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2016 75D - CPO with a major heart-wrenching issue
- Thread starter NetRat
- Start date
DontDoIt
Member
Yeah but that still means I have to drive this car for years, which I really don't want to.
I have a V1 pack. My max power under heated battery and launch mode is ridiculously close to your non-ludicrous power output.
Latest update...
About an hour after my customer service call, my sales rep from California called me (I had thought about calling him, but had lost his contact number and hadn't spoke to him since a few days before my delivery date). He saw the message from the customer service woman and wanted to find out what was going on. I started to explain the uncorking and he told me "the vehicle has been uncorked from a 70 to a 75". I then went onto explain how this had to do with a firmware update and the 0-60 time. He pushed back a little but I went on to tell him about the original ad, the email from Tesla support on the day of delivery, and an account of what happened during my service appointment. He asked "other than that, how are you enjoying the car?", to which I said "I really enjoy it but this was one of the three key features I based my decision on". He then asked for me to email all the proof for the things I explained, and I was able to send it all over in about 5 minutes. Keeping good records and recording accounts of my calls/experiences in this form has really helped. This is a big deal to me, and as such, I am going to be relentless with record keeping and not letting this go.
As for getting a lawyer, we will see. As an individual case, there might not be a lot of appeal, but there are a class of owners affected by this, and that would have much more appeal to lawyers.
I've thought about option 3 as noted above. Many issues there to include another battle at some point to prove the battery is < 70%... and the road to get there would be full of resentment that would most likely ruin my taste for the car all together.
Heading out of town tomorrow for a long weekend and hope to pick this saga back up when I return... actually, I will be in Sacramento, and my brother lives in Sunnyvale. Maybe I should bring all my stuff and walk into the front door of their corporate offices in Fremont! If you don't hear from me in a week's time, send help
About an hour after my customer service call, my sales rep from California called me (I had thought about calling him, but had lost his contact number and hadn't spoke to him since a few days before my delivery date). He saw the message from the customer service woman and wanted to find out what was going on. I started to explain the uncorking and he told me "the vehicle has been uncorked from a 70 to a 75". I then went onto explain how this had to do with a firmware update and the 0-60 time. He pushed back a little but I went on to tell him about the original ad, the email from Tesla support on the day of delivery, and an account of what happened during my service appointment. He asked "other than that, how are you enjoying the car?", to which I said "I really enjoy it but this was one of the three key features I based my decision on". He then asked for me to email all the proof for the things I explained, and I was able to send it all over in about 5 minutes. Keeping good records and recording accounts of my calls/experiences in this form has really helped. This is a big deal to me, and as such, I am going to be relentless with record keeping and not letting this go.
As for getting a lawyer, we will see. As an individual case, there might not be a lot of appeal, but there are a class of owners affected by this, and that would have much more appeal to lawyers.
I've thought about option 3 as noted above. Many issues there to include another battle at some point to prove the battery is < 70%... and the road to get there would be full of resentment that would most likely ruin my taste for the car all together.
Heading out of town tomorrow for a long weekend and hope to pick this saga back up when I return... actually, I will be in Sacramento, and my brother lives in Sunnyvale. Maybe I should bring all my stuff and walk into the front door of their corporate offices in Fremont! If you don't hear from me in a week's time, send help
Here's the latest update a week later. I haven't heard a thing, so I decided to call the California sales rep to ask where this was. He looked something up in his system to see that nothing has been done and said he was going to escalate to his management. I doubt this will result in anything and figure I will need to call again early next week. In the meantime, I found this (quite interesting and "hopeful")"
Tesla faces fresh Norway lawsuit over false advertising
One suit settled and another one seems to be still underway. My case of false advertising is far more clear, cut, and dry than horsepower ratings and semantics.. and the owners won their case; albeit in Norway. I wonder how any US cases involving performance have fared against Tesla.
Tesla faces fresh Norway lawsuit over false advertising
One suit settled and another one seems to be still underway. My case of false advertising is far more clear, cut, and dry than horsepower ratings and semantics.. and the owners won their case; albeit in Norway. I wonder how any US cases involving performance have fared against Tesla.
Newscutter
Member
We are talking about a 1 second 0-60 difference. I mean, you do you-- but I think you're over-valuing that as a feature.
That said: You DO have a case that the car you bought is not capable of the acceleration Tesla advertised.
I haven't followed the hardware changes necessary to enable uncorking-- but best case, it's limited to battery pack internals. In that scenario your path to be made whole is clear: You want Tesla to swap the pack out.
If the uncorking is more involved, then it's a large escalation for an objectively small payoff-- so consider and provide a path for them to compensate you that is reasonable and negotiable. That could be an upgrade to a feature you don't currently have (like AP or FSD, unlimited Supercharging, etc) or a monetary credit towards service/warranty/cash back.
In my experience, outlining and providing a company with a path to mutual satisfaction is a lot more productive than leaving the options open-ended. They're a lot more likely to approve something you've already said you'd be satisfied with than to stab in the dark and hope to make you happy.
Be prepared to negotiate and be realistic. This was likely just a template mistake when the car was listed and not something nefarious -- and given their likely profit margin on the deal, there's a good chance that if you push too hard they'll be best served to just make you go away by taking the car back and wishing you well.
That said: You DO have a case that the car you bought is not capable of the acceleration Tesla advertised.
I haven't followed the hardware changes necessary to enable uncorking-- but best case, it's limited to battery pack internals. In that scenario your path to be made whole is clear: You want Tesla to swap the pack out.
If the uncorking is more involved, then it's a large escalation for an objectively small payoff-- so consider and provide a path for them to compensate you that is reasonable and negotiable. That could be an upgrade to a feature you don't currently have (like AP or FSD, unlimited Supercharging, etc) or a monetary credit towards service/warranty/cash back.
In my experience, outlining and providing a company with a path to mutual satisfaction is a lot more productive than leaving the options open-ended. They're a lot more likely to approve something you've already said you'd be satisfied with than to stab in the dark and hope to make you happy.
Be prepared to negotiate and be realistic. This was likely just a template mistake when the car was listed and not something nefarious -- and given their likely profit margin on the deal, there's a good chance that if you push too hard they'll be best served to just make you go away by taking the car back and wishing you well.
Blitz3RS
Member
OP: That one second matters. My 75D as delivered was corked, and at first was getting a runaround stating (at the mass 800 hotline) they couldn't tell or didn't know what I was talking about when asking to find out if it was uncorkable.
I went into buying the car knowing that there was a siginifcant chance of the car being 5.2ish seconds and not the 4.2 that the July 2017+ 75Ds advertise.
I was pleasantly surprised when I finally got through to my local service center and found someone who knew that the uncorking was half completed and needed one more step to be done.
Bottom line is, it's definitely a different car and I sincerely hope they make you whole. I think they should stick to the classic numbers for advertising (which I think is what they were doing before) but now I've seen S90Ds claiming some high range numbers (290?) which as we all know the "90" batteries are plagued with degradation.
I went into buying the car knowing that there was a siginifcant chance of the car being 5.2ish seconds and not the 4.2 that the July 2017+ 75Ds advertise.
I was pleasantly surprised when I finally got through to my local service center and found someone who knew that the uncorking was half completed and needed one more step to be done.
Bottom line is, it's definitely a different car and I sincerely hope they make you whole. I think they should stick to the classic numbers for advertising (which I think is what they were doing before) but now I've seen S90Ds claiming some high range numbers (290?) which as we all know the "90" batteries are plagued with degradation.
electricar
Member
NetRat should be given the option of giving the car back and getting either his money back or a car that is as described. He would be shown that courtesy if he bought the car on eBay without all the brain damage that he has gone through so far. This is yet another example of Tesla learning how the car business works the hard way at the customer's expense.
I really do appreciate all the feedback, including opinions on the matter. Presenting them with what I realistically want is a good idea, and I am not sure how many people I have to go through to get anywhere with this. The 4.2 seconds IS a big deal for me since it was a primary criteria for choosing the vehicle I purchased... and, as I've been mildly bragging about that feature to my friends before I even got the car.
I do wonder how Norway was able to get their false advertising suit settled, yet I haven't found anything related here in the US. Anyone know of any similar false advertising suits filed against Tesla here in the US? I wonder if each case is just "handled" to avoid any class actions, the subsequent negative press, and stock price decrease.
I continue to research and make phone calls to Tesla people weekly (minimum).
I do wonder how Norway was able to get their false advertising suit settled, yet I haven't found anything related here in the US. Anyone know of any similar false advertising suits filed against Tesla here in the US? I wonder if each case is just "handled" to avoid any class actions, the subsequent negative press, and stock price decrease.
I continue to research and make phone calls to Tesla people weekly (minimum).
Don't feel too bad, I had a hell of a time to get Tesla to take my money to upgrade my 60D (bought new) to 75D and to uncork. It took a lot of back and forth and ultimately it was the service advisor at the local service center who figured it out. It was ridiculous.
I now drive in Chill mode 99.99% of the time....
I now drive in Chill mode 99.99% of the time....
What does the battery being less than 70% have to do with anything? Gradual degradation is specifically excluded from the S&X battery warranty. (So technically your battery capacity could be down to 50% and you still wouldn't have a valid warranty claim.)
I just checked I also have an A revision battery. Mine was manufactured in 5/16. So I guess we are both screwed.
Latest update...
I started pursuing the litigation path by first researching what's already been done in order to establish precedence and to level-set my own expectations. The first stop was the Norway class action as noted above. Next was what I found in Owner Sues Tesla for Model S That Wasn't Ludicrous Enough | News | Car and Driver. That article directly mentions this forum, which lead me to searching, and finding, the original forum post being referenced. From there, I reached out to the poster referenced in the article as the "Model S Owner" to ask some questions about how he handled his case and what I could do with mine. @azdryheat got back to me right away (huge thanks) and helped greatly my thought processes for pursuing litigation.
Next up was a follow-up phone call to my Tesla rep yesterday. For the first time in half-a-dozen calls, he didn't answer and it went to voicemail. Here's the gist of the message I left:
-Reaching out in an attempt to resolve this issue diplomatically
-I would prefer to work with Tesla instead of against
-We last talked almost two weeks ago and it was stated that my issue was going to be escalated to management
-I hope to hear back soon, otherwise I will need to look for alternate methods of escalation
I am feeling quite educated and confident with my case. I can prove, from the get-go, that the uncorking feature was a primary concern when making my purchasing decision, at the day of delivery, and every step since. This isn't a case of me knit-picking to find some legal loophole to go after Tesla with. I am smart, educated, diligent, driven, and unrelenting. If anyone from Tesla pays any attention to these forums, it would be in their best interest escalate and resolve my issue now.
I started pursuing the litigation path by first researching what's already been done in order to establish precedence and to level-set my own expectations. The first stop was the Norway class action as noted above. Next was what I found in Owner Sues Tesla for Model S That Wasn't Ludicrous Enough | News | Car and Driver. That article directly mentions this forum, which lead me to searching, and finding, the original forum post being referenced. From there, I reached out to the poster referenced in the article as the "Model S Owner" to ask some questions about how he handled his case and what I could do with mine. @azdryheat got back to me right away (huge thanks) and helped greatly my thought processes for pursuing litigation.
Next up was a follow-up phone call to my Tesla rep yesterday. For the first time in half-a-dozen calls, he didn't answer and it went to voicemail. Here's the gist of the message I left:
-Reaching out in an attempt to resolve this issue diplomatically
-I would prefer to work with Tesla instead of against
-We last talked almost two weeks ago and it was stated that my issue was going to be escalated to management
-I hope to hear back soon, otherwise I will need to look for alternate methods of escalation
I am feeling quite educated and confident with my case. I can prove, from the get-go, that the uncorking feature was a primary concern when making my purchasing decision, at the day of delivery, and every step since. This isn't a case of me knit-picking to find some legal loophole to go after Tesla with. I am smart, educated, diligent, driven, and unrelenting. If anyone from Tesla pays any attention to these forums, it would be in their best interest escalate and resolve my issue now.
Net-rat,
My 75 was built in 12/2016 and it could not be uncorked so obviously cars built months earlier couldn’t be either. The constant updating/upgrading of these cars after manufacture certainly explains why Tesla resales could have certain features advertised erroneously, but of course that doesn’t mean you have no legal recourse.
The key question here may be damages. I can’t imagine that an uncorked 75 is worth a great deal more than a “regular” 75 in the marketplace. I hope you have researched the amount of damages you have suffered and remember that a court will look to objective evidence — not how much you personally believe the uncorking is worth.
My 75 was built in 12/2016 and it could not be uncorked so obviously cars built months earlier couldn’t be either. The constant updating/upgrading of these cars after manufacture certainly explains why Tesla resales could have certain features advertised erroneously, but of course that doesn’t mean you have no legal recourse.
The key question here may be damages. I can’t imagine that an uncorked 75 is worth a great deal more than a “regular” 75 in the marketplace. I hope you have researched the amount of damages you have suffered and remember that a court will look to objective evidence — not how much you personally believe the uncorking is worth.
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