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10-30 to 14-30 adapter and charging advise

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by sumitkgarg, Aug 12, 2017.

  1. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    Hello everyone! My first post here...

    I am getting a delivery of my Model S soon (so excited!) and wanted to get setup for charging in the meantime. To add an outlet in the garage dedicated to charging with a 50 AMP circuit is going to be too much work as per the electricians I contacted. They claim that it will involve PGE digging underneath my driveway and I'd really like to avoid any massive work to get this outlet installed.

    So, I was thinking that maybe I can use my dryer outlet (which is 10-30) for charging my car and the plan is to:

    1. Buy the 14-30 adapter that Tesla sells - Model S/X NEMA Adapter
    2. Get an extension cord or build one that converts 10-30p to 14-30r. This will serve two purposes - a) add length to my charging cable, which I need, and b) enable me to use the dryer outlet for charging my car.

    I can then plug in the dryer (after I convert it to 4 prong 14-30 as well) when I want to use the dryer and plugin the charger for the car when I need to charge the car.

    What are your thoughts on this? Any issues that you guys see? Any recommendations on where to get the extension cord for 10-30p to 14-30r conversion?

    Thanks so much!!
     
  2. KJD

    KJD Supporting Member

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    The best option is a dedicated 14-50 outlet for your car. Why would they need to dig up your driveway for that.
    You might want to get a bid from a different company.
     
  3. mblakele

    mblakele radial cross member

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    First I'd ask about a dedicated circuit that's less than 50A. It sounds like you're short on panel capacity, and a panel upgrade would require a mains upgrade? But a 30A circuit might be ok without any of that. Unless you have a really long commute you probably don't need 50A at home. I get by with a 30A circuit, charging at 24A because of the 80% rule. I drive about 75 miles daily, and I figure a 30A circuit would support up to about 120-mi daily, using an 8-hr charging window.

    If that idea doesn't work out, your backup plan would probably work ok. I've never seen a 14-30 extension cord, but 14-50 is common for RV use. You could make or buy an adapter for it, or remove the neutral pin: Tesla's charger doesn't need it. Of course if you do that you should label it clearly, to reduce the risk of someone else misusing the cable.

    You're also taking on some risk that the extension cable will cause problems and damage something. Worst case you could start a fire. You'll want to pay attention to the state of the cable and any adapters, and replace anything that starts to look worn or gets hot when charging. However using a 14-50 cable should reduce that risk, because you're only asking that 50A cable to handle a 24A load.
     
  4. Derek Kessler

    Derek Kessler Member

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    I went the home-made extension route. Stuck L14-30 twist-lock plugs on either end so I could swap out receptacles and plugs as needed.

    It's pretty straightforward, most of these plugs are even color coded inside. You'll want at least 10/4 wire.

    Is this a detached garage?
     
  5. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    Thanks everyone for your quick response!

    I called few electricians and showed them the photo of my main board and the sub-panel. There is no space and when they asked me if the electric cables are overhead or underground after looking at the pictures, they pretty much told me that I am screwed.

    Same with 30A. No space for anything new.

    How will I plug the Tesla 14-30 adapter in a 14-50 receptacle? I think the connectors differ a little bit. I don't want to use the Tesla's 14-50 adapter because I may forget to set the charging amps down to 24Amps in the car. Don't want to risk anything there. I have Zinsco circuit breakers and from reading some other posts, I'd like to make sure that the car "never" tries to draw more than 24Amps.

    Attached garage. I will keep looking to buy an extension online and if I am not successful at that, I will try to build an extension myself. Any pictures of yours? How does a twist lock work with the dryer plug? I guess you are not swapping the plugs (car vs. dryer) at the extension, but rather at the wall outlet?
     
  6. mblakele

    mblakele radial cross member

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    Make or buy an adapter, or remove the unnecessary neutral pin wherever it gets in the way. The Tesla 14-30 adapter will take care of the current.
     
  7. gg_got_a_tesla

    gg_got_a_tesla Model S: VIN P65513, Model 3 Res Holder

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    I use a 10-30 outlet as well but, have the 10-30 adapter that Tesla used to sell before.

    You need this:

    NEMA adapters

    You can choose the 10-30P male/plug and 14-30R female/outlet (that you can then use with the available Tesla 14-30 adapter).

    I can vouch for Quick Charge Power; I've bought a JLong and a Jesla from them - excellent workmanship and service!
     
    • Helpful x 1
  8. gregd

    gregd Active Member

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    Look for a product called a "Dryer Buddy". It's basically designed exactly for your situation. They have versions with different outlet types, so hopefully can match what you have on the wall and what you can get for the car.

    I charged my Roadster for 2 years on the 10-30 dryer plug. I didn't know about the Buddy products, so I wired my own. Essentially a 2-outlet extension cord, one for the car, one for the dryer. Had to make sure I disabled the car before running the dryer. The Buddy makes sure you don't mess up.
     
    • Like x 2
  9. Lasttoy

    Lasttoy Member

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    I installed a 14.50 in an hour. Go to home depot, buy 14.50 box complete, roll of 8.3, 50amp double breaker. Very easy
    Watch ten you tube videos. Very easy.
    Elementary Watson
     
    • Like x 1
  10. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    Great. Thanks for the link. I wonder if there is a way to get the cord bigger than 1 foot. That would be perfect for me.

    Very interesting. I will take a look at this. I might end up making my own as well. Thanks.

    I wish it was that easy for me. As I stated, there is no space in my main board or sub-panels for a new circuit breaker.
     
  11. FlatSix911

    FlatSix911 918 Hybrid

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    This is the best answer ... safely share a 30A dryer outlet with your EVSE :cool:

    Dryer Buddy

    [​IMG]
     
    • Like x 1
  12. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    Is there a DIY on this Dryer Buddy like thing? I wouldn't mind doing it myself because it seems like fun.
     
  13. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    Guys one more question related to this. I read that the Tesla charging will not work without ground. Ignoring all the adapters in between, my wall outlet is a 10-30r - which I think does not contain ground. So, is there is a risk that with buying a Dryer Buddy (10-30p to 10-30r, 14-30r), I will not be able to charge my car using a 14-30 Tesla adapter because of lack of ground? Thanks!
     
  14. mblakele

    mblakele radial cross member

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    The 10-30 neutral should be wired to ground at the electrical panel. It's better to have a separate ground, and you might consider changing out that 10-30 for a 14-30. But the original wiring run may not include a separate ground conductor, in which case you'd have to run a new ground.

    Possibly useful: Looking for or adding a ground to an existing NEMA 10-30 socket
     
    • Helpful x 1
  15. GSP

    GSP Member

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    If you connect the neutral pin of your 10-30 to the ground pin of the 14-30 outlet the car will charge with the UMC / 14-30 adapter. This is because neutral is tied to ground in your panel.

    This works, but for everyday charging I would feel better about converting the dryer outlet from a 10-30 into a 14-30.

    Another option is to buy Tesla's 10-30 UMC adapter. It has been available on their website from time to time, including over the past few months. If you need a longer cord, Quick Charge Power can lengthen your UMC cord. Unlike an extension cord, the UMC cord is protected by the GFI circuit and disconnect relays inside the UMC.

    GSP
     
    • Like x 1
  16. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    Thank you for your help! I guess I will have to open up my10-30 to see what is inside. :)
     
  17. miimura

    miimura Active Member

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    There are ways to make more space for breakers in the panel if that is your only limitation. Of course, if an electrician did a load calculation on your whole panel and there is no more amperage available according to code, then you're actually screwed and cannot add a new circuit to charge your car. I would look into this further if I was in your situation.
     
  18. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    I did. There is no more amperage available, unfortunately.
     
  19. miimura

    miimura Active Member

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    Then the only code compliant solution is to either upgrade the panel and service or use special equipment to prevent two high-load devices from running simultaneously. This can be a Dryer-Buddy or something more sophisticated that can prevent your central A/C from running while you are charging your car. Interrupting the low voltage cable going to the A/C compressor unit that tells it to turn on is pretty easy to do. This is commonly used as a load management strategy for whole house backup generators.
     
  20. cybergates

    cybergates Member

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    #20 cybergates, Aug 14, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2017
    check if your 10-30 socket is actually wired with #10/3 wire (10 gauge + red + black + white + ground - in my case the ground was ground to the box and I used a multimeter to check that it was indeed grounded (+120 volts each phase to ground). So i just changed mine to 14-30 (I have a gas dryer). Then used the official 14-30 adapter. Works great charges at 18mi/hr which is totally fine.

    So far have put off the 14-50 install which will require a new set of wires to be pulled (which reading the forums #6 gauge wire is recommended?)

    Always double and triple check all power is indeed shutoff using a multimeter to test while it's on and confirm that it's off.

    As for 14-30 extension cords there is one on amazon (https://www.amazon.com/AC-Connectors-Anti-Weather-Chemicals-Extension/dp/B01N6U2UZC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1502740698&sr=8-2&keywords=14-30+extension+cord) but I didn't like the rubbery smell plus I figured a 14-50 cord has much more versatility if I go on a roadtrip or do upgrade to 14-50 later on.

    So I have this : 14-30 socket --> 14-30 to 14-50 pigtail from amazon --> 18' 14-50 cord --> 14-50 to 14-30 receptacle --> tesla 14-30 adapter to Tesla charger. (Kind of a mess but this ensures that the car will never attempt to charge more than 24A since using a genuine Tesla 14-30 adapter. I could hook directly to the wall but the cord is a bit short so that's why this extension). If anyone is interested in the parts I ordered I can list those from amazon.
     
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