110 V charging harm?

[bohenriksson]

Got my new model 3 “Misty” a week ago and still figuring things out ;-))
I know charging in this car is not a completely passive thing in that pumps and fans can run when needed. I’m trying to find out what long range (no pun) is best for it when it comes to charging.

At work I have 110 V charging for free (“free” in that I pay a yearly parking fee so I feel no qualms in using it!) 110 for me is fine because I’m off for 3-4 days at a time so plenty of time to fill up to 80-90 % recommended max charge.

Any downside to this long trickle charging as opposed to plugging it in at home nightly (which in that case I would rarely need to do) on a 240 V charge?

Thanks

Bo

 

[garth_angst]

I don't think you will "rarely" be charging at home.
How long is your commute?
110v will get you around 5 miles per hour added.
If you are off for 3-4 days at a time, are you not driving the car at all? If not, then you are missing out on the fun of driving it.

 

[Tam]

...Any downside to this long trickle charging as opposed to plugging it in at home nightly (which in that case I would rarely need to do) on a 240 V charge?

No harm to your battery.

Lots of downsides but not about your battery's harm:

Slow
Takes too long
Very long.... And in winter, your battery needs to be warmed up for charging so your actual charging will take much longer because most of the energy is diverted to the heater and there's hardly any left to charge your battery.

 

[MrMassTransit]

No downside other than the speed. If you can supplement with home charging or public charging if needed, it could be a perfectly fine solution.

 

[davewill]

No harm to your battery.

Lots of downsides but not about your battery's harm:

Slow
Takes too long
Very long.... And in winter, your battery needs to be warmed up for charging so your actual charging will take much longer because most of the energy is diverted to the heater and there's hardly any left to charge your battery.

Even if he doesn't net much charge in very cold weather, at least the car won't lose a lot keeping the battery warm.

 

[Tam]

Even if he doesn't net much charge in very cold weather, at least the car won't lose a lot keeping the battery warm.

Very good point! If there's a choice between no plugging in and 120V, I'll take 120V any time!

 

[JulienW]

The slower you charge (and discharge) lit-ion batteries the better it is for them.

 

[derotam]

Got my new model 3 “Misty” a week ago and still figuring things out ;-))
I know charging in this car is not a completely passive thing in that pumps and fans can run when needed. I’m trying to find out what long range (no pun) is best for it when it comes to charging.

At work I have 110 V charging for free (“free” in that I pay a yearly parking fee so I feel no qualms in using it!) 110 for me is fine because I’m off for 3-4 days at a time so plenty of time to fill up to 80-90 % recommended max charge.

Any downside to this long trickle charging as opposed to plugging it in at home nightly (which in that case I would rarely need to do) on a 240 V charge?

So if I am correctly understanding your situation, the only downside I see would be that you would be leaving your car at work for 3-4 days so it wouldn't be as accessible to you if you wanted to drive somewhere...unless of course you can practically see the parking area from your house.

As I will mention further below in response to someone else's statement...Look at it this way... 120v is going to get you at most about 5 miles per hour of charge...240V is going to get you at most about 30 miles per hour of charge. So if you drive over 5 miles per hour or 30 miles per hour respectively you are causing a faster change in charge level as you are when you charge the car. So the difference between 120V and 240V is going to be so inconsequential to even worry about that.

Another thing to think about is, and I don't remember the exact numbers here, the regenerative braking can easily generate more than a 5 miles per hour of regen rate of charge, and probably more than even 30mph of recharge.

So with all that said, I say it doesn't matter, do what you feel like doing.

The slower you charge (and discharge) lit-ion batteries the better it is for them.

In regard to the OP's question and statements, you are basically saying that driving your car over 5 miles per hour is worse for the battery than charging off a 120V outlet. Maybe if the OP was trying to compare charging at 120V vs supercharging you could say that 120V is better for the battery but the OP is trying to compare 120V and 240V.

The possible benefit to the battery by charging at 120V vs 240V is unbelievably negligible.

Even if comparing 120V to supercharging, if the person is charging to 100% I would argue that supercharging would be better as the battery would be spending less time at higher SOC.

 

[ewoodrick]

No harm and it seems to work for you. That's a win-win.

 

[doghousePVD]

There is no benefit to charging at 120V vs 240V if you have 240V available. 120V is generally much less efficient, since the charger itself uses power regardless of how much is passing through. The coolant pumps and heaters use a significant percentage of the power available from a 5-15. In very cold weather, you can barely charge at all because of the energy needed to heat the battery.

Many people think because much of the time using only 120 V is adequate, they don't need higher power. The challenge is the outliers (also called real life), when you really need a lot faster charging due to holiday travels, airports, hospitals, late dinners/movies, and getting to a SC is inconvenient. Even if installing a 240V in the garage isn't in the cards, I alway s recommend having a possible 240V charge available. If you have the right adapters, often you can charge off an electric stove or dryer outlet when needed, and use the easier 120 V for daily use.

The difference can be overnight, not four days.

 

[Tam]

There is no benefit to charging at 120V vs 240V if you have 240V available. 120V is generally much less efficient, since the charger itself uses power regardless of how much is passing through. The coolant pumps and heaters use a significant percentage of the power available from a 5-15. In very cold weather, you can barely charge at all because of the energy needed to heat the battery.

Many people think because much of the time using only 120 V is adequate, they don't need higher power. The challenge is the outliers (also called real life), when you really need a lot faster charging due to holiday travels, airports, hospitals, late dinners/movies, and getting to a SC is inconvenient. Even if installing a 240V in the garage isn't in the cards, I alway s recommend having a possible 240V charge available. If you have the right adapters, often you can charge off an electric stove or dryer outlet when needed, and use the easier 120 V for daily use.

The difference can be overnight, not four days.

Agreed.

But the choice in this thread is:

1) Unplug at work as the OP thinks to prevent battery harm

or

2) 120V Plug-in at work as the OP thinks 120V might be harmful to the battery

 

[bohenriksson]

Thanks for all answers

I’m afraid I phrased my question badly.
When I park at work (an airport) it sits there for the 3-4 days straight. I know 110 is inefficient but since the juice is free I don’t much care. But since the charging process for every kWh takes 4-5 times longer than doing it at home on 240 it would put that much more running time (wear) on pumps and fans. IF they even run ever on a trickle charge... Which I doubt since the car is quiet as a mouse when on 110.

Bo

 

[duanra]

Thanks for all answers

I’m afraid I phrased my question badly.
When I park at work (an airport) it sits there for the 3-4 days straight. I know 110 is inefficient but since the juice is free I don’t much care. But since the charging process for every kWh takes 4-5 times longer than doing it at home on 240 it would put that much more running time (wear) on pumps and fans. IF they even run ever on a trickle charge... Which I doubt since the car is quiet as a mouse when on 110.

Bo

I knew you were leaving a car at an airport ! (I do the same thing, leaving the car at the airport).
Whenever I can, I leave it plugged in, except if all spots are occupied. The only thing I would take into account, specially in cold temperature is not to count too much on the app connection.
Example : You're about to leave for your last leg back to your base, so you think righfully that it would be a good time to finish up charging since it will heat up your battery which will be nice once you are ready to drive back home right ?

So you open your app and you end up with vehicle connection error...not a big deal, but kind of annoying.

 

[RedModel3]

Since your car is sitting for 3-4 days, plug it in. Everyone is always saying that a plugged in car is a happy car, and if you use Sentry mode then at least it will help the vampire drain. I don't see a reason not to keep it plugged in.

 

[Runt8]

Good rule of thumb - if you're not supercharging every time you plug in and not charging to 100% you're not harming the battery. Set the max charge to 90% (or 80, or 70, or whatever makes you feel warm inside and works for your driving situation), plug in when you can, and stop worrying about the battery.

 

[user212_nr]

Thanks for all answers

I’m afraid I phrased my question badly.
When I park at work (an airport) it sits there for the 3-4 days straight. I know 110 is inefficient but since the juice is free I don’t much care. But since the charging process for every kWh takes 4-5 times longer than doing it at home on 240 it would put that much more running time (wear) on pumps and fans. IF they even run ever on a trickle charge... Which I doubt since the car is quiet as a mouse when on 110.

Bo

In regard to fans and cooling pumps, these tend to have more wear at high speeds than running longer. I think. So you might be in the positive on that, but in any case, that's not an issue anyone has warned against.

 

[vickh]

Good rule of thumb - if you're not supercharging every time you plug in and not charging to 100% you're not harming the battery. Set the max charge to 90% (or 80, or 70, or whatever makes you feel warm inside and works for your driving situation), plug in when you can, and stop worrying about the battery.

isn't the supercharging every time you plug in issue still controversial about battery health? 100% for SR also ok b/c of battery lock

 

[Runt8]

isn't the supercharging every time you plug in issue still controversial about battery health? 100% for SR also ok b/c of battery lock

Tesla will limit your supercharging speed to protect the battery if you supercharge too often, so I’d say it’s pretty much confirmed.

If the SR is a software locked SR+ then I would think it would be ok to charge to 100% but just a guess on my part.

 

[vickh]

Tesla will limit your supercharging speed to protect the battery if you supercharge too often, so I’d say it’s pretty much confirmed.

If the SR is a software locked SR+ then I would think it would be ok to charge to 100% but just a guess on my part.

too often=weekly ok?

 

[Runt8]

too often=weekly ok?

https://electrek.co/2017/05/07/tesla-limits-supercharging-speed-number-charges/