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5/3/13 Announcement press release up

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The calculator lets you input the down payment, and (for me, anyway) it was initialized to 10%. So I'm not sure what the fine print is about.

I just meant that you have to come up with e.g $10000 cash and then you get it back up to a year later.

It's not really fine print I agree. But would have been good if they could have financed this specific part. However, as it stands, over a 3 year period, the calculator is now accurate - unlike before.
 
I just meant that you have to come up with e.g $10000 cash and then you get it back up to a year later.

It's not really fine print I agree. But would have been good if they could have financed this specific part. However, as it stands, over a 3 year period, the calculator is now accurate - unlike before.

And the text about the down payment in the original site was really unclear. Many people thought there was no down payment. Now it's made very clear:

U.S. Bank and Wells Fargo will finance up to 90% of Model S. In most cases, US Federal and state tax credits ranging from $7,500 to $15,000 will effectively reimburse your down payment, incentives that are not available with leasing.
 
On the Financing page of the Tesla Motors website, I see three different Tesla Model S cars, in 3 different colours.

The car on the left side is black and has a 60 kWh battery pack, and the estimated monthly payment is 916 USD. With no options?
The car in the middle is blue and has a 85 kWh battery pack, and the estimated monthly payment is 1,045 USD. With no options?
The car on the right is red and has a 85 kWh battery pack (and is the Performance model), and the estimated monthly payment is 1,239 USD. With no options?

I assume that the monthly payment will be higher if the customer chooses any options?
 
I'm a little confused about how all of this works in practice. So if at the end of the lease term the market actually values the car at 40%, Tesla takes the car back and presumably has a LOT of used cars to sell. As of now, they don't even have a method for selling used cars at all. Presuming MS2 comes out in 3 years and Tesla incentives current owners to upgrade, what's their method of selling 5-,000 to 10,000 used cars (all the same model)?

I was wondering similar when they announced the sale of the loaner car.
 
We all know this, but it's nice to see:

' Tesla has delivered almost 10,000 electric vehicles to customers in 31 countries.'

That sounds right. A week or two ago I was looking at deliveries being right around 9,500 by the end of April. Probably closer to 9,700 right now and they could well hit 10k by the conference call.

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CNBC just reported the change….I hope Elon has more good news…this alone could have been just a press release IMO.

The Q/A had much more interesting info than just the press release.

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"...and with that, I'll turn the call over to Tesla Motors CEO, Elon Musk."
""Um. uh. eh. um. eh. Um. And. Um. Eh. . . . etc."

Elon is great BUT . . . . I wish Elon would get some coaching on public speaking. He insists on perfection in the cars, in the factory, in the experience of ownership, but then when he opens his mouth, it's stammering, bumpy speech that is not clear, commanding, confidence, and smooth. He really needs to polish his presentation. It's getting old.

His brain might not be capable of speaking in the way you describe. Speaking talent isn't all about skills. Often you'll see really brilliant people who are dyslexic or stutter, etc. Elon often stutters, which is what you are hearing as "bumpy."

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Can we have more specifics on what this exactly means? Are they saying they guarantee 50% or more? What cars are the considering to be in the same class? Technically no other manufacturer has a competing car.

Read my blog post on Large Luxury Sedans and follow the links to goodcarbadcars.net.

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“car in the same price range” not "class"

No, he means class. I doubt he intends to peg the price to that of sports cars and whatnot.
 
His brain might not be capable of speaking in the way you describe. Speaking talent isn't all about skills. Often you'll see really brilliant people who are dyslexic or stutter, etc. Elon often stutters, which is what you are hearing as "bumpy."

I believe it's a matter that his brain is working faster than his mouth, unlike so many of us whose mouths (or fingers) work faster than our brains. :wink:

The man doesn't have to be exceptional at everything. And he doesn't have to try to be exceptional at everything. I like that he's not some smooth talking politician type. That way I can remain believing that he's human and not some otherworldly being...like a Martian. :smile:
 
Elon is great BUT . . . . I wish Elon would get some coaching on public speaking. He insists on perfection in the cars, in the factory, in the experience of ownership, but then when he opens his mouth, it's stammering, bumpy speech that is not clear, commanding, confidence, and smooth. He really needs to polish his presentation. It's getting old.

So you'd rather have him talk like some politician where the only thing that comes out of their mouths is...well, you know?

Sorry, but I like his speaking style. It's down to earth and you can tell he really means what he says.
 
Is anyone else disappointed that this guarantee won't apply to those who purchased their car before the announcement and not through Tesla financing? If I had known, I would have gone with them instead of Pen Fed.

This is a weird statement. You purchased a financing product from a one vendor, and then you are surprised that you don't get benefits that another offers its customers? Remember, the guarantee is part of the Wells Fargo financing package - the loan is bundled with an insurance. You opted for a cheaper loan without the insurance. Yes, I can understand your disappointment that a better product was launched after you made your decision, but in all fairness it is pretty obvious that Tesla have been doing their best to launch the right product as fast as they could.

You could go to your own vendor (Pen Fed) and ask them what they will do to match the improvement in their competitors' product (but I would not get my hopes up).
 
I'm a little confused about how all of this works in practice. So if at the end of the lease term the market actually values the car at 40%, Tesla takes the car back and presumably has a LOT of used cars to sell. As of now, they don't even have a method for selling used cars at all. Presuming MS2 comes out in 3 years and Tesla incentives current owners to upgrade, what's their method of selling 5-,000 to 10,000 used cars (all the same model)?

Yes, Tesla would eat the difference. Selling the used cars is something they have done for years now with the Roadster.

In financial terms, it's not unreasonable to expect that the Model S will have residual value such that Tesla wont have to make up the difference. Real depreciation is largely a function of marginal cost of ownership. As capital goods age, their maintenance costs increase, which means that your marginal cost of ownership goes up. The faster that a product wears out the greater its depreciation.

But "wear and tear" is not the only factor. Marginal cost of ownership includes operational costs. Lower relative operational costs (aside from maintenance) also result in less depreciation. So a device which is more efficient will depreciate slower than a device which is less so. There are other factors in play, but that's the basic economics.

A 10 year old Toyota has a much greater value than a 10 year old Chevy because the marginal cost of ownership of the Toyota is much lower as it ages. This is because it's both much more durable and much more efficient to operate.

An 85kWh Model S is likely to be the most durable automobile ever made, from a mechanical standpoint, and even factoring in battery degradation (by far. Someone should do a study on this and become famous). It's also almost certainly the most efficient car ever made on a per pound basis. I haven't actually done the math, but the little electric econoboxes probably weigh ~3,000lbs while the Model S is ~4,800, while its maybe only 20-30% less on MPGe. The engineering in the Model S is just amazing in that respect.

Once the market figures this out (it might take a decade or more for the market to properly sort this out), a Model S class vehicle is likely to have amazing resale values compared to traditional ICE vehicles. This factor is really under appreciated when folks are talking about if or how the Model S will reshape the Market. Product replacement will be much more tied to fashion rather than actual need.

An ICE vehicle which has been driven hard (45k miles in 3 years) has used up ~25% of its economically useful life, and is on the verge of having to deal with rapidly escalating maintenance costs. This fact drives the basic 3-5 year replacement cycles we see in the auto industry.

For a Model S, the equivalent number is likely closer to 10%, and 5% isn't completely insane to contemplate.
 
Well, there is also a psychological factor of "new" vs. "preowned". I believe any product with any kind of "luxury" element attached to it loses 10-20% of its value the moment you take it out of the box and use it.

Yes, that's one of the "other factors". Also, at the luxury level cars have lower relative utility because luxury cars do the same basic thing as a Camry, which tends to undercut them relative to an actual Camry once it enters the secondary market. But the basic economics is still there.
 
This is a weird statement. You purchased a financing product from a one vendor, and then you are surprised that you don't get benefits that another offers its customers? Remember, the guarantee is part of the Wells Fargo financing package - the loan is bundled with an insurance. You opted for a cheaper loan without the insurance. Yes, I can understand your disappointment that a better product was launched after you made your decision, but in all fairness it is pretty obvious that Tesla have been doing their best to launch the right product as fast as they could.

You could go to your own vendor (Pen Fed) and ask them what they will do to match the improvement in their competitors' product (but I would not get my hopes up).

Wells Fargo isn't guaranteeing the resale value of the car - Tesla and Elon are. WF is merely taking care of the financing aspect. My point is that I would be willing to go with a higher interest rate for that guarantee. Frankly, I think the guarantee should apply to any Model S sold, regardless of whether it was financed or paid for outright.
 
This is a weird statement. You purchased a financing product from a one vendor, and then you are surprised that you don't get benefits that another offers its customers? Remember, the guarantee is part of the Wells Fargo financing package - the loan is bundled with an insurance. You opted for a cheaper loan without the insurance. Yes, I can understand your disappointment that a better product was launched after you made your decision, but in all fairness it is pretty obvious that Tesla have been doing their best to launch the right product as fast as they could.

You could go to your own vendor (Pen Fed) and ask them what they will do to match the improvement in their competitors' product (but I would not get my hopes up).
I disagree. I believe that if they wanted to sell more vehicles then the 50% residual guarantee should apply to ALL vehicles purchased. It would be a great marketing tool for Tesla to say that the first 20,000 vehicles sold would have this guarantee. If after the first 20K sold the demand dropped some, then extend it. They need to get their product on the road. This is an expensive, new product (I admit a great one)...
 
Wells Fargo isn't guaranteeing the resale value of the car - Tesla and Elon are.

We don't know what the commercial arrangement is between the various partners that offer this financing product (including the put option for the car).

My point is that I would be willing to go with a higher interest rate for that guarantee.
In other words: A better product was launched after you bought. This happens to everyone, and it is unrealistic to expect anything else.

Frankly, I think the guarantee should apply to any Model S sold, regardless of whether it was financed or paid for outright.

I can understand that you would like that to happen. However, this statement seems to imply some sort of obligation on Tesla's part to offer this to you. I do not quite understand why they should be obliged to do so.
 
I disagree. I believe that if they wanted to sell more vehicles then the 50% residual guarantee should apply to ALL vehicles purchased. It would be a great marketing tool for Tesla to say that the first 20,000 vehicles sold would have this guarantee. If after the first 20K sold the demand dropped some, then extend it. They need to get their product on the road. This is an expensive, new product (I admit a great one)...

Well said, AIMc. And Don Pedro, I don't think Tesla owes me anything. I was merely expressing an opinion. That is allowed, right?
 
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