2017 100D On Autotrader

[Rk99]

I just paid 44k for a BMW x6 listed by Sterling Import Motors in Colorado. I now realize they are a SCAM. I’m mind blown my bank funded the money to them like how? I wish i had seen this post from a day ago. I don’t even know what’s going to happen now or what to do but seriously messed up.

I called the police department in Colorado and they have had several fraud alerts reported.

Anyone know what my options are? How can i be liable for a 44k loan that my bank was supposed to do a background check on and didn’t on who’s it going to. I now have no car and 44k active loan.

 

[GreasySideUp]

I’ve found for anyone reading this that calling the number, or asking for their number to ask a few questions will weed out 99% of the scams. Most have a google voice number for texting only. FaceTime or Skype to get a walk around of the vehicle will get the rest. A legitimate seller for a high value item will be eager to show it off in whatever way they can. A scammer will have a dozen excuses on how their phone camera just stopped working, they want to preserve everything in text, they can't hear well etc.

I’m really sorry about the BMW. Work with your bank and let us know how it works out.

 

[MichaelP90DL]

I’ve found for anyone reading this that calling the number, or asking for their number to ask a few questions will weed out 99% of the scams. Most have a google voice number for texting only. FaceTime or Skype to get a walk around of the vehicle will get the rest. A legitimate seller for a high value item will be eager to show it off in whatever way they can. A scammer will have a dozen excuses on how their phone camera just stopped working, they want to preserve everything in text, they can't hear well etc.

Right on! There are always ways. Here's a true story, dating to the mid-1990s.

I ran a business that published a dog magazine and sold working dog equipment. Scammers would call up and use stolen credit card numbers to order lots of merchandise. We dutifully ran the cards and shipped the goods. Of course, not long after, we got chargebacks and angry calls from folks who owned the cards but did not order anything. I happened to have read a book by Sam Walton on how he started Wal-Mart. The famous WM greeter was there for two purposes: 1. To welcome you. 2. To keep folks from walking out the door with unpaid goodies. I decided to adapt his technique to mail and phone orders.

Now this was way before sophisticated credit card security, and the Internet was in its infancy. We learned that attempts to reach scammers who placed orders was impossible. Phone numbers did not work, or went to someone who did not know the person's name who supposedly placed the order. So: 1. After the order was placed, we'd wait an hour then call them back. If the number reached the order-placing person, or associate or family, we thanked them very much and told them when it would be shipped. 2. If the call did not work or reached the wrong person, we'd throw the order away. Fraudulent orders were immediately stopped. Thanks for the idea, Sam.

 

[Rk99]

I’ve found for anyone reading this that calling the number, or asking for their number to ask a few questions will weed out 99% of the scams. Most have a google voice number for texting only. FaceTime or Skype to get a walk around of the vehicle will get the rest. A legitimate seller for a high value item will be eager to show it off in whatever way they can. A scammer will have a dozen excuses on how their phone camera just stopped working, they want to preserve everything in text, they can't hear well etc.

I’m really sorry about the BMW. Work with your bank and let us know how it works out.

Thanks for the reply.

I ran the car through a ton of VIN carfax type services, even coming up as this place my bank paid currently owning the vehicle and the price they are listing it for sale, location matched, etc. I’ve bought quite a few cars before locally as well as out of state and always verify everything to make sure. The guy, calling himself Glenn Wolfe, knew everything in terms of even small specifics about my bank. He just sent a standard purchase order, then the bank took over everything and said they will do a thorough background check and that they will work everything out with them, etc as i told them i was a bit weary of the low price but they said they verify everything. Come to find out, next day they’ve paid him. It’s really mind blowing, i don’t think they did ANY verification and just sent the money. I would have never even imagined anything like this is even possible with being such a huge reputable bank and considering they likely come across tons of fraud they catch but just blindly sent someone that kind of money without any verification.

I called the Colorado PD and they said there has been 1 other report from that address in Feb made for fraud and one in Dec. They had the nerve to list the car as “sold” today on cargurus (but it’s also on many other reputable sites from the same seller, etc).

I know this isn’t Tesla related so my apologies but the same dealer that did this is selling Teslas so hopefully other people see this.

 

[MichaelP90DL]

They did not do their due diligence, as promised. You have a legal case. If the bank won't square it away, call a lawyer. Good luck.

 

[yogi4]

Thanks for the reply.

I ran the car through a ton of VIN carfax type services, even coming up as this place my bank paid currently owning the vehicle and the price they are listing it for sale, location matched, etc. I’ve bought quite a few cars before locally as well as out of state and always verify everything to make sure. The guy, calling himself Glenn Wolfe, knew everything in terms of even small specifics about my bank. He just sent a standard purchase order, then the bank took over everything and said they will do a thorough background check and that they will work everything out with them, etc as i told them i was a bit weary of the low price but they said they verify everything. Come to find out, next day they’ve paid him. It’s really mind blowing, i don’t think they did ANY verification and just sent the money. I would have never even imagined anything like this is even possible with being such a huge reputable bank and considering they likely come across tons of fraud they catch but just blindly sent someone that kind of money without any verification.

I called the Colorado PD and they said there has been 1 other report from that address in Feb made for fraud and one in Dec. They had the nerve to list the car as “sold” today on cargurus (but it’s also on many other reputable sites from the same seller, etc).

I know this isn’t Tesla related so my apologies but the same dealer that did this is selling Teslas so hopefully other people see this.

Did you sign any paperwork authorizing money transfer ? Did you sign any paperwork regarding delivery of the vehicle?

 

[Rk99]

Did you sign any paperwork authorizing money transfer ? Did you sign any paperwork regarding delivery of the vehicle?

Thanks for replying.

I only signed a purchase order made by the dealer which only had the price, etc. Then i sent that back to the dealer and they completed all the paperwork which they sent to my bank (which my bank needed to review/do a background check as they said in order to send them the money). I have no idea how or what checking/veryfication my bank did to blindly send someone that much money. And they sent it within like 24 hours so i doubt they verified anything whatsoever that the dealer sent them.

 

[yogi4]

Thanks for replying.

I only signed a purchase order made by the dealer which only had the price, etc. Then i sent that back to the dealer and they completed all the paperwork which they sent to my bank (which my bank needed to review/do a background check as they said in order to send them the money). I have no idea how or what checking/veryfication my bank did to blindly send someone that much money. And they sent it within like 24 hours so i doubt they verified anything whatsoever that the dealer sent them.

In that case , the bank shouldn't be doing that merely based on purchase order , so you have a strong reason to fight it. Typically the bank can work with the destination bank to stop payment. Please check with your bank and I would also recommend , you let a member of legal team speak with the bank.

 

[Kandiru]

Reminder, Tesla will never sell the 4 year extended warranty if the car was ever registered to a dealer for sale.

 

[Tube Guy]

I reached out and they provided me with pics, a link to the vehicle on their site and the car fax. Apparently it was a corporate vehicle, according to the car fax, which could explain the low mileage. I still don’t understand them posting it for at least $10k under what they could probably get for it. Definitely feels fishy! The website is also newly registered, FWIW.


2017 Tesla Model S 100

Also, here is the body of the email. Can’t find anything out about the guy online either with a quick google search.


Thank you for your e-mail regarding the 2017 Tesla Model S 100D.
We are happy to let you know that the car is still available, for the price of $55,450.
Attached, please find more pictures and the CARFAX Report!
The car is in perfect condition with no accident or any other damages. We want you to be completely satisfied with your online automotive experience from purchase to delivery.
Please understand that El Vochito AutoSales can arrange shipping for you as a value added service only.
We have our own moving trucks we use for our clients's car shipping needs.

Direct link to the requested vehicle is below:

2017 Tesla Model S 100D

Best Regards!

Damian Carpio - Sales Manager
4655 W Washington St,
Indianapolis, IN 46241 - 0851
Phone: (317) 682-0988
Fax: (317) 458-5629
Email: [email protected]
www.elvochitoautos.com

WARNING!!!!! DO NOT BUY FROM THEM UNTIL YOU HAVE SOMEONE LAY EYES ON THE CAR!!! I was going to buy a Porsche 911 from them. Many red flags. Every listing on their site is $10-20K below market. Inventory

I did a google earth street view of the address. It's a little shithole, and the phone number is different then their website and Autotrader ad. They had a Craigslist ad that got pulled too. I called the number on the street sign, and the guy said his brother owned the lot, and laughed when I mentioned Porsches. He said they don't sell that kind of cars there. I think they hijacked the name, threw up a website, and are hitting hard. And dissapearing

I was going to buy a 2007 911 Turbo manual for $54k delivered. With 28k miles. Nobody's that dumb. The pictures and description didn't match VINANALYTiCS.COM build sheet.

 

[Rk99]

Update: i am completely at a loss for words, my bank says i owe 44k and there is nothing they will do even though they are the ones who facilitated the entire transaction and were trading documents back and forth with the place the entire time. I asked them if they even had a title before they funded the money and they said no. I don’t even know what to say.

 

[MichaelP90DL]

Update: i am completely at a loss for words, my bank says i owe 44k and there is nothing they will do even though they are the ones who facilitated the entire transaction and were trading documents back and forth with the place the entire time. I asked them if they even had a title before they funded the money and they said no. I don’t even know what to say.

I know what to say: GET A LAWYER.

 

[COCARFANATIC]

Update: i am completely at a loss for words, my bank says i owe 44k and there is nothing they will do even though they are the ones who facilitated the entire transaction and were trading documents back and forth with the place the entire time. I asked them if they even had a title before they funded the money and they said no. I don’t even know what to say.

Sorry to hear about this massive headache you’re dealing with. Who did the check write the check out to, or did they wire the money?

 

[Rk99]

I know what to say: GET A LAWYER.

Thank you for the reply. I am on that path as i have no other choice it appears.

 

[Rk99]

Sorry to hear about this massive headache you’re dealing with. Who did the check write the check out to, or did they wire the money?

Thanks for the reply.

The bank dealt with them directly, exchanging wiring information between each other, having to verify the title, that the place owns the vehicle, etc. There was even errors on the paperwork they sent back to the bank which were just shown to me today, almost week after the bank funded them.

 

[Kona2019]

Rk99-

I'm so sorry to hear about what happened to you. Out of curiosity, has any headway been made with your bank in getting your money back?

I ask because the exact same thing happened to my husband and I back in Oct 2019. We purchased a 2018 Model S P100D. My husband is super careful and meticulous about large purchases, had several people look it over and did several VIN checks. Everything checked out. We communicated back and forth with the sales rep about 30 times via phone and email. The dealer, in Indiana even said they would pick us up at the airport if we flew in to look at the car. We eventually decided to purchase the vehicle. Days before the vehicle was to be delivered to a Tesla repair shop for inspection (we were told we had 7 days to return the car) we were told the deliver driver had a heart attack in the hotel in San Diego and they were waiting for another driver to be flown out. Days later the new driver contacts me and says he is waiting to drop off a car in Vegas so the car will be delivered the next day. My husband talk with the delivery driver the next morning and everything is set up for me to meet him at the repair shop that afternoon. I wait for hours. Radio silence. All phones to the dealership, sales associate and driver go straight to voicemail.

We immediately call our bank (USAA) to inform them of a scam. We get passed around to several different people with no associate showing any sense of urgency to stop payment or investigate. We foolishly assumed that USAA would have our back having been members for more than 30 years and dealing with another large bank, Citibank. We have hit roadblock after roadblock. Now they are saying that we owe 61k for a vehicle that we do not have. We have contacted the police departments in both the city we live and the city of purchase. We have contacted the fbi several times and filed multiple reports along with BBB. No one seems to be interested or wants to help. It just seems insane that these crooks can get away with doing this with not even a slap on the hand. How many other victims are there?

After coming across this forum, and having more time on my hands from the recent world events I've started digging deeper into research and have found some interesting patterns. I'm not sure if there is a connection between all these phony dealership websites and the same ring of criminals doing the fraud, but I'm hoping to reach out to more bureaus and FBI again so we can hopefully catch whoever is doing this. For instance, from what I can see, this fake dealership websites all belong to existing small businesses without websites. The crooks change just a number or two so it appears legit. Also, many of this sites use the same website developer VEVS. They appear to be based out of Ukraine. Not sure if this is a coincidence, but seems fishy. Especially after another member posted something about EL Vochito dealership also in Indiana, who stated they were with the Russian mob and threatened to kill him.

Have you come across any other people that this has happened to or have any other new information? I feel like we need to band together and help one another out.

Thanks for listening.

KJ

 

[MichaelP90DL]

We foolishly assumed that USAA would have our back having been members for more than 30 years and dealing with another large bank, Citibank. We have hit roadblock after roadblock. Now they are saying that we owe 61k for a vehicle that we do not have.

Is this resolved? How did you do it? Or what are you planning to do now?

 

[Rk99]

Rk99-

I'm so sorry to hear about what happened to you. Out of curiosity, has any headway been made with your bank in getting your money back?

I ask because the exact same thing happened to my husband and I back in Oct 2019. We purchased a 2018 Model S P100D. My husband is super careful and meticulous about large purchases, had several people look it over and did several VIN checks. Everything checked out. We communicated back and forth with the sales rep about 30 times via phone and email. The dealer, in Indiana even said they would pick us up at the airport if we flew in to look at the car. We eventually decided to purchase the vehicle. Days before the vehicle was to be delivered to a Tesla repair shop for inspection (we were told we had 7 days to return the car) we were told the deliver driver had a heart attack in the hotel in San Diego and they were waiting for another driver to be flown out. Days later the new driver contacts me and says he is waiting to drop off a car in Vegas so the car will be delivered the next day. My husband talk with the delivery driver the next morning and everything is set up for me to meet him at the repair shop that afternoon. I wait for hours. Radio silence. All phones to the dealership, sales associate and driver go straight to voicemail.

We immediately call our bank (USAA) to inform them of a scam. We get passed around to several different people with no associate showing any sense of urgency to stop payment or investigate. We foolishly assumed that USAA would have our back having been members for more than 30 years and dealing with another large bank, Citibank. We have hit roadblock after roadblock. Now they are saying that we owe 61k for a vehicle that we do not have. We have contacted the police departments in both the city we live and the city of purchase. We have contacted the fbi several times and filed multiple reports along with BBB. No one seems to be interested or wants to help. It just seems insane that these crooks can get away with doing this with not even a slap on the hand. How many other victims are there?

After coming across this forum, and having more time on my hands from the recent world events I've started digging deeper into research and have found some interesting patterns. I'm not sure if there is a connection between all these phony dealership websites and the same ring of criminals doing the fraud, but I'm hoping to reach out to more bureaus and FBI again so we can hopefully catch whoever is doing this. For instance, from what I can see, this fake dealership websites all belong to existing small businesses without websites. The crooks change just a number or two so it appears legit. Also, many of this sites use the same website developer VEVS. They appear to be based out of Ukraine. Not sure if this is a coincidence, but seems fishy. Especially after another member posted something about EL Vochito dealership also in Indiana, who stated they were with the Russian mob and threatened to kill him.

Have you come across any other people that this has happened to or have any other new information? I feel like we need to band together and help one another out.

Thanks for listening.

KJ

Thanks for replying and very sorry to hear this happened.

Nothing has been resolved yet. The bank seems to show zero urgency in the matter. We had also gone above and beyond to do vin checks (it even showed the vehicle was at the supposed dealer on the vin checks and the vin check even showed the sale price which matched), car being listed on every major website (carfax.com, auto.com, autotrader), etc.

Was your bank the one dealing with the supposed dealer (i.e. having to verify title, ownership, paperwork, etc) and the bank actually sent the money not you?

You can PM if you’d like as well.

 

[Alset4S]

I'd tell the bank they need to figure out how to repocess their car because you will not be making any payments.

 

[yogi4]

Thanks for replying and very sorry to hear this happened.

Nothing has been resolved yet. The bank seems to show zero urgency in the matter. We had also gone above and beyond to do vin checks (it even showed the vehicle was at the supposed dealer on the vin checks and the vin check even showed the sale price which matched), car being listed on every major website (carfax.com, auto.com, autotrader), etc.

Was your bank the one dealing with the supposed dealer (i.e. having to verify title, ownership, paperwork, etc) and the bank actually sent the money not you?

You can PM if you’d like as well.

As previously mentioned by other members; I would seek help of a legal team. I would also seek help of local media or social media to escalate it to the bank's leadership and see if that helps.