
New York, USA
Having the ability to at least use a regular outlet regularly is a big help. Given your stated weekly mileage, I think you'd be fine using 120V for 8 hours daily and periodically topping up using DC, but you'd have to understand that it won't be as convenient as plugging in at home.

A couple of follow-ups:
  • What is the 120V situation? An outlet at work? Is it truly something that you can use easily every day? Is it a 5-15 or 5-20?
  • Are there any Superchargers nearby? 50 kW sounds good, but Superchargers would significantly reduce your DCFC stop times.
My 120 V is in a home so im assuming 15 Amp. As for the super charger there are but I heard frequent use would kill your battery with degradation. That is what I am more concerned about truly is if the 50kw chargers by my home are going to really have a impact on battery degradation due to weekly use.
 

Stickyman

Member
Mar 17, 2021
19
3
Long Island NY
Where I am I have seen many owners at Superchargers over the weekend filling up. It is packed all day. With that said I doubt 50 kW would damage the battery in the long term. It would get old quick but you could watch Netflix the whole time. As others have stated 120V would work though you would have to charge all the time. No questions. I did that with my last EV and quickly got a 240V option. Good luck!
 

Zaxxon

Supporting Member
Dec 11, 2012
4,650
21,410
Colorado
My 120 V is in a home so im assuming 15 Amp. As for the super charger there are but I heard frequent use would kill your battery with degradation. That is what I am more concerned about truly is if the 50kw chargers by my home are going to really have a impact on battery degradation due to weekly use.
Check the breaker and wiring--if it's a newer home you might be able to easily upgrade the outlet to a 5-20 easily (needs a 20A breaker and 12 ga wiring). That gives a 33% boost to power and more like a 50% boost to charge speed (since the draw of the ancillary equipment in the car is fixed). I was able to upgrade my mom's garage outlet from 5-15 to 5-20 and it made a big difference for her as far as not needing to supplement with other charging options.
 
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helix757

Member
Mar 21, 2021
16
1
New York, USA
Check the breaker and wiring--if it's a newer home you might be able to easily upgrade the outlet to a 5-20 easily (needs a 20A breaker and 12 ga wiring). That gives a 33% boost to power and more like a 50% boost to charge speed (since the draw of the ancillary equipment in the car is fixed). I was able to upgrade my mom's garage outlet from 5-15 to 5-20 and it made a big difference for her as far as not needing to supplement with other charging options
I think the home was built in the 70s. Do most homes already have 12ga wiring? How do you check for that? How much did it cost for your mothers upgrade?

With the upgrade, how many miles/hr does it charge?
 

ACepero

Member
Mar 9, 2021
8
5
NY
I am in the same situation - taking delivery without a home charger.

I don't use a car to commute to and from work and rarely drive more than 2,000 miles in a year so I found the inability to charge from home a non-factor when making the decision to order a Tesla. I have 30 superchargers within 3 miles of my apartment and my sister has a Tesla home charger (whom I visit at least 2-3 times a month).

If I drove a lot more or commuted in this car, not having the ability to charge from home would be an issue.
 

Zaxxon

Supporting Member
Dec 11, 2012
4,650
21,410
Colorado
I think the home was built in the 70s. Do most homes already have 12ga wiring? How do you check for that? How much did it cost for your mothers upgrade?

With the upgrade, how many miles/hr does it charge?
I don't have the link handy, but there is at least one good thread here that details the steps. For a home built in the 70s I would peg your odds as not great, but your first step should be checking the breaker for the outlet's circuit--if it's already 20A, then you should be good (assuming your home was built to code) but you can verify the wiring gauge by shutting off the breaker and pulling the outlet out of the wall so you can see the wiring.

The upgrade for my mom was about $20, including an outlet tester that I bought to check my work afterward. I literally just had to buy a 5-20 outlet, shut off the breaker (which was already 20A), verify the wire gauge, then remove the old outlet and screw in the new one.

There are other options that could work depending on the setup of the garage's circuit(s), including 6-15 or 6-20. Do you own this home? If so, your best bet might be to hire an electrician for an hour to do a quick inspection and see what they suggest. My main point is that given your relatively low weekly mileage, you don't necessarily need a big upgrade all the way to a 14-50 or something to get by. A 5-20 would go a long way. If your electrical panel is in the garage, it may very well be a cheap upgrade even if you can't just make the 5-15 to 5-20 swap like I did.

My mom's car is a 3, but it moved from around 4 mph to 7 mph charge rate with the 5-20. Tesla has a chart here, but it's very conservative. In 'normal' weather, you should beat those estimates. In very cold weather, a 5-15 will largely just maintain charge level.
 

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