12V battery. "Will I ever buy another Tesla? Guess."

[ngng]

@Ostrichsak also says I am wasting my time and $ when I proactively replace my 12V. As I don't want to see warning, and never want the stranded because of the 12V.

Good thing we can take the advice or leave it here from everyone. Don't ever see anyone demanding time from anyone. After all we have to read then type. No one is forcing the typing fingers.[/QUOTE]

...if you're going to go through all the trouble of replacing a battery all the time I'd just hook the damn thing up to a battery tender and keep it topped off

 

[1windy]

then why bother to post that you had already poster

Seinfeld says "spite" LOL

 

[Dukeybootie]

"...if you're going to go through all the trouble of replacing a battery all the time I'd just hook the damn thing up to a battery tender and keep it topped off"

Nobody is replacing the battery "all the time" -- my plan is to do it every 4 years proactively. If I keep the car 8 years, I will have paid ~$500 to replace it once.

Keeping it hooked up to a battery tender might not be a bad idea, but it seems like a lot more hassle, no?

 

[SO16]

My impression from the OP was not merely that the 12V battery threw a message or needs replacing, but more the way Tesla's service has evolved.
That you cannot call for an appointment, speak with anyone without visiting the service center, nor schedule an appointment less than 2 weeks out (sometimes much more from what I hear) is a terrible situation. I've never really used dealerships, do they treat customers that way too?

I've pretty much stopped using the service center. I've bought 3rd party brake parts, IC screen, headlamps - there may be more.
I'm lucky enough to only live less than 20 miles from a service center so if I need a control arm or tie rod end (I have replaced both front wheel bearings too), it's not too big of a deal to go there and pick up or order one in person - since it seems you cannot call them any more. If I had to drive 2+ hours each way to get there just to order a part to keep my car going, I'd have to think hard about considering another Tesla too.

Some have had luck getting the phone number of their local service center. May require a trip there the first time.

 

[outdoors]

@Ostrichsak also says I am wasting my time and $ when I proactively replace my 12V. As I don't want to see warning, and never want the stranded because of the 12V.

Good thing we can take the advice or leave it here from everyone. Don't ever see anyone demanding time from anyone. After all we have to read then type. No one is forcing the typing fingers.

...if you're going to go through all the trouble of replacing a battery all the time I'd just hook the damn thing up to a battery tender and keep it topped off[/QUOTE]


I think the post was directed towards me. I think mine was replaced it at 95k in miles. I feel just great about it. Never got a warning. Will do the same thing at 200k. Spend a lot of time on the road. Being on the side of the road for an hour cost me the price of the battery. That's my math on replacement. Can't put a price on annoyance if it ever happened to me. It does from time to time if you read through these forums. Likely no, but it could. I also feel good that car batteries are recycled. Not like I threw a straw in the ocean for a turtle to eat.

Hooking up a tender is for people that garage cars. No garage loving car here. Likes to be out on the road.

 

[Ostrichsak]

then why bother to post that you had already poster

Maybe you should use the search function, see the lengthy conversation that occurred with several forum users across several threads and dozens of posts then ask yourself if you'd like to copy/paste every single post and edit for redundancy among other things and then craft it all so it makes sense for someone reading for the first time including other user's posts that inspired each post as well as other user's posts in response to said post.

While I'm at it, want me to just copy/paste ever post ever in this forum into this thread? Should save you from having to click that little "search" button and type in whatever topic you're interested in. Sounds like a real time saver to me. /sarcasm

I posted to let anyone who actually cared know that the topic is under debate and lots of information existed for anyone who cared enough to invest the time to learn more. Some people still enjoy learning to fish rather than being spoon fed.

 

[SO16]

I received the warning one time in almost 4 years and 51k miles. And it was just a warning which still allowed the car to run just fine. I went 2 weeks before changing it but probably could have gone longer. The ranger came to my house. It seems a person is much more likely to be stuck on the side of the road due to a flat than the 12v battery completely dying on you.

Heck, with the OP’s concern of the road trip, just stop at a service center sometime along the way. Would probably be near at least one at some point. Could probably take care of it right then. Especially if you say you’re on a road trip and a long way from home. Or have the ranger show up at your location while on vacation. It doesn’t have to be at home or at work.

Yes it’s unfortunate that call direct isn’t an easy option anymore (unless if you maybe can get your local service center number). But I’d still take tesla service with the ability for them to come to you, any day over other service. Even with the “no call” issue.

 

[Ostrichsak]

I think the post was directed towards me. I think mine was replaced it at 95k in miles. I feel just great about it. Never got a warning. Will do the same thing at 200k. Spend a lot of time on the road. Being on the side of the road for an hour cost me the price of the battery. That's my math on replacement. Can't put a price on annoyance if it ever happened to me. It does from time to time if you read through these forums. Likely no, but it could. I also feel good that car batteries are recycled. Not like I threw a straw in the ocean for a turtle to eat.

Hooking up a tender is for people that garage cars. No garage loving car here. Likes to be out on the road.

Where do you draw the line in throwing out good batteries and wasting money then? Why do it every two years when you could do it annually? Better yet, why not monthly? Why do it every 100k miles when you can do it every 10k? ...You know.. just to be extra special safe.

You decided at some point where this "magical number" is so help me understand the logic that decides when throwing perfectly good items out makes the most sense and then confronting anyone who would offer up conventional wisdom and actual data in opposition to your emotions and feelings.

 

[Dukeybootie]

I received the warning one time in almost 4 years and 51k miles. And it was just a warning which still allowed the car to run just fine. I went 2 weeks before changing it but probably could have gone longer. The ranger came to my house. It seems a person is much more likely to be stuck on the side of the road due to a flat than the 12v battery completely dying on you.

Heck, with the OP’s concern of the road trip, just stop at a service center sometime along the way. Would probably be near at least one at some point. Could probably take care of it right then. Especially if you say you’re on a road trip and a long way from home.

This is the ideal scenario. Fortunately for many, this is exactly how it plays out. But I've been on these forums since 2015 and have seen enough instances where one or more of the following occurs:

-the 12V dies unexpectedly and it is an inconvenience
-the 12V dies unexpectedly and it is an emergency
-the 12V warning appears but there are issues with service center availability
-the 12V warning appears but there are issues with OEM 12V replacement supply
-multiple 12V battery replacements are needed for whatever reason

If I paid $550 instead of $250 for my "snake oil" battery but never had to deal with any of these problems over the course of 8 years, I think I am pretty happy with that outcome. So far so good at 4.5 years and 109,000 miles.

So @Ostrichsak please tell me me how my emotions and feelings figure into that equation. Congrats for being on your 5th Tesla but some of us want to keep just the one running smoothly for a long time.

 

[Uncle Paul]

If I got the warning, and was about to go on a long trip, I would text Tesla to see if they could send out a ranger or get a quick appointment for replacement. If not, I would swing by a service center and as if they could replace it on the spot before going on the trip.

I had one replaced on my earlier X. They did it while I waited. Had a big pile of them.

 

[docbrown]

With all the talk of the battery lasting weeks or months after getting the warning, I figure I'll throw my experience out there. I got the 12v battery warning on my 1 year old car. First mobile appointment was 1 week out. Then they had to push it out another week because they couldn't get the battery. The car died the day before the appointment, so 1 day short of 2 weeks. Luckily it died in my garage, so it wasn't too much of a hassle, and the ranger showed up the next day and got it going with a new 12v.

Anyway no way I'd start on a road trip, or even a day trip far from home, with that warning happening.

 

[Ostrichsak]

This is the ideal scenario. Fortunately for many, this is exactly how it plays out. But I've been on these forums since 2015 and have seen enough instances where one or more of the following occurs:

-the 12V dies unexpectedly and it is an inconvenience
-the 12V dies unexpectedly and it is an emergency
-the 12V warning appears but there are issues with service center availability
-the 12V warning appears but there are issues with OEM 12V replacement supply
-multiple 12V battery replacements are needed for whatever reason

If I paid $550 instead of $250 for my "snake oil" battery but never had to deal with any of these problems over the course of 8 years, I think I am pretty happy with that outcome. So far so good at 4.5 years and 109,000 miles.

So @Ostrichsak please tell me me how my emotions and feelings figure into that equation. Congrats for being on your 5th Tesla but some of us want to keep just the one running smoothly for a long time.

It's emotion because you have ZERO data to back up that it will last over 2x longer to justify the price tag. The warranty isn't for the 8 years you mentioned so how are you getting facts & logic from anything you just said. It's pure fantasy and good hopes.

This is the exact BS I'm talking about being snake oil. If the battery lasted 8-10 years and the company put an 8-10 year warranty on it to offset the price difference I wouldn't have anything to say because the company would back up their claims with a solid warranty if they were so sure of performance. They're not so they don't. It's that simple.

Your battery has lasted 4.5 years which I've also seen (first-hand) several standard Tesla OEM batteries last. So far you've paid for.... what?

 

[r1200gs4ok]

Maybe you should use the search function, see the lengthy conversation that occurred with several forum users across several threads and dozens of posts then ask yourself if you'd like to copy/paste every single post and edit for redundancy among other things and then craft it all so it makes sense for someone reading for the first time including other user's posts that inspired each post as well as other user's posts in response to said post.

While I'm at it, want me to just copy/paste ever post ever in this forum into this thread? Should save you from having to click that little "search" button and type in whatever topic you're interested in. Sounds like a real time saver to me. /sarcasm

I posted to let anyone who actually cared know that the topic is under debate and lots of information existed for anyone who cared enough to invest the time to learn more. Some people still enjoy learning to fish rather than being spoon fed.

I am not interested in the post....just curious as to why you are so snotty not only in the original "I refuse to" but yo my response as to why you bothered to respond at at....all YOU had to do was list the link...instead you were rude and not very helpful to OP....

Oh, while I am at it, I really dont care what you do or dont do

 

[ngng]

"...if you're going to go through all the trouble of replacing a battery all the time I'd just hook the damn thing up to a battery tender and keep it topped off"

Nobody is replacing the battery "all the time" -- my plan is to do it every 4 years proactively. If I keep the car 8 years, I will have paid ~$500 to replace it once.

Keeping it hooked up to a battery tender might not be a bad idea, but it seems like a lot more hassle, no?

oh, I didn't have context for your timeline. 4 years isn't unreasonable. to be fair you can get a gauge on your 12v battery with a DMM. that should tell you if you need to replace or not. from my understanding the AGM batteries tesla uses are dying because they are being discharged too low and also suffering from sulfating. people who drive more are experiencing less battery failures.

maybe i am over simplifying, but if you keep the 12v charged, you will not suffer these issues. to be safe, you can desulfate the batteries every now and then with a good charger (but the jury is still out whether this works or not, though I have recovered previously "flat" batteries with the method)

i don't think throwing a battery on a charger every month is any effort at all, especially if you already have a pigtail on it. it's not like you don't plug your car in to charge anyways

 

[Dukeybootie]

oh, I didn't have context for your timeline. 4 years isn't unreasonable. to be fair you can get a gauge on your 12v battery with a DMM. that should tell you if you need to replace or not. from my understanding the AGM batteries tesla uses are dying because they are being discharged too low and also suffering from sulfating. people who drive more are experiencing less battery failures.

maybe i am over simplifying, but if you keep the 12v charged, you will not suffer these issues. to be safe, you can desulfate the batteries every now and then with a good charger (but the jury is still out whether this works or not, though I have recovered previously "flat" batteries with the method)

i don't think throwing a battery on a charger every month is any effort at all, especially if you already have a pigtail on it. it's not like you don't plug your car in to charge anyways

Agree with your points. I drive 100 miles daily which likely staved off any premature failure on my original 12V. But as previously discussed, I believe in preventive measures and after getting 4 years / 100k miles out of the OEM 12V, it seemed like a good time to replace it.

This sounds like good practice for everyone to do regardless of individual situation. I do this for our Odyssey once every 2-3 months with a battery tender. Do you have a list of the exact equipment needed and a how-to guide for the Model S?

My particular hangup is that I have a classic nosecone model, in which I believe it is tougher to access or charge the 12V than the refresh models (but I'm not exactly sure).

 

[ngng]

Agree with your points. I drive 100 miles daily which likely staved off any premature failure on my original 12V. But as previously discussed, I believe in preventive measures and after getting 4 years / 100k miles out of the OEM 12V, it seemed like a good time to replace it.

This sounds like good practice for everyone to do regardless of individual situation. I do this for our Odyssey once every 2-3 months with a battery tender. Do you have a list of the exact equipment needed and a how-to guide for the Model S?

My particular hangup is that I have a classic nosecone model, in which I believe it is tougher to access or charge the 12V than the refresh models (but I'm not exactly sure).

I don't have a tesla, so no guides but the battery removal DIYs are a good start. I would grab this charger, but consider a larger one if you have vehicles with larger batteries (I bought the larger charger to charge a 4 battery bank):
https://smile.amazon.com/CTEK-40-206-5-0-12-Battery-Charger/dp/B00CD44RQO/

Hook the pigtail up, find a spot you can hide the end, then put everything away, and call it a day. If you don't want the pigtail in the frunk, buy a pigtail extension and run it to the nose cone area.

 

[Dukeybootie]

It's emotion because you have ZERO data to back up that it will last over 2x longer to justify the price tag. The warranty isn't for the 8 years you mentioned so how are you getting facts & logic from anything you just said. It's pure fantasy and good hopes.

This is the exact BS I'm talking about being snake oil. If the battery lasted 8-10 years and the company put an 8-10 year warranty on it to offset the price difference I wouldn't have anything to say because the company would back up their claims with a solid warranty if they were so sure of performance. They're not so they don't. It's that simple.

Your battery has lasted 4.5 years which I've also seen (first-hand) several standard Tesla OEM batteries last. So far you've paid for.... what?

Standard Tesla OEM batteries might last a few months. Or 4.5 years. What's your point? We've seen results that are all over the place here on TMC. My takeaway from all that is the OEM 12V in this application is not consistently reliable and heavily dependent on driving pattern/usage.

Sure, I have ZERO data to back up that it will last 2x longer because they haven't been in existence in this application for that long. I'm looking to get at least 4 years out of the Ohmmu and I am confident enough in LiFePO4 technology that I am willing to give it a try. Guess what, they have a 4 year warranty. Good enough for me. And in many other applications, LiFePO4 has been demonstrated to be superior in many critical categories:

The Complete Guide to Lithium vs Lead Acid Batteries - Power Sonic

There is plenty of data out there to support LiFePO4. I believe all that data over your ranting. Worst case scenario, I paid an extra $300 for this experiment. Heaven forbid. So far so good -- that is still a data point whether you like it or not.

Lastly, I asked you before, what is the warranty on a replacement 12V battery from Tesla? You never answered me. Is it at least 4 years like the Ohmmu?

For all the rest of you out there reading this, do whatever you want -- it's your money. I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything.

 

[Mhoepfin]

Pro tips for connecting with someone at the SC -
1. Just reply to the text messages about your appointment and they will reply back.
2. When you call, choose the option that you want to speak to someone about a car already in service and you’ll be connected to the service desk and they are happy to talk about whatever it is.

Also if you need an earlier appt for some reason just tell them and they will usually work you in.

 

[outdoors]

For all the rest of you out there reading this, do whatever you want -- it's your money. I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything.

If the BMS fails on the Ohmmu in significant cold could you be in a worse situation than a just sticking with the normal battery? Does it throw a code or anything? I guess what I am saying is how do you know if the BMS is working until it isn't. So would a non BMS'ed Ohmmu crap out if it isn't? Only reason I didn't go this route was cold and my concern around that.

I know you're not trying to convince. That's why I am asking. I am also one to try new and different things. Love snake oil

 

[Ostrichsak]

I am not interested in the post....just curious as to why you are so snotty not only in the original "I refuse to" but yo my response as to why you bothered to respond at at....all YOU had to do was list the link...instead you were rude and not very helpful to OP....

Oh, while I am at it, I really dont care what you do or dont do

That's where you're wrong. I didn't HAVE to do anything. The fact that you can't be bothered to read based on this post just confirms my decision.