19" vs 21" Wheels Pros and Cons

[Larry Chanin]

Did they both have the air suspension?

Hi William,

Yes, and we experimented with the manual settings and the performance was always more comfortable.

The only other known variable was we drove faster with the performance.

One theory is that the two suspensions were simply tuned differently. One person suggested different tire pressures. With only two cars to sample its impossible to arrive at any conclusive explanations.

Larry

 

[brianman]

My gut is that either (a) speed distracts and/or actually does smooth out the ride ("skimming the surface") or (b) there was a tuning difference (likely unintentional).

A conspiracy theorist might suggest that (b) was done on purpose to boost upsells to Perf, which is what I was hinting at regarding the "whisper."

To Larry's question: she looks happy; which means you win regardless.

 

[afilm_guy]

Hi William,

Yes, and we experimented with the manual settings and the performance was always more comfortable.

The only other known variable was we drove faster with the performance.

One theory is that the two suspensions were simply tuned differently. One person suggested different tire pressures. With only two cars to sample its impossible to arrive at any conclusive explanations.

Larry

Hello Larry.
I just wanted to confirm at the Los Angeles event.
I was able to make the same observations
on how the tires situation behaved.
And felt it from a driver point of view in both cases.

The expected compliance of the 19 inch tire combination.
Did not deliver a smoother ride on city streets.
The speed bumps gave me an indication
it might be suspension shock tuning.
But the car was more awkward over speedbumps as well.
With the 19 inch tire combination.

Doug

 

[Larry Chanin]

(b) there was a tuning difference (likely unintentional).

This is my leading theory. Tesla didn't have a lot of time to prepare for the Fremont event. They even had to borrow Elon's personal car to come up with enough test drive vehicles. It's quite possible they simply didn't have enough time to completely tune each vehicle to the same degree.

Larry

 

[Larry Chanin]

I'm getting the performance version with air suspension, but I was planning on getting the 19" rims for the smoother ride. Do you think 21" rims would give me a smoother ride?

Hi William,

The only thing that I can state unambiguously is that for these particular two cars that I was in the performance car absolutely without a doubt had a more comfortable ride. This was the judgement of everyone in the cars.

As Tesla continues production and tunes suspensions it is quite possible the standard models will have a more comfortable ride.

The good news is that we now know that the performance tires are capable of providing a very comfortable ride, even over bumpy roads. Whether it will ultimately be better than the standards I can't say.

Larry

 

[brianman]

Larry - If you hadn't ridden in the 19" at all, the 21" was the only available option, and you were to make a decision solely based on the test drive... Was the experience "confirmed, no complaints" w/r/t smoothness of the 21" or are there echoes of the "a car with 21s will be bumpier and the Model S, while doing ok, can't 'break the rules' to solve that" concern.

I guess what I mean is: Ignoring the variance between the 19 and the 21, was the 21 objectively as good as (or better) than other cars you've ridden in (with smaller wheels) that you would characterize as very smooth.

 

[Larry Chanin]

Larry - If you hadn't ridden in the 19" at all, the 21" was the only available option, and you were to make a decision solely based on the test drive... Was the experience "confirmed, no complaints" w/r/t smoothness of the 21" or are there echoes of the "a car with 21s will be bumpier and the Model S, while doing ok, can't 'break the rules' to solve that" concern.

I guess what I mean is: Ignoring the variance between the 19 and the 21, was the 21 objectively as good as (or better) than other cars you've ridden in (with smaller wheels) that you would characterize as very smooth.

Hi Brian,

I don't spend much time in luxury cars, :redface: but the performance model just glided over the bumps! We were all shocked! We could barely feel them, mostly we heard the tire noise. I no longer have any qualms about getting the performance tires other than the decreased life expectancy versus all season tires.

Of course I believe it was the automatic air suspension that compensated for the tires. So folks interested in comfort shouldn't draw any unwarranted assumptions that they can get by with the performance tires without the air suspension option.

Larry

 

[Doug_G]

I was told the suspension on the Performance will be a little stiffer than what we drove at Fremont...

 

[brianman]

I was told the suspension on the Performance will be a little stiffer than what we drove at Fremont...

Did you get the vibe that it's factory-configurable via software?

More specifically, I get the (optimistic) impression that the stiffer ride is a configuration choice* in the software rather than a physical characteristics difference between the test drive vehicles and customer vehicles.

* Like the "Sport" wheel response and the Standard/Low regen option.

 

[Doug_G]

Did you get the vibe that it's factory-configurable via software?

More specifically, I get the (optimistic) impression that the stiffer ride is a configuration choice* in the software rather than a physical characteristics difference between the test drive vehicles and customer vehicles.

* Like the "Sport" wheel response and the Standard/Low regen option.

I suppose the air suspension could have some kind of user adjustment, but only within certain limits.

 

[brianman]

I suppose the air suspension could have some kind of user adjustment, but only within certain limits.

Granted. I'm just wondering if there's the possibility (via software only) to make "ride comfort" a non-sacrifice in the decision to choose 21" over 19".

 

[KBF]

I'm wondering if anyone would be able to make a pros & cons list for the 19" vs. 21" in a single post? There are 8 pages (of slightly varying opinions) and I'm still trying to figure out what to do. I was planning on "downgrading" to the aeros, but since that may not be an option for me I'm tempted to stick with the 21's. I will need winter tires regardless, but I'm fine with getting a second set of rims for that (and I'd better not get caught in an unseasonal blizzard if I choose 21's). Thanks!

 

[100thMonkey]

my limited experience with high performance wheels has lead me to the conclusion that larger wheels give a harsher ride because of the shorter and stiffer tire sidewall. After reading through this thread it sounds like the S with the air suspension may be an exception. Even so, I really enjoy comfort over the big wheel look and performance and wonder if I'd be happier skipping the air suspension, selling off the standard 19 inch wheels and going with a nice looking aftermarket wheel and good tires (a 16 or 18 inch version of the 21's would sure look nice). We may be odd birds for it, but our attraction to the S is not about it's high speed performance and curve handling, mostly it's about it's styling, it's range and DC fast charging compatability and the fact that it could meet all our needs without having to resort to our gas car. I champion low maintenance and long life, a simpler suspension system and longer lasting tires is appealing to me, the lower purchase price would be a bonus. I wish more "normal" size wheels were an option out of the shoot. That said, I'm at the beginning of this process, everything may change, particularly if we get to do a test drive.

 

[MikeK]

Every Tesla person I spoke to in Fremont said that the 19" is supposed to provide a smoother, more comfortable ride. So, it's interesting that the subjective experience was the opposite. I hope some other folks at upcoming Get Amped events might be able to try the comparison as well. I will most likely get the 19 because I'd rather not spend the $3500 on wheels, and I would also rather have a longer interval between trips to the tire shop. I do really like the look of the 21" rims, though.

 

[dsm363]

I'm wondering if anyone would be able to make a pros & cons list for the 19" vs. 21" in a single post? There are 8 pages (of slightly varying opinions) and I'm still trying to figure out what to do. I was planning on "downgrading" to the aeros, but since that may not be an option for me I'm tempted to stick with the 21's. I will need winter tires regardless, but I'm fine with getting a second set of rims for that (and I'd better not get caught in an unseasonal blizzard if I choose 21's). Thanks!

My parents are getting a Sig Model S as well and since you already pay for the 21" rims, they are going to keep them and get a winter set to see how they like them. You can always take delivery of the 21" rims and your winter set and see how you like the ride. If you don't, can order another set of 19" rims with all season tires for the spring-fall then try and sell the 21" rims although that would be a hassle.

Main advantages of 19" wheels from what I've read are:
better ride
more tires to choose from (all season, winter tires, performance tires..etc)
longer tread life typically with all seasons vs. performance tires

cons:
really aren't any I'd say other than some might not like the look as well as the 21" rims

 

[jkirkebo]

Even so, I really enjoy comfort over the big wheel look and performance and wonder if I'd be happier skipping the air suspension, selling off the standard 19 inch wheels and going with a nice looking aftermarket wheel and good tires (a 16 or 18 inch version of the 21's would sure look nice).

You won't be able to fit 16" wheels over the brake calipers for sure. 18" quite possibly, maybe even 17". 16" - very unlikely.

 

[nhurst]

I would expect quicker steering response (better turn-in) with the 21" wheels. I would also expect the "normal" ride to be what some would call "harsher" but which some of us would prefer and describe as more "precise" or "sportcar like".

 

[jerry33]

Bear in mind that the harder ride quality of lower profile tires and larger wheels vs higher profile tires and smaller wheels assumes that everything else is equal--that is rarely the case. Because the tire brands were different on the two configurations there were likely a number of differences, but even if they were the same brand the same results could have happened. I think it's unusual that there was that much of a difference the wrong way, but it's not unheard of.

 

[W8MM]

I recently drove a Bentley Mulsanne with 265/40ZR21 tires. It was the best riding, most comfortable car which I have ever driven. It had an adjustment knob for ride quality marked "Comfort", "Bentley", and "Sport". I believe it had air suspension as standard equipment. I wouldn't worry about 21 inch wheels at all.

 

[Adm]

Did anybody take note/picture of the tire size of the 19 inch version?