2020 Porsche Taycan Turbo Gets EPA Range Rating Of Just 201 Miles

[mswlogo]

Anyone interested on Porsche's own in-car calculations for different driving modes can be seen in Doug Demuro's review of the Taycan Turbo. Although he quickly glosses over it you can see the different range estimates of each mode:

time stamp starts
@ 17:39

Normal: 216 miles
Range: 225 miles
Sport: 211 miles
Sport+: 206 miles

"

"

NOTE: at 7:45 of the video you can see the car is charged to 99%

And your Tesla gets exactly what it shows on the EPA meter?

Not sure if the Porsche is based on EPA miles of capacity, Porsche’s estimate or it varies with past history like the energy graph in a Tesla.

Unless you know, what it displays means nothing.

 

[ralph142]

The only way you're getting 320 Wh on P85 is to drive it like a Prius or to spend your day stuck in traffic.

I have a P3D, and on the longest trip I've taken it without stopping to charge was 200 miles. According to Teslafi my efficiency was 308 W/Mile with an average speed of 67.

I started with 100% charge, and arrived at my house with 11% charge. The average speed was 67mph.

When I bought the car Tesla claimed an EPA range of 310 miles which we now know was made up. Where Tesla averaged down the Long Range Rear Wheel drive, and ranged up the P3D.

Plus EPA range is the result of a method of measuring range that's not applicable to most road trips. It's a good measurement for mixed driving like one would get on a commute that consist of a little bit of highway, and a little bit of city.

If there is a Taycan ever within my price range (under $100K) then I'll look at real world freeway efficiency where the car is doing 5 over the speed limit at a minimum.

I care about more efficiency with wheels/tires that I actually want on the car, and driving at speeds/quickness that I really want to do. Sure I know how to get more efficiency from the P3D. The first would be to stop taking off quickly, and then I'd have to get different shoes. By the time I'm done I'm left with a Dual-Motor Model 3 with 18 inch efficiency tires with creep mode on.

Not to put too fine a point on it, but you're complaining that the epa rating doesn't reflect an all highway trip with aggressive driving and speed up in the seventies? Not a surprise reallly.

 

[whitex]

Its not all or nothing. If you need to slow down a little bit, you let off the accelerator a little and let it regen slightly to recoup only what is needed. If you don't need to slow down, then don't let off the accelerator.

I only regen when I need to slow. Otherwise I'm modulating the vehicle speed as needed.

Agreed. Audi's argument is that not everyone wants to learn (or is able to) control the accelerator with the precision required to maintain speed or coast without hitting regen.

 

[mswlogo]

Its not all or nothing. If you need to slow down a little bit, you let off the accelerator a little and let it regen slightly to recoup only what is needed. If you don't need to slow down, then don't let off the accelerator.

I only regen when I need to slow. Otherwise I'm modulating the vehicle speed as needed.

This whole modulation thing is silly. On the highway I’n on AutoPilot. And I bet most people have AutoPilot on, on the highway and they are modulating squat.

 

[TMThree]

Agreed. Audi's argument is that not everyone wants to learn (or is able to) control the accelerator with the precision required to maintain speed or coast without hitting regen.

That seems silly, everyone is modulating throttle in an ICE car. They aren't flooring it then slamming on the brake!

They are using throttle to pick the speed to cruse at. Only thing regen does is slow down the car when you let off completely. So just don't let off completely and its basically what you have when driving.

 

[whitex]

This whole modulation thing is silly. On the highway I’n on AutoPilot. And I bet most people have AutoPilot on, on the highway and they are modulating squat.

I have no actual data on autopilot usage, but I wouldn't judge it based on your own preferences, or posts on TMC, a fan site. Anecdotally I rarely use Auto Pilot, my wife disabled it in settings after using it for few days, my teenage son doesn't use it when driving out cars either. I was looking at used Model 3 and Model S listings, a decent number of listings has AP hardware but not activated. Not everyone who likes driving Teslas likes to use AP, even if activated.

 

[whitex]

That seems silly, everyone is modulating throttle in an ICE car. They aren't flooring it then slamming on the brake!

They are using throttle to pick the speed to cruse at. Only thing regen does is slow down the car when you let off completely. So just don't let off completely and its basically what you have when driving.

Yes, but when they let off the accelerator the car doesn't start braking.

 

[M3BlueGeorgia]

I have no actual data on autopilot usage, but I wouldn't judge it based on your own preferences, or posts on TMC, a fan site. Anecdotally I rarely use Auto Pilot, my wife disabled it in settings after using it for few days, my teenage son doesn't use it when driving out cars either. I was looking at used Model 3 and Model S listings, a decent number of listings has AP hardware but not activated. Not everyone who likes driving Teslas likes to use AP, even if activated.

Ouch

There are three reasons to use traffic-aware cruise control, which are valid for both ICE and BEV

1) The car does a much better job of maintaining speed with optimum mileage/range

2) Less chance of accidentally getting a ticket because the car has crept up above the speed limit

3) Much less chance of a fender-bender in traffic, because the car is always watching the cars in front of you, whereas you could be looking somewhere else for a second or so at just the wrong time. Using radar, the car is watching the cars in front of the cars in front of you, so it is seeing things you can't see.

 

[whitex]

Ouch

There are three reasons to use traffic-aware cruise control, which are valid for both ICE and BEV

1) The car does a much better job of maintaining speed with optimum mileage/range

2) Less chance of accidentally getting a ticket because the car has crept up above the speed limit

3) Much less chance of a fender-bender in traffic, because the car is always watching the cars in front of you, whereas you could be looking somewhere else for a second or so at just the wrong time. Using radar, the car is watching the cars in front of the cars in front of you, so it is seeing things you can't see.

Agreed on 1 and 2, but not 3. After I showed my wife how to use it, she loved it, until it almost caused an accident, so she asked to disable it. When Tesla offers full indemnification, insurance coverage, and guarantees Tesla loaner (having gone through an accident with a Tesla, this is important, Tesla collision repair is not fast) for repair time for a accidents while on AP, we can talk again to revisit this. Elon claim robo-taxis within a year, so they should have the problem solved and offer the guarantee very soon, right?

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Not to put too fine a point on it, but you're complaining that the epa rating doesn't reflect an all highway trip with aggressive driving and speed up in the seventies? Not a surprise reallly.

complaining? Not all.

Simply trying to convey that it's just one type of measurement, and for people to look at measurements that are more reflective of their use case.

I think people are looking at the EPA numbers and they're shocked the Porsche is so low. Without taking into account how variable range really can be. I also know the EPA numbers aren't nearly as locked down as people might think. That's why Tesla was able to put the 310 mile EPA range on all the LR Model 3 variants despite how much they really varied.

Just tires alone can change things by 10-20%.

 

[M3BlueGeorgia]

complaining? Not all.

Simply trying to convey that it's just one type of measurement, and for people to look at measurements that are more reflective of their use case.

I think people are looking at the EPA numbers and they're shocked the Porsche is so low. Without taking into account how variable range really can be. I also know the EPA numbers aren't nearly as locked down as people might think. That's why Tesla was able to put the 310 mile EPA range on all the LR Model 3 variants despite how much they really varied.

Just tires alone can change things by 10-20%.

Keep in mind that's with the BEST configuration Porsche could put together.

201 is pretty awful for a vehicle costing more than $35K and really embarrassing for a car which will sell for $100K to $150K.

 

[mswlogo]

I have no actual data on autopilot usage, but I wouldn't judge it based on your own preferences, or posts on TMC, a fan site. Anecdotally I rarely use Auto Pilot, my wife disabled it in settings after using it for few days, my teenage son doesn't use it when driving out cars either. I was looking at used Model 3 and Model S listings, a decent number of listings has AP hardware but not activated. Not everyone who likes driving Teslas likes to use AP, even if activated.

Just about all Tesla’s have TACC. I’m sure there is an odd ball that doesn’t use it. And you can’t “disable” TACC but you’re certainly welcome to not use it. You don’t need AutoPilot to enable TACC. It would be kind of silly to “disable” AutoPilot, just don’t turn it on. Whatever floats your boat. Keep on modulating those down hill regens. I suspect most Tesla owners wouldn’t have clue of what that means, even ones that choose to not use a TACC. Does your wife modulate down hills?

 

[darxsys]

Keep in mind that's with the BEST configuration Porsche could put together.

201 is pretty awful for a vehicle costing more than $35K and really embarrassing for a car which will sell for $100K to $150K.

This. Porsche made a beautiful car with top notch build quality (I am sure) and very, very good performance, but this is just embarrassing. Can’t be worth this much money, no way.

 

[ralph142]

complaining? Not all.

Simply trying to convey that it's just one type of measurement, and for people to look at measurements that are more reflective of their use case.

I think people are looking at the EPA numbers and they're shocked the Porsche is so low. Without taking into account how variable range really can be. I also know the EPA numbers aren't nearly as locked down as people might think. That's why Tesla was able to put the 310 mile EPA range on all the LR Model 3 variants despite how much they really varied.

Just tires alone can change things by 10-20%.

agreed, Just another anecdotal data point, over the summer I was averaging ~190 wh/mile on my daily commute, now it’s more like 270-80. 20 miles rt. Lemr, 18 areo. Temp, rain, cold battery, no regen, Defroster, heated seat, and wham.

 

[JohnSnowNW]

Porsche probably ran the numbers and found that Cars & Coffee is generally less than 200 miles round trip for most owners.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

agreed, Just another anecdotal data point, over the summer I was averaging ~190 wh/mile on my daily commute, now it’s more like 270-80. 20 miles rt. Lemr, 18 areo. Temp, rain, cold battery, no regen, Defroster, heated seat, and wham.

Tesla used to have a handy calculator that would give estimated number of miles based on Outside Temp, Tire Size, Speed. It was pretty handy in seeing the difference between the Models.

We really need one of those for all the available EV's on the market to help people cross shop.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Keep in mind that's with the BEST configuration Porsche could put together.

201 is pretty awful for a vehicle costing more than $35K and really embarrassing for a car which will sell for $100K to $150K.

As a value proposition it is terrible, but when has Porsche ever been a value proposition?

Porsche is a car company where the price of the car doubles even if you just add a handful of things. Before I bought my first Tesla I bought a Cayman S, and I absolutely loved that car. But, it was not a value buy despite being one of the cheaper Porsche's and being the best mid-engine car I could afford.

People who buy $150K cars aren't looking for value. They likely have other cars in their stable, and they likely don't care too much about range as long as it doesn't mess with their commute.

I doubt the Taycan will have huge sales, but they'll swim along just fine picking up either ex-Tesla owners or people deadset against Tesla. There are quite a few people that are for various reasons.

I won't jump ship at least not yet because the Taycan is simply too expensive. I also don't want to go down in range because the P3D I have now just barely gives me enough range to do a 200 mile trip to Portland. It actually really doesn't because I can't go as fast as I want or I have to stop to charge. But, for daily commuting to work having a Taycan wouldn't make a difference as my P3D only gives me about 130 miles or so of commuting range (basically 5 days round trip).

 

[CraZ8]

I also think the EPA loop is unrealistic for everyday driving. However it should be good for an apples to apples comparison of the respective ranges of the Taycan vs the Tesla The fact that a duel motor Raven performance model S gets 147 more miles for essentially the same performance ( and what ~70K cheaper) should weigh heavily in anyones decision making

 

[whitex]

Just about all Tesla’s have TACC. I’m sure there is an odd ball that doesn’t use it. And you can’t “disable” TACC but you’re certainly welcome to not use it. You don’t need AutoPilot to enable TACC.

TACC was part of AP and EAP for years. Cars without AP or EAP only got CC (no TA part).

 

[mswlogo]

TACC was part of AP and EAP for years. Cars without AP or EAP only got CC (no TA part).

Fine, CC controls the throttle too. No driver modulating throttle in that case either.