7.1 in Australia

[paulp]

My guess is that we will never get it.

The reason is the Australian Road Rules:

"11—" " Australian Road Rules apply to vehicles and road users on roads and road-related areas"


"(1) A "road-related area is any of the following:


(a) an area that divides a road;


(b) a footpath or nature strip adjacent to a road;


(c) an area that is not a road and that is open to the public and designated for use by cyclists or animals;


(d) an area that is not a road and that is open to or used by the public for driving, riding or parking vehicles."


So, given subsection (d) normal road rules apply almost everywhere. The only place summon might be legal here is on a single title private residential property.

- - - Updated - - -



If the radio frequency spectrum band used by Homelink is different to the band allocated to garage door remotes in Australia it would be a federal offence for Tesla to activate Homelink in Australia.

The US release notes make it clear summons is only to be used on private property, so there is no reason we cannot have it. Sure it might be illagal used on a private road, but so is exceeding the speed limit and driving on the wrong side of the road, but all cars are capable of that too.
Further more, tesla promised it for Australia, so technically I've already paid, but did so knowing it was coming soon. Given it's now available, I have an expectation that the goods I paid for will be delivered.

Homelink is offered with the same frequency as my BND remote, so cannot see licencing being overly difficult. Homelink as a product was never offered in the australian marketing, however automatic garage opening was. Hence I'm not fussed how tesla achieve that, but expect that they will.

 

[BenT]

The US release notes make it clear summons is only to be used on private property, so there is no reason we cannot have it. Sure it might be illagal used on a private road, but so is exceeding the speed limit and driving on the wrong side of the road, but all cars are capable of that too.
Further more, tesla promised it for Australia, so technically I've already paid, but did so knowing it was coming soon. Given it's now available, I have an expectation that the goods I paid for will be delivered.

Homelink is offered with the same frequency as my BND remote, so cannot see licencing being overly difficult. Homelink as a product was never offered in the australian marketing, however automatic garage opening was. Hence I'm not fussed how tesla achieve that, but expect that they will.

Paul is right. Aside from private residential land there are vast tracts of private rural land where you could use summons. Also agree re the frequency. Tesla could easily set the frequency to suit the Australian door opener spectrum.

 

[LGGD]

The US release notes make it clear summons is only to be used on private property, so there is no reason we cannot have it. Sure it might be illagal used on a private road, but so is exceeding the speed limit and driving on the wrong side of the road, but all cars are capable of that too.
Further more, tesla promised it for Australia, so technically I've already paid, but did so knowing it was coming soon. Given it's now available, I have an expectation that the goods I paid for will be delivered.

Homelink is offered with the same frequency as my BND remote, so cannot see licencing being overly difficult. Homelink as a product was never offered in the australian marketing, however automatic garage opening was. Hence I'm not fussed how tesla achieve that, but expect that they will.

Homelink I'm not sure about - it's been hard to get any sort of definitive answer on it.

But with regards to Summon, in the US 'private property' has a much broader meaning under road rules than it does in Australia. If a place is not government it is private. You couldn't even use the terms 'only to be used on private property' in Australia as it is not the relevant distinction. It would have to be "not to be used on roads or road related areas'.

Ford, much to their angst, had to make Australia the only market in the world where the auto line locking feature of the new Mustang is disabled even though it would of course be legal to use it on a drag strip. This is because of their interpretation of their responsibilities under the anti-hooning provisions of the Australian road rules.

Australia has what are essentially the most restrictive road and vehicle safety regulations in the world. For this reason we will always be denied many capabilities of a Tesla.

 

[paulp]

Homelink I'm not sure about - it's been hard to get any sort of definitive answer on it.

But with regards to Summon, in the US 'private property' has a much broader meaning under road rules than it does in Australia. If a place is not government it is private. You couldn't even use the terms 'only to be used on private property' in Australia as it is not the relevant distinction. It would have to be "not to be used on roads or road related areas'.

Ford, much to their angst, had to make Australia the only market in the world where the auto line locking feature of the new Mustang is disabled even though it would of course be legal to use it on a drag strip. This is because of their interpretation of their responsibilities under the anti-hooning provisions of the Australian road rules.

Australia has what are essentially the most restrictive road and vehicle safety regulations in the world. For this reason we will always be denied many capabilities of a Tesla.

Summons and homelink are directly related.
When I raised the issue with Kasey Krape in the US, that is how will summons work without homelink to open the door, she had the summons web page taken down immediately. Hence it's got nothing to do with the road rules, and so we will see summons at the same time as we see a garage door opening solution.

The arguement around road rules makes no sense when we are all driving around on autopilot 'with our hands on the wheel'

 

[LGGD]

Summons and homelink are directly related.
When I raised the issue with Kasey Krape in the US, that is how will summons work without homelink to open the door, she had the summons web page taken down immediately. Hence it's got nothing to do with the road rules, and so we will see summons at the same time as we see a garage door opening solution.

The arguement around road rules makes no sense when we are all driving around on autopilot 'with our hands on the wheel'

Summon would still be quite useful without Homelink.

Tesla autopilot is, in legal terms, not that different to existing implementations by some other vehicle manufacturers. The Australian Road Rules require the driver to be "in control" at all times but they do not specify that this means hands on the wheel specifically. So, I don't see any analogy there with autopilot.

Ford are openly unhappy about having to delete auto-line lock for Australian Mustang's even though it could be used legally. So, it would seem there is something more at play than manufacturers just relying on drivers to obey the applicable road laws.

 

[PJF000]

That is a very good point MrATO

However I would venture to guess that "residential" means whether GoogleMaps (the engine behind its nav system) tells the car if there are houses on either side of the road.

At first I thought the Autopilot was quite Nav system unaware - but driving back from Melbourne on AP at one point, I decided to ignore my nav system and continue on the highway when it was directing me off it. When I passed the point, the AP started slowing the car right down (even though the speed was set for 110kmh) as if it was forcing me to consider doing a U turn in accordance with the Nav System... I was overriding it with foot on the accelerator (not cancelling the route) - but it was actually an unpleasant experience.

Was that on the new Holbrook bypass? I had that experience there and it was if the car was slowing as if I had run off the road into a field. I presumed that Google maps had not been updated with the new road and the GPS was trying to take me on the old highway.

 

[WhiteStar]

I hope we get Summon here too. It has appeared as Notification options in the updated Tesla app but that’s no guarantee.


If not Summon - driverless therefore the nanny restrictions - then how about Precision Auto Creep - while sitting in the driver’s seat the car will creep at very low speed into a tight space guided by the sensors?


Only problem is I’m not sure what the minimum detection distance is? 30cm? I was hoping for guidance with substantially less room than that on either side.

 

[paulp]

Summon would still be quite useful without Homelink.

Tesla autopilot is, in legal terms, not that different to existing implementations by some other vehicle manufacturers. The Australian Road Rules require the driver to be "in control" at all times but they do not specify that this means hands on the wheel specifically. So, I don't see any analogy there with autopilot.

Ford are openly unhappy about having to delete auto-line lock for Australian Mustang's even though it could be used legally. So, it would seem there is something more at play than manufacturers just relying on drivers to obey the applicable road laws.

Attached is the previous wording on the AUSTRALIAN website, changed on 5 June.
If you compare this wording with the current wording (they didnt change the graphic), it's plainly clear that this has nothing to do with road rules.
Changing material after purchase doesn't change liability to those that purchased prior to the change, and I very much doubt anyone at Tesla will be able to provide documentation from our nanny government denying the use of summons.

 

[LGGD]

Attached is the previous wording on the AUSTRALIAN website, changed on 5 June.
If you compare this wording with the current wording (they didnt change the graphic), it's plainly clear that this has nothing to do with road rules.
Changing material after purchase doesn't change liability to those that purchased prior to the change, and I very much doubt anyone at Tesla will be able to provide documentation from our nanny government denying the use of summons.

I agree, and I hope we do get Summon. I am just suggesting why Tesla may have not delivered it in Australia, is it a correct decision or interpretation? - like you, I'm not so sure.

 

[MDK]

Only problem is I’m not sure what the minimum detection distance is? 30cm? I was hoping for guidance with substantially less room than that on either side.

Summon can be configured to stop within 8" (20cm) plus there's a setting for "Narrow Spaces"

Source: 60293-Firmware-7-1?p=1313411

 

[EcoCloudIT]

What's interesting is if they're not going to give it to us why include it in notations in the Tesla iOS app?

-ECIT

 

[paulp]

What's interesting is if they're not going to give it to us why include it in notations in the Tesla iOS app?

-ECIT

there is one global app.

 

[Dborn]

I have to say, my app has not been updated at this time. Ditto with 7.1.

 

[EcoCloudIT]

Sure, but depending on region if one gets different feature sets its dead easy to render it differently.

-ECIT

 

[paulp]

Sure, but depending on region if one gets different feature sets its dead easy to render it differently.

-ECIT

LGGD already has 7.1, and unless I'm mistaken it's without summon.

 

[LGGD]

LGGD already has 7.1, and unless I'm mistaken it's without summon.

Yes, and I am aware of at least 6 other (non forum user) Australians with it now so it is slowly rolling out it seems.

 

[EcoCloudIT]

I'm sure it'll be without summon, but maybe Tesla has not gone to the effort to re-render the Australian notifications cause it's going to happen on a SA today ;-) we can live in hope.

If it's not been left in intentionally, cause we're getting it soon, then it's pretty unprofessional....

-ECIT

 

[ZTrekus]

That is a very good point MrATO

However I would venture to guess that "residential" means whether GoogleMaps (the engine behind its nav system) tells the car if there are houses on either side of the road.

At first I thought the Autopilot was quite Nav system unaware - but driving back from Melbourne on AP at one point, I decided to ignore my nav system and continue on the highway when it was directing me off it. When I passed the point, the AP started slowing the car right down (even though the speed was set for 110kmh) as if it was forcing me to consider doing a U turn in accordance with the Nav System... I was overriding it with foot on the accelerator (not cancelling the route) - but it was actually an unpleasant experience.

Was that on the new Holbrook bypass? I had that experience there and it was if the car was slowing as if I had run off the road into a field. I presumed that Google maps had not been updated with the new road and the GPS was trying to take me on the old highway.

Hello PJF000

I cannot say if it was on the Holybrook bypass as my knowledge of the Melb-Syd route is literally ONCE ONLY... and I just followed the Hume Hwy - Supercharger route. It only happened once on the way back. On the way there I took a detour through a town which I thought was completely dumb so on the way back I just stuck on the Hume no matter what. The Nav system went nuts and the AP/TACC thought it would slow me down because of it. My right foot did the protesting.

- - - Updated - - -

What's interesting is if they're not going to give it to us why include it in notations in the Tesla iOS app?

-ECIT

I am about to update my Tesla Motors App on my iPad now, and I notice the update description is literally:

"Use the app to:
-Summon Model S
-Open/Close a HomeLink-controlled garage door (for U.S.
vehicles only)

Minor fixes and improvements"

So you see - the "for U.S. vehicles only" limitation is only on the Homelink bit. That would seem to indicate that the Summons Model S feature is not so limited.

So one can only live in hope. Truth be told, I am hopeful that it will roll out over the rest of the world after some real life data comes in from the US crowd...

 

[lennier]

That is a very good point MrATO

However I would venture to guess that "residential" means whether GoogleMaps (the engine behind its nav system) tells the car if there are houses on either side of the road.

At first I thought the Autopilot was quite Nav system unaware - but driving back from Melbourne on AP at one point, I decided to ignore my nav system and continue on the highway when it was directing me off it. When I passed the point, the AP started slowing the car right down (even though the speed was set for 110kmh) as if it was forcing me to consider doing a U turn in accordance with the Nav System... I was overriding it with foot on the accelerator (not cancelling the route) - but it was actually an unpleasant experience.

Was that on the new Holbrook bypass? I had that experience there and it was if the car was slowing as if I had run off the road into a field. I presumed that Google maps had not been updated with the new road and the GPS was trying to take me on the old highway.

I had exactly that experience on the Holbrook bypass today, wondered WTF was going on!

 

[BenT]

All across Australia and around the world Tesla owners are going to sleep tonight hoping that they will wake up tomorrow morning to find that the Tesla fairy has brought them a software update.