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120V to 240V Outlet--Need Help...

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by texex91, Aug 23, 2013.

  1. texex91

    texex91 Banned

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    I have a standard 120v two outlet plug on my garage wall, and I'm trying to figure out if an electrician could convert that box to 240v, or does he need to run all new wires, junction, etc to electric panel?

    Basically if I have the standard outlet and it by itself be converted to 240?
     
  2. richkae

    richkae VIN587

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    If the outlet is the only thing on that circuit then I think you could convert it from a 120V to a 240V outlet of the same amperage ( its either a 15 or 20 amp outlet ).
    If it is a 20 amp outlet with default wire size ( #12 ) then you can convert it to a Nema 6-20 outlet, but you would only have 240V 20 amps, and I don't think Tesla makes a 6-20 adapter anyway.
    If you are lucky and the circuit is wired with #10, you can upgrade it to a 30 amp breaker and use a Nema 10-30 outlet, but that is unlikely.
    If you want to run more amps then you need new ( bigger ) wire back to the panel.

    FlasherZ will correct me if any of this is wrong.
     
  3. FlasherZ

    FlasherZ Sig Model S + Sig Model X + Model 3 Resv

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    Everything richkae said is correct. Even if you did have the ability to convert it to a NEMA 6-20 and build an adapter, it would still charge at only ~10 miles per hour of charge - admittedly better than 3-5, but still limiting.

    I would consult with an electrician for a new circuit.
     
  4. texex91

    texex91 Banned

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    Got it--thks!
     
  5. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Unless the price is exorbitant, I would lean toward a 14-50 outlet if at all possible. It's very convenient, and very commonly used.
     
  6. texex91

    texex91 Banned

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    Great idea makes much more sense no doubt!

    Now I just need to debate in my head getting twin chargers or not (more for faster charges on the road--outside of Superchargers of course).
     
  7. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Firstly, good idea using your signature to solicit input and capture your current thinking!

    Secondly, looking at your signature...
    In case it helps, I would prioritize the options in the following order (note that I've stripped out color preferences):
    And then I would insert Twin chargers as follows:
    My thinking goes something like this:
    1. The first feature that made S interesting to me was range. It remains a defining feature of Tesla brand within the EV market. Get as large a capacity as they offer.
    2. After "maximum capacity" is addressed, the next thing you can do to maximize "drive time between refills" is to speed up your refill rate. Do some napkin calculations of how often you need to charge at 60, 70 or 80 A at whatever "comfort cost ($/hr)" you want. From there, calculate how often you need to do that to "justify" the Twin Chargers to yourself.
    3. I'm a sucker for the pano roof. Not all pano roofs, large ones like the S has.
    4. I prefer leather. Some don't. No matter which side of the fence you are on, generally speaking "premium" and "luxury" vehicle is hard to assert without leather interior.
    5. Keeping up with the joneses on tech, and providing some protection against curb rash on the wheels. I bias this a little high because I don't have it on my vehicle.
    6. When only available as part of the performance package, this had more value IMO. Value in the sense of exclusivity, etc. Nonetheless, I like it a lot.
    7. Love the look of the 21s but from an economics perspective they are hard to justify.

    And an additional note:
    I'd rather be driving an S60 with no options than just about anything non-Tesla on the road. That's also what I tell the service center when I schedule an appointment and ask about loaners.


    Sorry for the OT.
     
  8. texex91

    texex91 Banned

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    Great thoughts/comments!

    Looks like another $2700 to the price :smile:
     
  9. Longhorn92

    Longhorn92 MS VIN #10103 (40 kWh)

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    I would think long and hard before you decide on the HPWC/twin chargers. I think the HPWC and second charger combination is useful only to a very few people. This option only seems useful if:
    1. You drive a lot of miles on a daily basis (more than 200 for an 85 kWh car),
    2. You end up at home at some point in the middle of the day or early evening, and
    3. You will be driving many more miles after you stop at home for an hour or so.

    If all three of the above hit a cord with you, then it might make good sense. Otherwise, just use a NEMA 14-50 at night, and you should be fully charged each morning. For road trips, the extra charger is not too beneficial away from home since there are very few charging locations with >40A power. If you are at a supercharging station, the car doesn't use the onboard chargers at all.
     
  10. texex91

    texex91 Banned

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    Great points to consider...and save some $$.
     
  11. TexasEV

    TexasEV Active Member

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    Just to emphasize what Longhorn92 said, the only times a twin charger would give you a "faster charge on the road" is if you found a level 2 charger at more than 40A or a Tesla HPWC. You could probably count on one hand the number of level 2 chargers >40A in Texas and adjacent states.

    Make sure you have read about how quickly the 21" tires wear out and how expensive they are to replace. I saw you commented earlier about a harsh ride with 21" too-- most people agree the 19" is a more comfortable ride in addition to being more economical.

    Tesla gives you lots of ways to spend money if you really want to-- but it's not necessary to get a great experience.
     
  12. texex91

    texex91 Banned

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    I still just cant believe tires only last 7500 miles. My 911 P Zeros last double that. Don't like look of 19". Still think something cant be right with rims/build or something on S to cause wear in 7500 miles. Bizarre.
     
  13. Puyallup Bill

    Puyallup Bill Member

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    By all means, get the 85 and twin chargers. I can't speak for Texas, but the Canadians have a slew of 90 Amp J1772 stations and there is a move underfoot to do the same in WA. There are gaps in the Supercharger network that need to be filled. Are there any Roadster HPCs in your part of the country? They charge a model S at 70 Amps with the appropriate (and expensive) adapter.

    It is unfortunate that Tesla bundled the HPWC with the twin chargers, as I believe most do not need the HPWC. I expressed my thoughts and reasons to Tesla ownership, and received the following in response:

    Hi William,

    I received your note this morning regarding our new option to bundle the High Power Wall Connector and Twin Charger feature.

    We made this decision in clarify for customers the benefit Twin Charger feature offers, and what it requires. Fortunately, under the circumstance that a customer cannot install the Wall Connector, we will accept a return of the device. This is the only work around we have currently, but I’ll investigate if we can add the Twin Charger into the configuration manually, without addition of the Wall Connector.

    Thanks for sending us the suggestion. If you have any other questions, feel free to contact me.
     
  14. richkae

    richkae VIN587

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    Regarding tires:
    I think Tesla dials in excessive toe to make the car super idiot proof. A wheel alignment may solve that. I intend to check mine soon.
    Consider the 19" alternate wheels.

    Regarding twin chargers:
    Have a 2nd home/family member 150+ miles away and like to be able to go there and back with quick turnaround time?
    Get twin chargers and put the HPWC there.
    Like to drive on your local racetrack? Get the twin chargers and put the HPWC there.
    Have a frequent destination 300-500 miles away and know a good location to host the HPWC at the midpoint?
    Get twin chargers and put the HPWC there.
    Want to frequently drive long distances to places you are sure will not be served by superchargers but someone may put HPWCs on the route?
    Get twin chargers.

    I have twin chargers and no HPWC at home. I never intend to put one at home, if I buy one it will be to put it someplace 200-300 miles from my house.
     
  15. wycolo

    wycolo Active Member

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    eschew the pimp wheels
     
  16. montgom626

    montgom626 Active Member

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    I would love to hear stories from folks who have the HPWC and how it is better than a NEMA 14-50.

    - - - Updated - - -

    When you say more economical ,what do you mean?
     
  17. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

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    He's referring to the tires. 19" tires last longer and are less expensive to replace.

    The advantages of the HPWC are:

    1. Faster charging. This only matters if you use up most of your range during the day and want to go out at night.

    2. Better looks.

    3. Longer cord.

    4. If you want to be a plug sharing person, people will choose the HPWC over the 14-50.

    Disadvantages are:

    1. Higher cost to purchase.

    2. Higher cost to install. ( Maybe a lot higher if the service requires replacement.)
     
  18. FlasherZ

    FlasherZ Sig Model S + Sig Model X + Model 3 Resv

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    All true. I'd add only one:

    5. Permanent outdoor installs are easier / better (although there are some creative outdoor 14-50 solutions)
     
  19. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

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    You're right about that. I solved mine somewhat differently. (post #34)
     
  20. FlasherZ

    FlasherZ Sig Model S + Sig Model X + Model 3 Resv

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    'round these parts, unfortunately, that would guarantee that a rodent would eat through your cable to create the tunnel into my home. :(

    Good if you don't have rodent issues in winter. :)
     

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