2019 Model 3's?

[mattjs33]

I know that Tesla bucks typical convention in that they don't apply VINs "ahead of year" like most other OEMs do. In other words, they wouldn't typically start with the 2019 VINs until late December.

I've seen nothing yet on the EPA sites regarding certification for the 2019 models, but also understanding that these sites are often a few months behind. But per Automotive News, the shutdown due to President Moron has stopped any EPA certifications for the time being. It's widely confirmed that the shutdown is delaying the release of a few notable new products. Understanding however that the Model 3 cert is going to be a pure carryover as it's not been changed since 2018.

But I do wonder, with Tesla building cars "sort of" to order (read: just-in-time), and not carrying a lot of inventory, if the 2019 certification is in fact delayed due to the shutdown, this could present a fair amount of problems.

Anyone with a 2019 car yet?

 

[Chickenlittle]

2019 tesla is just a car manufactured after Jan 1st. Constant change and improvements. They do not retool remake car like other companies. So to answer your question they have been making cars this year

 

[mattjs33]

2019 tesla is just a car manufactured after Jan 1st. Constant change and improvements. They do not retool remake car like other companies. So to answer your question they have been making cars this year

That's horrendously oversimplified. All OEMs have to submit applications for each model year in order to receive the certification, even if nothing has changed from the year prior. Whether Tesla makes constant changes (like all companies do) is irrelevant. They have to certify the 2019 model, and if they don't they can't sell it. And for the record, I've heard of cases of cars being built after the 1st of a year, while retaining VINs of the prior year.

Question still remains, are there US market Model 3's out there with 2019 VINs already? The EPA sites are not updated.

 

[Chickenlittle]

Oh your right tesla has shut down plant. Can’t order one since no new EPA rating

 

[mattjs33]

Oh your right tesla has shut down plant. Can’t order one since no new EPA rating

Oh FFS, where did I say anything like that? GOD FORBID ANYONE ASK A FAIR QUESTION AROUND HERE.

If you don't have any factual knowledge of whether or not there have been any 2019-VIN'ed Model 3's out there yet, then don't answer the question.

Regardless of whatever specialness you want to attribute to Tesla, they still have to follow federal regulations. And the fact is, most other OEMs start releasing their 2019 models in August or so, which means the applications have been put in in May or June or earlier. Since Telsa historically has not released "next year's model" until the last week of December, I'm just wondering about the state of their 2019 application. Government shutdown and all, I'm sure you've heard about it.

Just because Elon is a genius who is surely the savior of our time, does not mean Tesla can sell 2019 cars without an approval certification. That's how rules work, and this shutdown happens to be affecting a few other OEMs who have product they cannot ship at this moment, because the agency who grants these applications is not currently operating.

I don't think my original post is hard to decipher and furthermore I don't think it conveys a tone where it would imply I think Tesla is doomed. So spare me your righteousness.

 

[gaswalla]

Please take the snarky insecure attitude to Reddit - lots of folks who will play with you there

 

[mattjs33]

Please take the snarky insecure attitude to Reddit - lots of folks who will play with you there

Are you talking to me? Or to the guy who took a legitimate question and turned it into "close the factory"?

Tesla fans have got to be the most insecure people on earth, because anytime someone posts anything other than glowing praise for Tesla, whether warranted or factually true, instantly the cries come out how the poster simply must be an oil shill or a Tesla short. It's okay for your favored company to have flaws, and it's okay to acknowledge them.

And it's perfectly okay to give someone an honest answer as to whether the very real government shutdown is affecting Tesla in the exact same way it's been affecting other OEMs (check the trade papers). I'd argue it's not okay to be a smartass to someone who asked this in fairness.

 

[al503]

Anyone with a 2019 car yet?

I purchased my car on 1/10/19. One of the questions I asked my SA was whether it would be a 2018 or a 2019. She said that it would be a 2019 since I purchased it this year. According to the paperwork, the car was built on December 20, 2018 and is titled as a 2018.

Hopefully, I keep the car long enough so the extra 'year' in depreciation isn't a sizeable hit.

 

[mattjs33]

I purchased my car on 1/10/19. One of the questions I asked my SA was whether it would be a 2018 or a 2019. She said that it would be a 2019 since I purchased it this year. According to the paperwork, the car was built on December 20, 2018 and is titled as a 2018.

Thank you for a real answer.

 

[ewoodrick]

The concept that Tesla releases a 2019 model IS the question.
If a manufacturer makes the exact same car for 4 years, are they required to make the filings?

There are generally no differences in a car manufactured in 2017 vs 2019. (they are minor changes, as you suggest all manufacturers do)

A Feb Model 3 has different seats than my April car. That's not a model year differential.

Why would you assume that all Tesla EPA certs aren't"carry overs"? They just update them, as needed/desired during the year

 

[mattjs33]

The concept that Tesla releases a 2019 model IS the question.

It doesn't matter whether Tesla chooses to consider cars V.02 or whatever. The law requires that OEMs designate a Model Year, as the regulations change from year to year. No matter whether Tesla "does things differently" does not exempt them from following the law.

If a manufacturer makes the exact same car for 4 years, are they required to make the filings?

Yes, they are.

There are generally no differences in a car manufactured in 2017 vs 2019. (they are minor changes, as you suggest all manufacturers do)

A Feb Model 3 has different seats than my April car. That's not a model year differential.

Again, see above. It makes no difference what any OEM puts in their cars. But there has to be a Model Year designated, and it has to be coded into the VIN. This is what I'm trying to educate people on. When smart airbags or reverse cameras were mandated for X Model Year, for example, the Model Year makes a big difference.

The US has the most byzantine and complicated regulations of any country on earth, and things change almost every year. In order to prove compliance, the Model Year makes a huge difference. Especially since OEMs self-certify. The NHTSA or the EPA only get involved on the review process, and that's when the final approvals are issued. Without them, no legal sale. Since NHTSA and the EPA are closed for a while now, you can see the problem.

Why would you assume that all Tesla EPA certs aren't"carry overs"? They just update them, as needed/desired during the year

I didn't assume the certs were different. In fact, if you read again you'll note I assumed they are the same. Carryovers require no additional work on the part of the OEM, but someone still needs to rubber-stamp it. It's required by law. And the stampers are closed at the moment.

As I've said above, only a few days ago in Automotive News I read an article that the closures are holding up multiple product releases from multiple other OEMs. And since it's known that Tesla does the Model Year changeover significantly later than any other OEM, I'm just wondering when they got their 2019 applications in, and whether they are being held up by the government shutdown.

So far I've not found evidence of any 2019 Teslas, so I figured I would pose the question to the people that might know soonest.

 

[dsvick]

They started making 2019 VINs almost a month ago, so, although I have no concrete evidence, I'm fairly certain they've sold some of them. I would assume that Tesla, as well as all other manufacturers, does not wait until they are actually producing cars of a specific model year to file whatever paperwork is necessary. I would bet that they took care of whatever was needed to do months ago, certainly before they started producing 2019 VINs. If it was much more than a rubber stamp I'd be very surprised.

 

[mattjs33]

I would assume that Tesla, as well as all other manufacturers, does not wait until they are actually producing cars of a specific model year to file whatever paperwork is necessary.

I would assume not either, but then like I say Tesla's changeover is so late compared to the others, and to the actual end of the year.

They started making 2019 VINs almost a month ago, so, although I have no concrete evidence, I'm fairly certain they've sold some of them.

Where do you find the 2019 VINs?

I have no concrete evidence either way, and like I say the EPA site at least typically has a couple month lag. It's just unusual to not have seen anything yet.

Tesla only had 4000 cars in inventory at the end of the year. They sell about 30K cars a month (including S and X), so a good number of cars sold this month have to have been built in January. I know they did a big batch of EU versions, but the odds are someone here has to have a US MY2019 car by now?

Anyone?

 

[dsvick]

I would assume not either, but then like I say Tesla's changeover is so late compared to the others, and to the actual end of the year.

Why would it matter when the change over is? You can still make the assumption that they would have filed the paperwork with plenty enough time to get it approved.

Where do you find the 2019 VINs?

This doesn't mention specific VINs but they are poling them daily and have seen 2019 VINs from at least as early as 29 Dec.
Model 3 VINs on Twitter

 

[mattjs33]

Fascinating website. Someone is going through a lot of trouble to mine that data and put it on a website like that. I'm not sure what the gain in doing so is, but on a volume car like the Model 3 it's constant work.

I've done a bit of this on a much smaller scale and keeping up with it could be a full time job. It doesn't pay well enough to justify!

Not to belabor the point but there's a difference between registering a VIN and being able to legally sell it. Like you, I would expect they would have been out in front of it. The current situation being what it is, it just got me to thinking.

MY2019 owners might be too small a sample size yet for someone to find this thread, but if anyone is out there I'd like to hear about it.

 

[evJOULE]

I think I get your concern, but I am not sure this is what you are looking for. Just do a google for "Bloomberg Model 3 tracker". Tesla has registered more than 50K VIN's with the NHTSA since the first of the year (2019).

 

[bubbastruts]

I am taking delivery of a 2019 on January 30, it is already in transit with vin ending in 235781 if that helps!

 

[mattjs33]

I am taking delivery of a 2019 on January 30, it is already in transit with vin ending in 235781 if that helps!

Is the 10th digit of the VIN a K? If it is, then you've answered my query positively.

 

[bubbastruts]

Is the 10th digit of the VIN a K? If it is, then you've answered my query positively.

Yes, 10th digit is a K

 

[mattjs33]

Yes, 10th digit is a K

Thanks.

Everyone else, as you were.