70kwh packs in the refresh are really 75kwh

[Lawtq]

Just you

No its not just him, Mr rich boy

 

[HankLloydRight]

Here's the post:
Pack Swap on 70D to 90kWh HP?

And see this post: Pack Swap on 70D to 90kWh HP?

Hot damn.

Yup, missed that thread entirely. thanks.

 

[tonglaji]

If the difference is pure software, I wonder if Tesla could have turned every CPO car into a P model, and sell for a higher margin?

 

[HankLloydRight]

If the difference is pure software, I wonder if Tesla could have turned every CPO car into a P model, and sell for a higher margin?

I don't think they would/could do that, because that would screw up the VIN coding scheme for model type (Performance, etc).

 

[tonglaji]

didn't they turn on super charging on all the CPOs? I wonder if there was any early software limited 40 cars got traded in and turned into CPO 60s.

 

[apacheguy]

Well this interesting. Does it mean that Tesla dumped the NCR18650BE cells and is only using what is I'm the 90 kWh model?

If the new packs are 75s versus 70s by utilizing less blanks, then how much extra weight would an MS with the 75 be carrying around not utilized? Enough to impact range a bit over time, e.g. an extra 100-200lb or so?

There were blanks in the 60, but this is not true of the 70.

If the difference is pure software, I wonder if Tesla could have turned every CPO car into a P model, and sell for a higher margin?

@Ingineer refuted wk's contention later in that same thread. He suggested the difference is more than purely software.

 

[Boourns]

didn't they turn on super charging on all the CPOs? I wonder if there was any early software limited 40 cars got traded in and turned into CPO 60s.

They turn on supercharging and flip the 40-->60 switch on all CPOs.

 

[Mike K]

Obviously not the relevant threads. I thought wk057 wasn't posting his research to TMC anymore. What thread(s) is this? I'd surely like to catch up, but I find it very hard to believe this is true just because wk057 makes one assertion about it. I'll believe it if/when he can "unlock" an S85 into a P85.

In case you don't stumble upon it in those posts, he did do just that which is why I suspect he finally posted about it. From what I recall he was wondering what would happen if he uploaded the firmware from a P85 to an S85 and discovered the it turned the S85 into a P85. He posted that performance was the same as other P85's he had or had driven and that the car was like that (at the time) for several months with no issues.

It could be that Tesla has minor upgrades in contactors or other components in the inverter but as far as whether or not it will work, it appears the answer is yes. Considering economies of scale and simplicity of manufacturing, it's no surprise they would have done this early on and considering that they do it now with several options, it seems the only difference is that now they're embracing the upgradability of cars and using it as another revenue stream.

Which is awesome. Now that the S85's and P85's no longer exist, if an upgrade was indeed possible and Tesla offered it for $5000ish, I'd probably fork that over. And that's $5000 on a three year old car. To my knowledge no other car company offers anything like this. Imagine still earning revenue from a car years after you've sold it.

 

[HankLloydRight]

In case you don't stumble upon it in those posts....

Yes, I did... three days ago... please see seven posts up.

 

[sorka]

Not ridiculous at all. This is just supply chain management. The people who bought 70s got what they paid for whether it is "true" 70 or a limited 75. This is no different than the S40 getting a 60kWh pack and paying a 40 price with a software limit.

Just as long as the 75 doesn't increase the weight over what the 70....

 

[bradjc]

Just as long as the 75 doesn't increase the weight over what the 70....

It has to. :/

 

[sitter_k]

Because at Tesla, "Communication is Job #856,422"

Gull wing doors #1

 

[gsxdsm]

It has to. :/

No it doesn't

 

[bradjc]

No it doesn't

Larger capacity battery but the same weight? Are you sure?

 

[gsxdsm]

Larger capacity battery but the same weight? Are you sure?

The battery chemistry has changed. Same way tesla went from 85 to 90 by adding silicon. Same number of cells. Same weight

 

[bradjc]

The battery chemistry has changed. Same way tesla went from 85 to 90 by adding silicon. Same number of cells. Same weight

I hope you're right. Bjorn thinks the extra capacity would add up to 30kgs quoting his latest video. No small amount if he's right. All guesses at this point until more info comes through I suppose.

 

[apacheguy]

The battery chemistry has changed. Same way tesla went from 85 to 90 by adding silicon. Same number of cells. Same weight

I think this is likely correct. Tesla is exclusively using the NCR18650GE (or whatever it is). They've entirely discontinued NCR18650BE.

 

[stopcrazypp]

Just as long as the 75 doesn't increase the weight over what the 70....

Even if it weighs slightly more, you get better C-rates (and thus better life and charging speeds) out of it. Plus you get the option to upgrade it.

I hope you're right. Bjorn thinks the extra capacity would add up to 30kgs quoting his latest video. No small amount if he's right. All guesses at this point until more info comes through I suppose.

Given the amount of cells is the same and it is just a small chemistry tweak. Even comparing the lower capacity NCR18650A (45g) to the newer partial silicon NCR18650GA (47-48g), there is only a difference of 2-3 grams, so at 6216 cells that is still only 12.4-18.6 kg.

 

[FlatSix911]

I hope you are correct regarding the battery improvements.

Tesla’s new battery research partner is receiving the prestigious Governor General’s Innovation Award