TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker and becoming a Supporting Member. For more info: Support TMC
  1. TMC is currently READ ONLY.
    Click here for more info.

#1146 DMC Motor Fan Problem?

Discussion in 'Roadster 2008-2012' started by 7racer, Jul 31, 2013.

Tags:
  1. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

    Joined:
    May 23, 2008
    Messages:
    9,151
    Location:
    Winchester, UK
    Can anyone please answer the question about what AWG these wires are? (I don't have the car here to look.)
     
  2. PV-EV

    PV-EV Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2011
    Messages:
    416
    Location:
    Alaska
    2mm
     
  3. ML Auto

    ML Auto Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    709
    Location:
    SW Florida
    Thats 12 AWG in case you don't want to look it up.
     
  4. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

    Joined:
    May 23, 2008
    Messages:
    9,151
    Location:
    Winchester, UK
    Hmm, the plugs are only sold as 14-16 AWG or 18-22 AWG versions.
     
  5. PV-EV

    PV-EV Member

    Joined:
    Jun 3, 2011
    Messages:
    416
    Location:
    Alaska
    Metric wire sizes are cross sectional square mm, so while #12AWG has a diameter of 2mm it is #14AWG that has a cross sectional area of 2mm. The proper answer is #14AWG
     
  6. ML Auto

    ML Auto Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    709
    Location:
    SW Florida
    I stand corrected...

    So Tesla put a 19A blower (original dual fan setup) on a 15A rated 14 AWG wire and connector? And they still refuse to admit they have problem?
     
  7. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

    Joined:
    May 23, 2008
    Messages:
    9,151
    Location:
    Winchester, UK
    #107 dpeilow, Aug 25, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2018
    Not only that but the new single motor fan can pull up to 27 Amps according to the data sheet, which with the possibility of a bad connection sending all the current through one pair of pins, it's no wonder they can burn out.

    For any other manufacturer this would be a recall.

    It's such a well known issue that Gruber offers a fix for it. Tesla should be doing this. Instead they are capitalising by trying to charge 10k USD for a new PEM or (I was told) 1700 GBP for a new CIC board.

    Tesla Roadster PEM Engineering Flaw Resolution

    [​IMG]
     
  8. Logticom

    Logticom 2010 Roadster Sport | 2015 Model S 85D

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2018
    Messages:
    172
    Location:
    Zwolle The Netherlands
    Hereby my experience so far with the "1146 DMC Motor Fan Problem":

    The error started about a month ago.
    But everything kept working fine.
    Including temp's.
    But a couple of weeks later the rear blower stopped working.
    Temp of PEM went up quickly while driving and the first time for me in yellow.
    Did some research here on TMC while I was on vacation.
    And after my vacation I started taking a look at the PEM fan.
    I found out that my trunk was wet and that there was leaking water from my trunk on the PEM fan:

    upload_2019-8-21_21-5-48.png


    After taking PEM fan of and cleaning the PEM fan and the 2 connectors the fan started working again.
    PEM fan is working again, but still 1146 errors.
    I ordered the molex connector for on the PEM side.
    And I ordered a new PEM fan.
    I will start with placing a new PEM connector.
    And if I still get orrors I will also replace the PEM fan.
    To be continued...

    Does anyone have the part nr for thes connecters:
    (the 2 connectors on the PEM fan side?)

    upload_2019-8-21_21-10-51.png
     

    Attached Files:

    • Informative x 1
  9. Logticom

    Logticom 2010 Roadster Sport | 2015 Model S 85D

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2018
    Messages:
    172
    Location:
    Zwolle The Netherlands
    PS: I liked the lower PEM temps while driving without the snowdam.
    But I didn't like all the dirt and moisture getting under the back and in the PEM fan.
    So I "upgraded" my snowdam like other TMC members did and put it back under the car:

    upload_2019-8-21_21-17-58.png
     
    • Like x 1
  10. X.l.r.8

    X.l.r.8 Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,422
    Location:
    Toronto/Miami
    Speaking as someone who still has the dual fans and the snow dam I’m interested in hearing how your modification provides additional cooling. I may have to steal that idea.
     
  11. Logticom

    Logticom 2010 Roadster Sport | 2015 Model S 85D

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2018
    Messages:
    172
    Location:
    Zwolle The Netherlands
    @X.l.r.8 I will let you know. I just installed the "upgraded" snowdam yesterday, so I need a couple days of driving for more info. Gr, marcel
     
  12. thomas.rueesch

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2012
    Messages:
    45

    I wondered, as I have the same messages after been to the SC if this might be a case of proper reconnecting...
    do I need to "unpower" the PEM as written in the DIY PEM cleaning?
    DIY: Roadster 2.5 PEM cleaning - step by step

    I would be glad for a reply. many thanks
    thomas
     
  13. Logticom

    Logticom 2010 Roadster Sport | 2015 Model S 85D

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2018
    Messages:
    172
    Location:
    Zwolle The Netherlands
    I started with step 1 and 2 (of the DIY pem cleaning thread) before unplugging the connector. Not sure if necessary, but I am doing it just in case.
     
  14. X.l.r.8

    X.l.r.8 Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,422
    Location:
    Toronto/Miami
    I pulled the fuse cover off the PEM and while I would not recommend it to anyone I was desperate to see if my charger had plowmen the PEM fuse. There was no power to the PEM but I guess there could have been. I’m assuming disabling the APS stops any way for the Can bus to close the contactors.
     
  15. hcsharp

    hcsharp Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2011
    Messages:
    3,370
    Location:
    Vermont
    Pulling the fuse cover off the PEM disables the APS automatically. Not that I recommend that method of disabling the high voltage...
     
  16. BartJ

    BartJ early member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2014
    Messages:
    534
    Location:
    Belgium
    if you just want to "reseat" the fan connector , no need for unpowering the PEM I believe.
     
  17. Logticom

    Logticom 2010 Roadster Sport | 2015 Model S 85D

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2018
    Messages:
    172
    Location:
    Zwolle The Netherlands
    @X.l.r.8 hereby a respond to your question in #110:

    I did a longer highway drive yesterday with the next temps etc:

    Distance: 60km
    Speed: aprox 110km/hr
    Outside temp: 28C

    Temps after drive:
    Motor: 76C
    PEM: 39C
    Battery: 31C

    Energy: 131Wh/km

    My PEM temp used to be in the low 40s the most of the time while driving on the highway at this speed en with even lower outside temp.
    So it seems like the PEM temp is a couple of C lower than before the "upgrade".
     
  18. scotty2541

    scotty2541 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2014
    Messages:
    195
    Location:
    Arlington, TX
    Excellent post. I just repeated the process with my 2011 2.5

    I am now 16 months since service was supposed to occur (I can't even CALL Tesla anymore. Their phone menu system tell you use their APP )
    I got the 1146 fan error about a week ago, when the road temp was about 37. My PEM showed 44 on start, then rapidly went to 50C, sometimes 54C.... Texas can get pretty warm :)

    I didn't do the full PEM cleaning, as I am not equipped to remove it. Just blew out and vacuumed the ducts repeatedly. Back and forth between 100 PSI, a leaf blower, and a shop vac.

    Question: After cleaning the fans as described here (it was slightly different on mine), on my road test, the VDM showed the road temp was about 28C. When I drive hard, the PEM hits 46C. Then cools off to 41C in about 45-60 seconds... Is this about normal?

    -Scotty
     
  19. X.l.r.8

    X.l.r.8 Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2018
    Messages:
    1,422
    Location:
    Toronto/Miami
    #119 X.l.r.8, Oct 5, 2019
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2019
    Yes, the thermistor is on the cooling plate. When you drive hard the IGBT’s will produce a lot of heat, you are measuring the heat transference to the plate and it should, if there is adequate air flow, cool fairly quickly, without good air circulation and debris accumulation the heat will stay in the plates and take a long time, If ever to cool down.

    7F44EA9A-2D31-4C39-B5E7-9F9A09AC1E8D.png
    this is where I believe you are reading temperatures from.
     
  20. scotty2541

    scotty2541 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2014
    Messages:
    195
    Location:
    Arlington, TX
    Thanks.
    I have not taken apart the PEM. My other question, just for information, is where does the airflow go?
    I assume both duct fans blow IN. Where does the air exhaust? The PEM looks completely sealed from what I can tell.

    I blew into one duct, to see if it came out the other side. It didn't. And both fans blow the same way I assume (I intentionally reversed the two fans when I put it back together, they are not on a common mounting plate like the other posts describe)
     

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.
  • Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


    SUPPORT TMC