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Adaptive Cruise Control (experience post FW v6.1)

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What is confusing about it? If you want to set the cruise speed push up, if you want it to determine speed based on signs pull to you for 3 seconds.

This is ironic, because unless I am mistaken, you are, in fact, confused.

You are correct about the first part: pushing up will set the cruise speed.

But you are confused about the second part, as pulling towards you will not set the speed based on the speed limit signs. What it will do is set the speed based on your Speed Assist setting at the time it is set. So it will set based on --ONE-- sign, but then you are set permanently at that speed, and the speed is not going to adjust based on "signs", as you suggest.

In the future, when the auto pilot is more fully implemented, there will be some option for something along those lines, but right now there is no way to have the car change speed based on the signs it is reading.
 
It's too early for me to tell. I normally drive very spirited so the cruise control could indeed substantially drop my energy consumption. I wouldn't rely on me as a good data point just yet. I'll know tomorrow when I make a trip that last averaged 380k/hw.

So far in my P85D, 12/19-12/21 I was averaging 420kw/hw. After I got her back from repair, it was around 380k/w, and then since the firmware update around 1/1, I've been seeing 320-340kw/h. They might be sneaking in updates into each firmware update and we are feeling its largest effects now.

Given the level of detail around the specifics of a P85D range improvement, specifically torque sleep, it seems logical that if this feature was included in 6.1 that it would have been included in the release notes. Perhaps they are doing some optimization across the Model S line up first. Then, they will follow with a specific release to address the dual motor challenges.
 
Did you see my post upthread, where I pose the question about possible improved efficiency? Your improvement clearly isn't due to the ACC. Do you think Tesla may have given us Torque Sleep without giving us a new driving mode, and without documenting it? We really need some more P85D owners to weigh in on this. I just had a sense of improvement, but no real numbers. You seem to have pretty good numbers, (though not "wk057-good" numbers.) We need more data, to support or refute this.

There's a P85D highway data thread that I (and others) have added a bunch of hwy trip data from 6.0, so we can keep adding to it now that we're on 6.1 and compare efficiency:

P85D range and highway battery performance

P85D Uninterrupted Hwy Trip Data - Google Sheets
 
Agree the light is very annoying, I was about to put tape over it. I think we have two different stalks because my adjustment knob did nothing prior to the TACC so perhaps yours config is more confusing.

What is most confusing about the non-ACC Tesla cruise is that buttons and moves do different things at different times. If it is off, nothing happens. If it is on, up and down activate, if it is active, up and down change speed (and even then depending on how far you push the stalk). It is annoying to have to guess what mode the cruise is in and what happens now.

On e.g. Audi, the best cruise UI I've seen, the cruise both sets speed and activates on pressing button, very easy to start because basically it is always ready. Press button again to set a new speed, anytime, if you want to use gas pedal to increase the cruise speed. Up and down always only change speed if you want to use those. Forward and backward resume/inactivate. If the cruise is off completely, the stalk is physically pushed away so you can sense that with your finger and not have to look for annoying lights. This is very logical both with ACC or not (ACC just adds an additional distance knob).

I will have to wait and see how the Tesla ACC cruise is.
 
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well, on the return trip, no matter how I tried, cruise control simply would not work, kept saying "cruise control unavailable". Lane assist and speed warning still worked.

When I got home, realized that a chunk of snow blocked the radar! Ha

so two things:
1) lane assist and speed warning do not use the radar at all
2) when radar is not working, there is no conventional cruise control either - mmm....



just tried the TACC. It is great. I used at 45 miles road and highway. It was able to slow down and follow the stop and go traffic on highway. The only thing I am not very sure is how quickly it slows when a car suddenly pulls in front you. Twice it happened and I quickly stepped on brake without waiting for the TACC as it is just 2 car length. Once you step on brake it cancels the TACC and you have to pull toward you again to engage Also when car in front of you switch lane to turn, it still tracks it and slows, you need to hit accelerator before the car behind you honks. It does use regen brake as I see the regen lights up all the way to the limit when it slows downVery cool. But have you foot ready next to brake :)
 
well, on the return trip, no matter how I tried, cruise control simply would not work, kept saying "cruise control unavailable". Lane assist and speed warning still worked.

When I got home, realized that a chunk of snow blocked the radar! Ha

so two things:
1) lane assist and speed warning do not use the radar at all
2) when radar is not working, there is no conventional cruise control either - mmm....

I had this problem too. I was driving today while it was snowing, and when the radar filled up with snow, TACC turned off, and I had no way of turning on any type of cruise control. Stopped and removed the snow, and it worked again for a few kms. Later the temperature was above freezing, and even on the longest following distance the car is to close to the vehicle in front to avoid splash and dirt from it, so it stopped working in that condition too.

But when it works, it's great!
 
It sounds like our regular cruise control has been converted to TACC, and it generally works well. But there are times, when the radar is obstructed, that the TACC can't function. At those times, we now have no cruise control at all. It would seem that we need the ability to turn off TACC in these situations and revert back to standard cruise control. Without this, in some ways and at some times TACC is a step backwards.
 
It sounds like our regular cruise control has been converted to TACC, and it generally works well. But there are times, when the radar is obstructed, that the TACC can't function. At those times, we now have no cruise control at all. It would seem that we need the ability to turn off TACC in these situations and revert back to standard cruise control. Without this, in some ways and at some times TACC is a step backwards.

The challenge here is in making sure the driver understands that they aren't in TACC. If a driver can find any way to misunderstand, it would be very dangerous - you'd only find out it wasn't in TACC by getting close enough to some other car to be a collision risk.
Walter
 
What is most confusing about the non-ACC Tesla cruise is that buttons and moves do different things at different times. If it is off, nothing happens. If it is on, up and down activate, if it is active, up and down change speed (and even then depending on how far you push the stalk). It is annoying to have to guess what mode the cruise is in and what happens now.

You don't have to guess at all, the indicators are all there....

On = Light on the stalk is illuminated, and just in case you can't see that there is an arrow on the outside rim of the speedometer.
Active = The words "Cruise Control" illuminated with a reassuring blue glow are shown immediately above the vehicle speed, center of your speedometer..
Off = No light on stalk, no signs on the speedometer.
 
has anyone else experienced this?
TACC is on, cruise at 40mph, coming to traffic light and almost 3 car length to the cars in front, the speed was not reduced enough - it was slowing down though, still at about 20mph, I had to quickly step on the brake to stop it.

Is it only using regen to slow or brake is also used?
also, right before it was to slow down, I was fiddling with the stalk to adjust the speed - still struggling with adjusting by 1 or 2 miles, as it simply wants to adjust to the 5 mile increment... not sure if it was confused or what...
but definitely be very cautious and be ready to brake at any time!
 
The challenge here is in making sure the driver understands that they aren't in TACC. If a driver can find any way to misunderstand, it would be very dangerous - you'd only find out it wasn't in TACC by getting close enough to some other car to be a collision risk.
Walter

Agreed.

But there are other things in our cars that are somewhat complicated and that if misunderstood also could easily cause problems. When the battery is cold and we have no regenerative braking, if someone expects to slow down just by letting off the go pedal, that would be a problem. I understand it's not quite the same thing. I'm just saying that the Model S is more complex than your average car, and I'm hoping Tesla won't take away cruise control when the radar is obstructed just so that some people aren't confused.
 
You don't have to guess at all, the indicators are all there....

On = Light on the stalk is illuminated, and just in case you can't see that there is an arrow on the outside rim of the speedometer.
Active = The words "Cruise Control" illuminated with a reassuring blue glow are shown immediately above the vehicle speed, center of your speedometer..
Off = No light on stalk, no signs on the speedometer.

Those indicators are, of course, true and I do know them. In reality, maintaining an appreciation of the status of the cruise control in a Model S is, in my view, difficult: I don't see the light on the cruise control stalk normally, unless I turn the wheel. In which case, if I'm not using the cruise, it can be annoyingly bright when I get off the highway and turn the wheel and see it - suggesting to turn it off. The arrow on the rim of the speedometer is small and requires specific checking - you can't do this by hand or by feel, and the fact that sometimes the cruise is on and sometimes off, it is a bit of a chore.

Contrast this to e.g. the Audi solution, where the cruise control is always on, unless you push the stalk physically back out of the way - which you will notice immediately when you try to operate it. No need to see any indicators or lights (there are none), you will feel it when you operate it. Also, the cruise on/off button in Tesla is a toggle, so the same button turns on or off depending on the mode it was in. Again, if you get confused by not paying attention to the small visual cues, you may accidentally turn it off when intending to turn it on.

Two more things:

In normal situations the Audi cruise control is ready start driving at any moment - when driving at the speed you want, just press the stalk button to set speed and activate. In a (non-ACC at least) Tesla Model S, you have to press the cruise control to turn it on (including the annoying light you see only occasionally) and then after hopefully you turned it on and not off, to activate and set the speed, you move the lever up or down (which is illogical in itself, why are there two directions to move to activate). If the cruise was not on, you will not feel it by hand, instead you will simply notice that the cruise didn't activate when you let go of the gas pedal - and you have to press a button and move a stalk to repeat. If you get confused and the cruise was already active, this move will actually increase the speed of the vehicle because moving the lever up and down has two separate functions (activate cruise, change cruise speed). In an Audi, there is no harm in re-activating the cruise, it just sets the current speed again because the set-button has a single function, it is not a toggle.

There is another thing: In an Audi, pressing the button always sets cruise speed and activates cruise if it isn't active. This is very useful because if you need to increase speed, you just use the gas pedal and press cruise button again - all the while the cruise remains active and sets the new speed when you press the button. In a Tesla, at least not according to the manual, there isn't a way to set a new current speed without deactivating the cruise control first and then going back through the motions (or using the lever to alter speed setting).

I argue the Tesla cruise control stalk is unnecessarily complex to operate. Operating a cruise is a many-times-a-day operation, it can and should be as simple as driving itself.

In reality, very often I try to activate the Tesla cruise when it is off - or won't bother at all because changing the speed while driving is so bothersome. The moves just don't feel logical at all and there is no "doing by touch".
 
has anyone else experienced this?
TACC is on, cruise at 40mph, coming to traffic light and almost 3 car length to the cars in front, the speed was not reduced enough - it was slowing down though, still at about 20mph, I had to quickly step on the brake to stop it.

Is it only using regen to slow or brake is also used?
also, right before it was to slow down, I was fiddling with the stalk to adjust the speed - still struggling with adjusting by 1 or 2 miles, as it simply wants to adjust to the 5 mile increment... not sure if it was confused or what...
but definitely be very cautious and be ready to brake at any time!

My experience is completely different, I just got back from a 60 mile drive (fwy though), worked flawlessly. I drove the whole way without touching the gas or brake. (and averaged 300 wH/mile!)
 
Maybe it's me, but I don't find the Tesla cruise control to be confusing to operate at all. My only complaint is that pushing forward ought to activate and pulling back ought to disengage, but my mind has adjusted to the way it works now (and I recognize peole's preference depends on what they're used to). That, and moving the stalk to the second detent sometimes increases speed by 6mph instead of 5 (something I think we can attribute to rounding on the speedo display).

I always leave the CC button on, so engaging requires nothing more than a flick of the stalk.
 
Maybe it's me, but I don't find the Tesla cruise control to be confusing to operate at all. My only complaint is that pushing forward ought to activate and pulling back ought to disengage, but my mind has adjusted to the way it works now (and I recognize peole's preference depends on what they're used to). That, and moving the stalk to the second detent sometimes increases speed by 6mph instead of 5 (something I think we can attribute to rounding on the speedo display).

I always leave the CC button on, so engaging requires nothing more than a flick of the stalk.

Obviously people's frame of reference is part of it, but there is no way to set current speed without disengaging the cruise - that is annoying, because using the gas pedal is often the best way to adjust speed when the speed limit increases. Also, no matter how one thinks about it, it is illogical to have two ways of pushing the lever to set speed/engage the cruise (up or down). I would say these two observations, at least, are not really a matter of taste alone. The rest, of course, depends greatly on what one is used to.

Leaving the cruise always on is an option, of course, but the button is pretty easy to press by mistake (say, confuse it with the washer button) - so if you make a mistake, you won't notice until trying to activate the cruise... Also, that light is pretty annoying when it shines in an otherwise dark area of the car when one turns the wheel. Were it not for the light, I too might leave the cruise control on all the time, but even then, it is annoying if someone or something did turn it off and you didn't notice - you will only notice when the cruise fails to engage.

I guess I've been spoiled by better implementations in this regard. :)
 
I have a question: Does model S automatically brake to prevent crash always (unless sensors are blocked etc.) or only when using ACC?

According to the current release notes, a Model S with the full sensor set and v6.1 will brake to a stop when TACC is active, but not otherwise.

There's a collision warning feature right now, but not a braking/mitigation feature. (I expect the crash mitigation functionality will show up on autopilot cars in future updates, but that's just a guess.)
Walter