2016 Model S 90D - Property Damage Claim Post Mortem

[⚡️ELECTROMAN⚡️]

Thanks a lot for your informative write up.I wish I hadn't just acquired a reason to find it interesting:
View attachment 238522
Happened today, I also got rear ended - though not at quite the speed you seem to have been hit; the other car was thrown off the road down an embankment and across a ditch; had to call emergency services for the other driver, he had a bleeding head wound and chest pain after his airbag deployed.
I walked away without any hurt whatsoever.
As for my Tesla: The rear bumper came off completely, the trunk was pushed in about 1 foot. Stil, it left the site of the crash under its own power even if it's no longer street-legal.
The experience is not immediately comparable since my accident was in Europe. Also, I had stopped far enough from the car in front of me that I didn't get any damage in the front from being pushed forward.
I guess this means totaling the car won't be an option. The time frame of about 6 months for repairs is what's most frightening for me at the moment.
wish me luck in getting this resolved

Good luck with everything. At least you're still smiling. I got rear ended in May and then my uncle got rear ended in his Model S last month. Is there something about these cars that make people run into them? The only other time I got rear ended was two years ago on a metered on-ramp in my Lexus.

 

[Kandis]

Would you be willing to share your recommendations with regard to an appraiser and also your independent insurance agent? We don't need the information at the moment, fortunately, but it would be good to have in our file. I found your article hugely informative and glad it was saved and re-sent in July.

 

[ElectronNic]

I was in an accident on May 9th. I was hit but someone who was 100% at fault. $28K in damages including frame damage to my perfect 2016 70D. The 3rd party has Mercury and was carrying low coverage $15K. In CA you can't claim DV from your first party insurance unless you have very specific insurance which I did not. It is 3 months later, my car is still in the Tesla approved body shop whatever that means. Do they approve of repairs taking 3-6 months? The DV estimate is $15K but I haven't received a trade in quote from Tesla on a new Tesla or confirmation that none of these repairs will affect the operation or longevity of the vehicle. All and all this is the stuff nightmares are made of. If you are involved in a crash and the vehicle is still operating, back up and crash again, then maybe do it again, and then maybe one more time for good measure.

 

[Jeeps17]

Thank you OP for your very detailed post, and for fighting for your rights.

Here in Quebec we have a no-fault insurance system (which tends to keep premiums lower but removes some of the flexibility when dealing with claims), but you just made me wonder what would happen should a traveler (especially one from outside Canada) be involved in a collision locally. Time to do some research.

 

[N7RZBEd]

What about, after a wreck, going to Tesla for a trade-in deal?
Trade in the wrecked car - no repairs - and let Tesla work with insurance and repair companies.
Is this even a possibility? [if it sounds crazy, I guess it actually is]

Was Henry David Thoreau was right?
We don't own things, they own us.

Thorough was talking about cats, I believe .

 

[N7RZBEd]

Thorough was talking about cats, I believe .

I really did type Thoreau.

 

[tbaldez]

@zackmilo you might be interested in this post ^^^^^

dvhart, This was great and very helpful.

I just got my Tesla S back from my local Tesla Service Center (they had it for 2 months doing what I thought would be minor repairs). In my case I was not working with an independent body shop but directly with Tesla. The car had a cracked rear wind shield and scraped paint on parts of the rear body and scratches (from shattered glass) on the panoramic roof. I thought the repairs would be quick and easy - not so as the parts required to replace the panoramic roof and roof carrier panels were not easy to come by or install as I learned from Tesla.

I appreciate your post as my next step was to calculate the cost of what I was losing on car payments for a car I was not driving. I am glad that I did not have damage to the extent that you did, however, I learned from your experience and my own that 'easy to maintain' does not translate into 'easy to repair'!

I am still a very happy Tesla owner (I have two 3's on order) but am a bit disappointed that repair is so difficult even for Tesla. Let's hope they improve in this area. I trust, like many of you, that they will! The same brainy team that sends supplies into space for NASA can certainly find efficient ways to repair our beautiful cars!

 

[SurferChick]

Very helpful - I live in fear of a collision with an uninsured driver. Thanks for posting.

 

[jelloslug]

Very helpful - I live in fear of a collision with an uninsured driver. Thanks for posting.

That's why good under and uninsured policies are a must. The minimum liability in my state would hardly cover a deep scratch so making sure that you are completely covered is a must.

 

[dvhart]

I'm so late in responding, apologies. I missed the previous however many notifications I guess.

How about this claim? Liberty Mutual "better car replacement" ?
Better Car Replacement Insurance | Liberty Mutual

The problem with riders like these is the following clause from the above link:
"... when your car is deemed a total loss... "

In order for that to be of any value to you, the car has to be deemed a total loss - and since this is 1st party, that usually excludes both LOU and DV. So for a 100k vehicle wtih a 35k salvage - that's 65k in damages before it's declared a total loss in order for this rider to kick in.

 

[dvhart]

Awesome post dvhart! Did you have the third row seats? How well did the trunk area do?

I did not have the third row seats. The rear took a lot of damage. Here's another photo after the partial tear down:

Also I'm a bit confused by your valuations:
---
dvhart said: ↑
To be declared a total loss, the cost of the repairs must be more than the pre-loss appraisal of the vehicle minus the salvage value. In my case: $94k - $35k = $59k. ...

...Far fewer private buyers would consider the vehicle, and if I were able to sell it, the average diminished value for a Model S with structural damage is $21k.
---
It looks like you're saying the salvage value of the Tesla would be $35k, but the value of the repaired car would only be $21k.

The salvage was estimated at $35k, yes. (Someone else found the insurance auction for it and it sold for $43k). The Diminished Value is how much the LESS the car would be worth. So if it appraised pre-loss for 94k, after repairs it would be worth 94k - 21k = 73k. To be made whole, they would need to make up that 21k to me. So the repair route is "repair_cost + loss_of_value + loss_of_use" and my approach was to show that this is more expensive than just declaring it a total loss and paying for the pre-loss appraisal value plus some minimal loss-of-use and selling the scrap: "94k - $35k"

Does that clear it up?

 

[mengwong]

Assuming one is willing to pay a premium premium, what insurance should one buy to achieve the least-stress outcome in this situation?

 

[dvhart]

thanks for the info, I'm in the diminished value route after having the vehicle repaired.

How did this turn out for you in the end? Assuming it's all said and done by now (which... sadly... isn't a given with these things).

 

[dvhart]

Assuming one is willing to pay a premium premium, what insurance should one buy to achieve the least-stress outcome in this situation?

Undortunately, in a situtation like mine, it didn't matter at all what insurance I had, because the other party was at fault, and was adequately (barely) insured. That said, in the event of it being our own fault, be sure to have sufficient property damage to cover the cost of your car. Also be sure to have sufficient (un/under)insured motorist to cover the replacement cost. Worth considering new-car replacement if deemed a total loss for cars 2 years old or newer. But, the most important thing is to work with an experience and reputable INDEPENDENT insurance agent. Not someone from GEICO or State Farm - someone that will consider your needs and sell you a policy of one of many insurance providers based on your needs.

 

[dvhart]

It's now time for me to lawyer up. As a fellow Portland area resident, we probably used the same body shop and appraiser. What lawyer did you use?

Arg, I'm so sorry I missed all these notifications - so much guilt now :-( I was put in touch with a legal service my employer provides to ask some questions over the phone, but I never got them involved directly - other than to threaten GEICO with, and fortunately I didn't have to follow through with that. I worked with Precision Auto Body in Beaverton. Since it's been 6 months (so sorry), I presume you've resolved this. How did it turn out for you?

 

[dvhart]

Certainly helps to explain why the insurance companies raise our premiums!

I take it from your comment that you feel I should have waited the 6 months for the repair, accepted 30 days of a basic rental car, paid for remaining 150 days out of pocket, accepted the repaired vehicle and the problems that brings, and settled for not being able to sell it without dropping the price by over 20,000? That doesn't seem like a reasonable resolution to me.

 

[dvhart]

Another independent agent here and this thread details why GEICO is perhaps the worst company to ever deal with as a claimant (the third party). They will fight and argue every step of the way. Not just with a Tesla but even with a Honda Civic. We have to intervene constantly with our clients. And they will delay paying subrogation for MONTHS in many cases. There are options you can purchase as 1st party coverage that can help in total losses, especially with new vehicles. Loan gap is one but even better are "new car replacement or better car replacement" options. Theses endorsements are extra. but in the OP case he would not have to fight GEICO at all if his company had totaled the vehicle from the outset and he had new car replacement option. I agree with the other agent that way too many people will file claims on their own policy when not at fault and there can be negative consequences to doing so. However, when dealing with GEICO there are times I will advise clients to file the 1st party claim to avoid having to deal with all the BS from GEICO.

The problem with these new car replacement riders is the 1st party carrier has to deem it a total loss as you say. For Teslas that equation doesn't always work in our favor. In my case, a 94k pre-loss appraisal with a $35k salvage means the threshold to total in repair costs were 94k - 35k = 59k. The repair estimate was "only" $45k. So the rider wouldn't kick in, and since most (all?) first party policies have loss of use contractual limitations and explicitly exclude diminished value - they aren't always as effective as we would like them to be. (and I do have such riders on both my vehicles)

 

[dvhart]

I have my Model S insured with GEICO. They've been pleasant to deal with and the price of the policy is quite good, but I've never had to put in a claim. Should I be looking for a different company?

From my experience and countless others on this forum and those of other owners clubs, yes. Absolutely, yes. You may find it isn't all that much more money to work with another carrier - and for a Tesla... that's a lot of liability.

 

[dvhart]

I guess this means totaling the car won't be an option. The time frame of about 6 months for repairs is what's most frightening for me at the moment.
wish me luck in getting this resolved

So sorry to hear about the accident. How did this work out for you in the end? Curious how much different this may be in Europe.

 

[dvhart]

Would you be willing to share your recommendations with regard to an appraiser and also your independent insurance agent? We don't need the information at the moment, fortunately, but it would be good to have in our file. I found your article hugely informative and glad it was saved and re-sent in July.

So again, I'm crazy late in responding, have been off the forum and missing notifications apparently. If you're still interested, let me know and we can private message or email.