Here is the initial article:
GM, FCA strike a deal with Tesla that consumers subsidize
I had been conversing with the author and Mr. Appleton. Start at the bottom and work your way up. Pretty sad that the head of a state dealership association thinks this way.
Below is his final response. I just replied with “LOL okay”.
On Jun 6, 2019, at 3:50 PM, Appleton, James <[email protected]> wrote:
Thank YOU for your thoughtful response.
I think its fair to say the only thing we agree on is that “time will tell.” Let’s just leave it at that.
On Thursday, June 6, 2019, 3:00:11 PM EDT, <> wrote:
Dear Mr. Appleton,
1. Thank you for your response. Appreciated.
2. Not sure where you come up with "bait and switch" and "no one on the face of the earth has ever purchased an entry level Tesla for 35k." Here is a video showing otherwise.
E for Electric
38K subscribers
The First $35K Tesla Model 3 Has Been Delivered!
"
Granted, the prices have risen slightly I think by $400. Can still contact Tesla to request the base model. Just not available on website.
3. Are you claiming dealers don't try to upsell? I have yet to be in one that hasn't. People forget that almost EVERY Tesla owner was a former gas car owner. We KNOW both sides.
4. The deposit was easily refundable. I requested a refund via ACH, came through 3 business days later. (I purchased a Model S instead.). There was no statement I recall from Tesla for which reservations were for only the 35k version. I was planning on the AWD version but I preferred the Model S. Tesla has historically sold their higher trim versions first. Nothing new here.
5. Do you honestly think Tesla can't exist with other car manufactuers? After all, many gas car companies can coexist. As more people move toward EVs away from ICE, this will only improve for Tesla. 20% of Americans Say Their Next Car Will Be Electric, Survey Says
6. Other car manufacturers take deposits. If that many people wanted to "give tesla their money for an interest free loan", more power to them!
7. Tesla is doing EXTREMELY well regardless of the "no demand" thumpers. You may want to watch the animation in this article: Animation: U.S. Electric Vehicle Sales (2010-19)
8. Hybrids are the WORST of both worlds. Twice the maintenance and more complicated drive train for less overall performance.
9. Oh, you mean all the Tesla killers? Have yet to see one competitor that matches on the charging network, over the air updates, autopilot AND performance. Seeing as how Model 3 in 2018 didn't really ramp up until the last half of the year, 2019 will be a much better metric.
Failure Of "Tesla Killers" Actually Boost Tesla
10. Even with other companies like VW building out charging networks, Tesla will most likely be able to use their network AND their own. So once again, best to get a Tesla.
11. I'm actually EXTREMLEY glad to hear other companies are getting into EVs. This does ONE thing. It helps LEGITIMIZE ALL EVs.
12. Other car companies and dealers are going to have a difficult time transitioning to EVs if they currently support ICE. Reason: A large chunk of dealerships bread and butter is from maintenance. Where Does the Car Dealer Make Money? | Edmunds
"So where does the majority of a dealership's profit come from? It's not from car sales, at least not directly. It's from the service and parts department, which accounts for 44 percent of the dealership's gross profits, according to NADA."
Do you know how many times I have taken in my Tesla for any types of maintenance other than tire rotation in over 35k miles? ZERO! My previous gas vehicle would have been brought in for 6 oil changes already. That's going to be a hard sell for dealerships to want to promote EVs. And when I do need service, most likely can be done at my house.
13. Current financial meltdown? Are you serious? Tesla can raise money ANY time they want. It has been proven time and time and time again. I think over TWELVE times in fact and most recently, just a few months ago. I think you (and every other bear) will be eating those words.
14. Yes, sales decreased for Q1 For Tesla. Especially S/X. A few things about that:
a. Q1 is normally a slower quarter.
b. They had some delivery hiccups in new markets for their Model 3. For example, China paused deliveries due to some labels being in English rather than Spanish.
c. They discontinued their MOST POPULAR versions of the S and X (75D) which later turned out to be because they were making improvements to their line.
d. Q2 is on track to be close to the best if not the best quarter ever.
e. People in the market for a new S/X usually want the latest and greatest. So waiting a few months until a refresh is possibly coming, is worth it. And guess what, they now can get a S with 370 miles of range.
15. You see... this attitude you are displaying is EXACTLY why so many people are getting turned off with dealerships. Rather than just acknowledging that Tesla has actually lit a fire under the butts of the competition, you just say things like "bait and switch" and "financial meltdown". Do you forget that GM and Chrysler have already filed bankruptcy only about a decade ago? Sadly, the only area where dealerships are actually being successful (albeit in a negative way) is blocking direct sales and service centers in certain states like Michigan. Dispicable practice. So much for "free market". Yet another reason for people to dislike dealerships. That has certainly been the LAST straw from me on ever supporting the dealership model again. I hope Tesla wins at the federal level to knock this BS out. Dealerships should compete based on service and other positives...not negatives to hide behind ridiculous and antiquated laws.
People complain about Tesla fanboys. I get it. But you know what? The dealerships and the unwarranted extreme negative spin has caused this. Not the other way around. You all are extremely threatened. Rightly so. Just wish the reaction from dealers and other manufacturers would be "we will work harder to prove our worth" instead of "bash, dodge, perry, bash, bash".
16. Yes, Tesla has it's growing pains. But still overall, people continue to rank them best. I'm sure the number will drop, the bigger they are, but still impressive. Tesla Has The Highest Customer Loyalty Of All Car Brands | CleanTechnica
17. You mention 67 different vehicles, from 27 different companies, etc. Most likely they will take many more ICE sales away from themselves moreso than a Tesla sale. Again, with more manufacturers entering the market, that only legitmizes EVs and reduces the stigma of having an EV. Remember, Tesla hasn't even done traditional advertising yet.
18. All the haters and shorts had Tesla pegged as dead back in 2010, then 2011, 2012, etc. They'll do just fine.
19. INDEED....TIME WILL TELL!!!!!!!
I would end on 20 but that's just too obvious.
On Thursday, June 6, 2019, 12:28:59 PM EDT, Appleton, James <[email protected]> wrote:
Thanks for sharing your comments in response to the recent freepress article on the generous government subsidies enjoyed by Tesla owners.
I was quoted in that story as saying that the Bolt is a $37,000 car and Teslas are selling for $57k. I understand you felt that statement was misleading and that it was not a fair apples to apples comparison btwn Bolt entry level and Tesla entry level. I see you point, in the abstract, but in the real world you can actually buy an entry level Bolt for $37K; nobody on the face of the Earth has ever purchased an entry level Tesla for $35K, because they haven’t built one, yet. Customers didn’t “upgrade”, they were “upsold” in an elaborate “bait and switch” scheme hatched by Tesla when they announced the “$35K Model 3” 2 years ago. Tesla “baited” 500,000 consumers across the US w/ an offer of a non-existent $35K vehicle; took a $1000 deposit ($500M interest free loan); made customers wait two years, and then “switched” them in to a higher priced “upgraded” model. If my dealers tried that, they would have the NJ Attorney General and/or plaintiffs lawyers crawling all over them.
I’m not sure how you’ve concluded “Tesla is kicking their butts”, referring to traditional carmakers and auto retailers. In 2018, New Jersey new car dealer sold more than 10,500 “clean” vehicles, representing 62 different models of battery electric, plug-in hybrid and hybrid vehicles from 27 different manufacturers. That’s twice as many as the three models Tesla sold last year. By 2021, there will be more than 100 battery electric vehicles and countless more alternative technology vehicles available for consumers to choose from……just 3 or 4 of them will be Teslas. That’s assuming the company survives the current financial melt-down and the stiff competition it faces from other automakers who are (at long last) “all in” on EVs. Time will tell.
James Brian Appleton, President
New Jersey Coalition of Automotive Retailers
856 River Road
Trenton, New Jersey 08628
609-883-5056 ext. 330
609-883-1093 fax
cid:[email protected]:[email protected]
From: <>
Sent: Wednesday, June 5, 2019 1:55 PM
To: Lareau, Jamie <[email protected]>; Appleton, James <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: EV article
Copied
On Jun 5, 2019, at 1:47 PM, Lareau, Jamie <[email protected]> wrote:
His contact information is public if you want to Google it and contact him yourself.
Best,
Jamie
From: <>
Sent: Wednesday, June 5, 2019 1:39 PM
To: Lareau, Jamie <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: EV article
But why did he compare average selling price of the Tesla to starting price of the Bolt? Why would anyone do that other than to mislead? Not apples to apples.
Hopefully MANY people see through his “opinion”. I have been a Ford and GM owner my entire life. But these antics that the dealers and big three have been pulling off against Tesla are REALLY unfortunate. It has turned me off from EVER buying another GM, Ford or Chrysler product again.
I can understand their concern as Tesla is absolutely kicking their butt and will become even more apparent over the next several years. But this is not the way to handle it and is only accelerating the big 3 and dealerships downfall.
Please send him MY opinion. Thanks
On Jun 5, 2019, at 1:18 PM, Lareau, Jamie <[email protected]> wrote:
Thank you, , for your feedback and for reading.
TrueCar has the market average price of the 2019 Bolt at $30,900 – after a $6,595 discount.
The Model 3 was $51,900.
His comments were his opinion, but thank you for weighing in and you’re always welcome to write a letter to the editor.
Best,
Jamie
From: <>
Sent: Wednesday, June 5, 2019 12:48 PM
To: Lareau, Jamie <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: EV article
BTW, this is hilarious:
“The Chevrolet Bolt is "the real Model 3," for a lot less money, Appleton said. "The average price of Model 3 last year was $57,000, you can buy a Bolt for $37,000, and the Bolt is every bit desirable a vehicle as the Tesla."
Talk about a spin on the situation. Yes the average price was 57k because people UPGRADED! The Tesla Model 3 STARTS at just over 35k. which is LESS than the Bolt.
I hope Appleton realizes this....for his sake.
On Jun 5, 2019, at 12:17 PM, <> wrote:
Hello,
In response to your article here: GM, FCA strike a deal with Tesla that consumers subsidize
Why do you not point out that us Michigan Tesla owners pay about $200 more per year in annual registration fees to cover state road taxes?
Do you think people should be made aware of all the breaks that the oil and gas industries have received over the years?
GM, FCA strike a deal with Tesla that consumers subsidize
I had been conversing with the author and Mr. Appleton. Start at the bottom and work your way up. Pretty sad that the head of a state dealership association thinks this way.
Below is his final response. I just replied with “LOL okay”.
On Jun 6, 2019, at 3:50 PM, Appleton, James <[email protected]> wrote:
Thank YOU for your thoughtful response.
I think its fair to say the only thing we agree on is that “time will tell.” Let’s just leave it at that.
On Thursday, June 6, 2019, 3:00:11 PM EDT, <> wrote:
Dear Mr. Appleton,
1. Thank you for your response. Appreciated.
2. Not sure where you come up with "bait and switch" and "no one on the face of the earth has ever purchased an entry level Tesla for 35k." Here is a video showing otherwise.
E for Electric
38K subscribers
The First $35K Tesla Model 3 Has Been Delivered!
Granted, the prices have risen slightly I think by $400. Can still contact Tesla to request the base model. Just not available on website.
3. Are you claiming dealers don't try to upsell? I have yet to be in one that hasn't. People forget that almost EVERY Tesla owner was a former gas car owner. We KNOW both sides.
4. The deposit was easily refundable. I requested a refund via ACH, came through 3 business days later. (I purchased a Model S instead.). There was no statement I recall from Tesla for which reservations were for only the 35k version. I was planning on the AWD version but I preferred the Model S. Tesla has historically sold their higher trim versions first. Nothing new here.
5. Do you honestly think Tesla can't exist with other car manufactuers? After all, many gas car companies can coexist. As more people move toward EVs away from ICE, this will only improve for Tesla. 20% of Americans Say Their Next Car Will Be Electric, Survey Says
6. Other car manufacturers take deposits. If that many people wanted to "give tesla their money for an interest free loan", more power to them!
7. Tesla is doing EXTREMELY well regardless of the "no demand" thumpers. You may want to watch the animation in this article: Animation: U.S. Electric Vehicle Sales (2010-19)
8. Hybrids are the WORST of both worlds. Twice the maintenance and more complicated drive train for less overall performance.
9. Oh, you mean all the Tesla killers? Have yet to see one competitor that matches on the charging network, over the air updates, autopilot AND performance. Seeing as how Model 3 in 2018 didn't really ramp up until the last half of the year, 2019 will be a much better metric.
Failure Of "Tesla Killers" Actually Boost Tesla
10. Even with other companies like VW building out charging networks, Tesla will most likely be able to use their network AND their own. So once again, best to get a Tesla.
11. I'm actually EXTREMLEY glad to hear other companies are getting into EVs. This does ONE thing. It helps LEGITIMIZE ALL EVs.
12. Other car companies and dealers are going to have a difficult time transitioning to EVs if they currently support ICE. Reason: A large chunk of dealerships bread and butter is from maintenance. Where Does the Car Dealer Make Money? | Edmunds
"So where does the majority of a dealership's profit come from? It's not from car sales, at least not directly. It's from the service and parts department, which accounts for 44 percent of the dealership's gross profits, according to NADA."
Do you know how many times I have taken in my Tesla for any types of maintenance other than tire rotation in over 35k miles? ZERO! My previous gas vehicle would have been brought in for 6 oil changes already. That's going to be a hard sell for dealerships to want to promote EVs. And when I do need service, most likely can be done at my house.
13. Current financial meltdown? Are you serious? Tesla can raise money ANY time they want. It has been proven time and time and time again. I think over TWELVE times in fact and most recently, just a few months ago. I think you (and every other bear) will be eating those words.
14. Yes, sales decreased for Q1 For Tesla. Especially S/X. A few things about that:
a. Q1 is normally a slower quarter.
b. They had some delivery hiccups in new markets for their Model 3. For example, China paused deliveries due to some labels being in English rather than Spanish.
c. They discontinued their MOST POPULAR versions of the S and X (75D) which later turned out to be because they were making improvements to their line.
d. Q2 is on track to be close to the best if not the best quarter ever.
e. People in the market for a new S/X usually want the latest and greatest. So waiting a few months until a refresh is possibly coming, is worth it. And guess what, they now can get a S with 370 miles of range.
15. You see... this attitude you are displaying is EXACTLY why so many people are getting turned off with dealerships. Rather than just acknowledging that Tesla has actually lit a fire under the butts of the competition, you just say things like "bait and switch" and "financial meltdown". Do you forget that GM and Chrysler have already filed bankruptcy only about a decade ago? Sadly, the only area where dealerships are actually being successful (albeit in a negative way) is blocking direct sales and service centers in certain states like Michigan. Dispicable practice. So much for "free market". Yet another reason for people to dislike dealerships. That has certainly been the LAST straw from me on ever supporting the dealership model again. I hope Tesla wins at the federal level to knock this BS out. Dealerships should compete based on service and other positives...not negatives to hide behind ridiculous and antiquated laws.
People complain about Tesla fanboys. I get it. But you know what? The dealerships and the unwarranted extreme negative spin has caused this. Not the other way around. You all are extremely threatened. Rightly so. Just wish the reaction from dealers and other manufacturers would be "we will work harder to prove our worth" instead of "bash, dodge, perry, bash, bash".
16. Yes, Tesla has it's growing pains. But still overall, people continue to rank them best. I'm sure the number will drop, the bigger they are, but still impressive. Tesla Has The Highest Customer Loyalty Of All Car Brands | CleanTechnica
17. You mention 67 different vehicles, from 27 different companies, etc. Most likely they will take many more ICE sales away from themselves moreso than a Tesla sale. Again, with more manufacturers entering the market, that only legitmizes EVs and reduces the stigma of having an EV. Remember, Tesla hasn't even done traditional advertising yet.
18. All the haters and shorts had Tesla pegged as dead back in 2010, then 2011, 2012, etc. They'll do just fine.
19. INDEED....TIME WILL TELL!!!!!!!
I would end on 20 but that's just too obvious.
On Thursday, June 6, 2019, 12:28:59 PM EDT, Appleton, James <[email protected]> wrote:
Thanks for sharing your comments in response to the recent freepress article on the generous government subsidies enjoyed by Tesla owners.
I was quoted in that story as saying that the Bolt is a $37,000 car and Teslas are selling for $57k. I understand you felt that statement was misleading and that it was not a fair apples to apples comparison btwn Bolt entry level and Tesla entry level. I see you point, in the abstract, but in the real world you can actually buy an entry level Bolt for $37K; nobody on the face of the Earth has ever purchased an entry level Tesla for $35K, because they haven’t built one, yet. Customers didn’t “upgrade”, they were “upsold” in an elaborate “bait and switch” scheme hatched by Tesla when they announced the “$35K Model 3” 2 years ago. Tesla “baited” 500,000 consumers across the US w/ an offer of a non-existent $35K vehicle; took a $1000 deposit ($500M interest free loan); made customers wait two years, and then “switched” them in to a higher priced “upgraded” model. If my dealers tried that, they would have the NJ Attorney General and/or plaintiffs lawyers crawling all over them.
I’m not sure how you’ve concluded “Tesla is kicking their butts”, referring to traditional carmakers and auto retailers. In 2018, New Jersey new car dealer sold more than 10,500 “clean” vehicles, representing 62 different models of battery electric, plug-in hybrid and hybrid vehicles from 27 different manufacturers. That’s twice as many as the three models Tesla sold last year. By 2021, there will be more than 100 battery electric vehicles and countless more alternative technology vehicles available for consumers to choose from……just 3 or 4 of them will be Teslas. That’s assuming the company survives the current financial melt-down and the stiff competition it faces from other automakers who are (at long last) “all in” on EVs. Time will tell.
James Brian Appleton, President
New Jersey Coalition of Automotive Retailers
856 River Road
Trenton, New Jersey 08628
609-883-5056 ext. 330
609-883-1093 fax
cid:[email protected]:[email protected]
From: <>
Sent: Wednesday, June 5, 2019 1:55 PM
To: Lareau, Jamie <[email protected]>; Appleton, James <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: EV article
Copied
On Jun 5, 2019, at 1:47 PM, Lareau, Jamie <[email protected]> wrote:
His contact information is public if you want to Google it and contact him yourself.
Best,
Jamie
From: <>
Sent: Wednesday, June 5, 2019 1:39 PM
To: Lareau, Jamie <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: EV article
But why did he compare average selling price of the Tesla to starting price of the Bolt? Why would anyone do that other than to mislead? Not apples to apples.
Hopefully MANY people see through his “opinion”. I have been a Ford and GM owner my entire life. But these antics that the dealers and big three have been pulling off against Tesla are REALLY unfortunate. It has turned me off from EVER buying another GM, Ford or Chrysler product again.
I can understand their concern as Tesla is absolutely kicking their butt and will become even more apparent over the next several years. But this is not the way to handle it and is only accelerating the big 3 and dealerships downfall.
Please send him MY opinion. Thanks
On Jun 5, 2019, at 1:18 PM, Lareau, Jamie <[email protected]> wrote:
Thank you, , for your feedback and for reading.
TrueCar has the market average price of the 2019 Bolt at $30,900 – after a $6,595 discount.
The Model 3 was $51,900.
His comments were his opinion, but thank you for weighing in and you’re always welcome to write a letter to the editor.
Best,
Jamie
From: <>
Sent: Wednesday, June 5, 2019 12:48 PM
To: Lareau, Jamie <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: EV article
BTW, this is hilarious:
“The Chevrolet Bolt is "the real Model 3," for a lot less money, Appleton said. "The average price of Model 3 last year was $57,000, you can buy a Bolt for $37,000, and the Bolt is every bit desirable a vehicle as the Tesla."
Talk about a spin on the situation. Yes the average price was 57k because people UPGRADED! The Tesla Model 3 STARTS at just over 35k. which is LESS than the Bolt.
I hope Appleton realizes this....for his sake.
On Jun 5, 2019, at 12:17 PM, <> wrote:
Hello,
In response to your article here: GM, FCA strike a deal with Tesla that consumers subsidize
Why do you not point out that us Michigan Tesla owners pay about $200 more per year in annual registration fees to cover state road taxes?
Do you think people should be made aware of all the breaks that the oil and gas industries have received over the years?
