4WD doesn't mean you're invincible

[TezlaCore]

Coming from a country with regular snow, I know how much of a difference winter tires make. I wouldn't go without them in more northern latitudes during winter.

Does TM3 lock the wheels when breaking vs regen breaking? In my experience from ICEs they usually stop the wheel from locking when it starts slipping in snow. It's a very noticeable effect.

 

[Durzel]

There was absolutely no need for him to go down what is probably the steepest road in that area. Plenty of less steep roads parallel to that one or he could have gone a wee bit further along the main road and avoided slopes all together.

Seems he's not the only one who fancied a bit of Ski Sunday though:
https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMedqm7Bk/

It's a shame because it seemed at first that this person had the right idea, but quickly they just reverted to natural instinct and stood on the brakes. You can even see them turning the wheel but of course the car can't actually go in that direction because the wheels are not moving.

I can sympathise with people who end up doing this because it does run counter to logic and instinct to not use the brakes, especially going down a hill, but if you're in an ICE car in a low gear or even a Tesla (with regen) and you aren't accelerating the car will want to stop anyway, or at worst you'll be overdriving in 1st, but that's much more preferable to just sliding along with no control.

Does TM3 lock the wheels when breaking vs regen breaking? In my experience from ICEs they usually stop the wheel from locking when it starts slipping in snow. It's a very noticeable effect.

I'd be interested to know this too, especially since Tesla have removed the ability to customise regen braking on late 2020+ cars.

 

[Peteski]

Coming from a country with regular snow, I know how much of a difference winter tires make. I wouldn't go without them in more northern latitudes during winter.

Does TM3 lock the wheels when breaking vs regen breaking? In my experience from ICEs they usually stop the wheel from locking when it starts slipping in snow. It's a very noticeable effect.

+1000 for winter tyres in those conditions!

I think he might have stood some chance had he got off the brakes and relied on regen braking instead. Still no substitute for winter tyres of course. Crazy to go out otherwise.

 

[pdk42]

I had a BMW 335i Touring (estate) for about 6 years. RWD, big engine, lightweight rear end. It was a nightmare with regular summer tyres in snow or ice. I fitted winter tyres and could go out even in quite deep snow - so long as I had the ground clearance I could keep moving. Tyres make such a huge difference.

 

[idoco]

It's all about the tires!

Had a Z3 with summer stock tires that couldn't get out of my flat driveway with 1" of snow. That same car with snow tires would go past AWD vehicles stuck on hills.

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

In situations like this its usually better to very gently brake so the wheels turn and steer for the deepest snow you can find. But its an interesting question on regen, I guess there wouldn't be as such any once the wheels stopped turning but whether there's enough resistance at really low speed, especially with the 1 ft braking bringing you to a stop, that a lock up could occur without feet on the pedals, I guess it could. You'd need a lot of bottle to press the accelerator in that situation to stop the wheels locking up!

I've seen advice to turn regen down in snow and ice which would seem logical anyway.

 

[Adopado]

Easier said than done for folks but if you’re just sat on the brakes and the car is sliding you’re just a passenger. If he’d let the wheels turn he ought to have had some control over the car.

I don’t think he would’ve picked up any more speed personally. His braking was not doing anything there.

Definitely needs to let the wheels roll. Once rolling I would even give it a tiny bit of power too to help get the car over to the right. The other issue is that ABS (in all cars) is hopeless in really slippery conditions. I've stopped a car successfully using old style "cadence braking" when ABS has given up on the challenge. It may well have been a lost cause on summer tyres on such a spectacularly slippery slope but I've saved a few lost causes in my time and when you are definitely going to crash it's worth trying something! (No handbrake to play with either ... sheesh, modern cars .)

 

[Adopado]

Yes, brakes are the enemy in a situation like this. Stirring and trying to control using the accelerator is what he needed but like you say without experience doing it you'd never think of it.

This is where a misspent youth playing in the snow (even on summer tyres) pays off! So long as there's somewhere with space it's well worth while to get some practice.

 

[Dilly]

Back in the 70’s my dad was a Police driver. He took me out in the snow to practice in his Austin Cambridge whenever there was an opportunity.
I’m so grateful to him for that. Snow doesn’t phase me at all but as others have said, the right tyres make a huge difference. On Pilot Sports all you can do is drive really slow and stop really slow. They have no forgiveness whatsoever.

this week, the Outlander with chunky tyres and diff lock will get all the outings !!

 

[Adopado]

+1000 for winter tyres in those conditions!

Yes .. I'm just back from a necessary trip over significant gradients and snow cover ... 2 wheel drive ... but winter tyres ... all was fine.

 

[Lasairfion]

I recall driving past a BMW x3 sticking out of a hedge, as I slowly rolled past in a 2 wheel drive sports coupé on summer tyres. Steady as she goes is the rule, and very little use of the brakes. I did get myself some winter tyres after that, and those made all the difference. Well worth the extra bother of changing them over each autumn/spring.

 

[ElRey]

This is where a misspent youth playing in the snow (even on summer tyres) pays off! So long as there's somewhere with space it's well worth while to get some practice.

Very good education there. I also spent many years in my youth in a Honda Civic in the snow. Can't say how grateful I am although I almost never have need of the skill now.

 

[Irata]

Looking at the video again, I can see it's in reverse. You can even see the front wheels spin backwards at one point. To be fair to the driver, he had tried to abandon the idea of going down.

 

[evGuesty]

Since his reverse light was on from the top all the way to the bottom. Would the Tesla even allow the wheels to rotate in the opposite direction of travel. I’ve never tested once hold mode has released the handbrake will the car roll back.

It would have taken a lot of presence of mind to put foot on the brake, shift to D blip the accelerator to get out of hold mode and try to speed up the wheels to the road speed and try steer out. Especially when going into the whole situation thinking your in reverse.

Probably the outcome was a given as soon as they left home with those tyres on.

 

[Carl_SG]

Definitely needs to let the wheels roll. Once rolling I would even give it a tiny bit of power too to help get the car over to the right. The other issue is that ABS (in all cars) is hopeless in really slippery conditions. I've stopped a car successfully using old style "cadence braking" when ABS has given up on the challenge. It may well have been a lost cause on summer tyres on such a spectacularly slippery slope but I've saved a few lost causes in my time and when you are definitely going to crash it's worth trying something! (No handbrake to play with either ... sheesh, modern cars .)

Handbrake on a tesla = hold in P (thats how I interprate the manual anyway)

 

[Adopado]

Handbrake on a tesla = hold in P (thats how I interprate the manual anyway)

Try it ... doesn't really work in any "useful" way .... To be fair it's not like a front wheel drive where the handbrake can become an essential tool in the snow.

 

[Alistairuk]

Looking at the video again, I can see it's in reverse. You can even see the front wheels spin backwards at one point. To be fair to the driver, he had tried to abandon the idea of going down.

I found trying to get my car into my garage (steep hill) without bottoming out that when your moving really slowly and apply the brake (not just use the hold function), then switch to reverse - when you release the brake pedal the car creeps ahead very slightly - maybe 1 or 2 inches; I wonder if that was enough to push it a little too far over the edge and start it sliding down the hill as it looked steady enough until the wheels turned slightly and it went sledging!?

 

[init6]

; I wonder if that was enough to push it a little too far over the edge and start it sliding down the hill as it looked steady enough until the wheels turned slightly and it went sledging!?

He shouldn't have been anywhere near the edge. If he did do it accidentally, the mistake was to aim for that road in the first place. If the main road is covered in snow then the really steep road is likely covered in snow too. If he'd turned right along St Vincent St, he'd have avoided the whole problem. Daft decision to even peer over the edge.

 

[Irata]

I still don't understand why there is a split second where the back wheels turn forward and the front backward.

 

[Durzel]

Since his reverse light was on from the top all the way to the bottom. Would the Tesla even allow the wheels to rotate in the opposite direction of travel. I’ve never tested once hold mode has released the handbrake will the car roll back.

It would have taken a lot of presence of mind to put foot on the brake, shift to D blip the accelerator to get out of hold mode and try to speed up the wheels to the road speed and try steer out. Especially when going into the whole situation thinking your in reverse.

Probably the outcome was a given as soon as they left home with those tyres on.

Well spotted, didn't notice that. The wheels spin backwards briefly before he puts the brakes on.

I've shifted from neutral to drive at the bottom of a hill when I've been trying to clean the brakes. I don't think the car particularly likes being put into gear whilst in motion, but it does it.

He does take his foot off the brake briefly, for about 1/2 a second, but of course he's still in reverse so it's not going to help him.

I must confess I've not tested regenerative braking in the snow to see whether it's too strong. In an ICE car I'd have just stuck it in 1st and tried to get to the bottom of the hill, with the car engine braking. I'm sure it would've been a very stressful experience though as the car will have wanted to go faster than I would be comfortable with.

It looks like a long time has passed when you're looking at a video like that in a warm room, but at the time it would've felt like it passed in the blink of an eye.

As said though the standard tyres would give nominal grip in these conditions.