After autopilot update, undecided about getting M3

[d21mike]

I just took a 2 hour drive for fun. Since I work from home I am seldom in rush hour traffic. However, I hit some stop and go traffic that you would normally see while commuting here is Southern California. Since you ask the question I decided to time the nags when completely hands free. However, I normally have my right hand resting at about position 5 with my thumb pointing to 6 and I get zero nags.

So with hands free the time changes based on speed when going from 0 to 30 mph. The faster the more nags.

Lap 1 = 1:43.23
Lap 2 = 1:00.61
Lap 3 = 2:04.91 <--- very slow traffic
Lap 4 = :52.22 <--- traffic start to flow around 30mph so nag got shorter

To remove the nag I used a single finger push against the bar going down to meet 6. Very easy to eliminate the nag.

 

[ranova]

drove over 200 mi the past 2 days with 90% AP on, no nags. Since the update, its been better imo, since the amount of torque required is much less than before but nags are more frequent if you arent applying any. Since I always keep at least 1 hand on the wheel, the update has made AP BETTER for me.

 

[chronopc]

Go get a google car. Its autopilot is fantastic. <------Sarcasm.

The I-Pace?

 

[jeffro01]

The overriding reason for me wanting a model 3 is to help with the hour long stop and go traffic using AP. As of the latest update, it seems like AP is pretty ineffective now. To cover their liability Tesla is now nagging AP into oblivion.

Without a useful AP that can relieve the work of maintaining basic traffic position at low speed without too much human intervention, I kind of lost the desire to get the model 3. Being electric is great but AP is the selling factor for me. What are your thoughts after the new update?

It's really simple... Can you keep at least one hand on the wheel at all times? If yes, AP will work just fine for you, especially in stop and go traffic... If no, then perhaps you should wait until full autonomous driving comes along...

Jeff

 

[Garlan Garner]

The I-Pace?

What? I-Pace is a Jaguar.

I meant a google car.

google car crashes - Bing video

 

[Mattzilla]

Just buy an AutoPilot Buddy or an orange and you're good to go. It's the accessory Tesla forgot to include.
Autopilot Buddy Device Fits Tesla

/s

Dude, I had no idea this existed. Thank you!

 

[Mr X]

So basically you don't want to drive.


You definitely should buy a bus pass.

 

[TaoJones]

It's really simple... Can you keep at least one hand on the wheel at all times? If yes, AP will work just fine for you, especially in stop and go traffic... If no, then perhaps you should wait until full autonomous driving comes along...

Jeff

But it doesn’t with the 21.9 update and that’s the point. People who have their hand(s) on the wheel 100% of the time are now getting nagged and much more often.

To the OP:

Buy the car.

TACC is unaffected by the current unpleasantness and is worth the price of the car when in stop and go traffic. Even with AP2, which is still not at parity with AP1. You will not regret your purchase on the basis of the driver assist features as long as you don’t expect a lot from AS (Autosteer) relative to TACC, which is quite good. Less stress will be yours during otherwise gnarly commutes.

There are plenty of things about which to be concerned when buying a Tesla. TACC is rarely one of them.

Also, you’ll have the only car choice on the road today that has the potential to improve various aspects of the UX over time. Plus it is safe and comfortable with service people that for the most part try really hard to ensure that you are happy.

So even though today the E in EAP is silent and FSD does not yet exist in public, if it’s a new car you want, the Model 3 is a great choice. A CPO/lease return Model S with included supercharging, low miles, and a +50K mile warranty is also an option.

In my view, we’re all just marking time for 3-5 years until FSD matures, at which point there may well be reason to again buy new.

In all seriousness, you really can’t make a bad decision about buying a car now, as long as you buy a Tesla .

Feel no pressure.

 

[chronopc]

What? I-Pace is a Jaguar.

I meant a google car.

google car crashes - Bing video

Looks like Waymo is teaming up with Jaguar to add their technology to the I-Pace.

 

[xav-]

There’s an easy way to keep your hands relaxed on AP. Simply put your hands on your lap and periodically apply a little bit a pressure in one direction with your thumb. AP will bounce the steering wheel back and reset the “nagging time”. I find that it actually works better with nags than keeping my hands on the steering wheel

That said I personally don’t trust it too much and usually keep both hands on the steering wheel. I have had one instance where it suddenly steered out of my lane and I was glad my hands were on. I also find that keeping one hand (while perfectly safe when driving manually) can be unsafe with AP.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Looks like Waymo is teaming up with Jaguar to add their technology to the I-Pace.

Exactly. The link I posted above includes waymo.

Waymo's Self-Driving Car Crash in Arizona Revives Tough Questions

 

[chronopc]

The overriding reason for me wanting a model 3 is to help with the hour long stop and go traffic using AP. As of the latest update, it seems like AP is pretty ineffective now. To cover their liability Tesla is now nagging AP into oblivion.

Without a useful AP that can relieve the work of maintaining basic traffic position at low speed without too much human intervention, I kind of lost the desire to get the model 3. Being electric is great but AP is the selling factor for me. What are your thoughts after the new update?

I use EAP every time I use my car and it's awesome.

 

[TaoJones]

The i-Pace, with fake engine noise or not, is in a race for 2nd place in an already crowded field (e-Golf, Leaf, Bolt, and then the entries from the luxury marques including Mercedes, BMW, even GM, Ford for sure, and more from the VW Group).

All of those entrants will remain no better than second behind Tesla unless and until infrastructure exists for those entrants to leave town.

What would be embarrassing for Tesla is to lose that second place race *locally* to a city car that has better driver assist features. And at this rate, sadly and for reasons already acknowledged, it appears that *that* race is about to get quite competitive.

Here’s hoping that v9.1 is worth the wait, that the E in EAP stops being silent, that the next generation of S/X/3/Y will have the ability to react to traffic lights as well as stop signs (the latter having been demonstrated using MobilEye tech in December 2016), and that useful FSD features appear before 2020 as well.

 

[bpjod]

EAP is excellent. I keep one or two hands on the wheel at all times somewhere in the 2-3 and 9-10 o'clock positions. Primarily I'm like what you want to do - left elbow on the window sill, hand on the wheel at about 9 o'clock. I get frequent reminders to keep my hands on the wheel. At first a small black box pops up on the screen. A little while later the top of the screen flashes blue. Usually I notice the little black box out of my peripheral vision and give the wheel a small tug/wiggle and the nag goes away. If I miss the black box, I definitely notice the flashing blue. It's never gotten past this point for me and I've put about 1,200 km on EAP so far in my first two weeks of ownership. Really, the nags are subtle, not the least bit annoying, and a little jiggle of the wheel every few minutes is a small price to pay for the wondrous benefits of EAP.

 

[xav-]

The i-Pace, with fake engine noise or not, is in a race for 2nd place in an already crowded field (e-Golf, Leaf, Bolt, and then the entries from the luxury marques including Mercedes, BMW, even GM, Ford for sure, and more from the VW Group).

All of those entrants will remain no better than second behind Tesla unless and until infrastructure exists for those entrants to leave town.

What would be embarrassing for Tesla is to lose that second place race *locally* to a city car that has better driver assist features. And at this rate, sadly and for reasons already acknowledged, it appears that *that* race is about to get quite competitive.

Here’s hoping that v9.1 is worth the wait, that the E in EAP stops being silent, that the next generation of S/X/3/Y will have the ability to react to traffic lights as well as stop signs (the latter having been demonstrated using MobilEye tech in December 2016), and that useful FSD features appear before 2020 as well.

I used AP10 for the first time two weeks ago... IMO EAP in my model 3 is superior, especially with the latest update...

 

[MVuu]

EAP always warns drivers to keep hands on wheels at ALL times. Not sure what people are expecting. EAP is not FSD. Irresponsible Tesla drivers gives Tesla bad publicity.

 

[RangerRick]

I am nearly through another 1000 mile road trip and honestly the nag interval change barely makes any difference in how relaxing these drives are. Having to hold the wheel or move it slightly to clear a nag is still NOTHING compared to constantly having to make fine adjustments to steering and speed to deal with moderate freeway traffic and curvy interstates.

2018.21.9 required no safety interventions at all including going through mountain passes. Overall it’s another noticeable improvement to performance, not just a nag update.

Seconded.

I just did a 2500-mile round-trip NC to MN and back, with the 2nd half coming home happening after the update, including crossing the Appalachians. EAP was engaged easily 80% of my drive, if not more. The update made basically 0 practical difference for me. I kept my hands resting on the bottom of the wheel in a totally natural way and it got as far as nagging at me a total of a couple of times in 1300 miles. It seems to be most likely to happen on a long straightaway where there isn't enough steering correction torque to register my hands... And that's with sport steering enabled; I set it to sport when I first got the car and have never switched it away.

If you're getting nagged regularly, you are probably not holding the wheel well enough to engage with it in an emergency. It's level 2! Either do what the EAP instructions have always said to do to drive safely, or wait for FSD.

 

[chillaban]

I used AP10 for the first time two weeks ago... IMO EAP in my model 3 is superior, especially with the latest update...

I don't want to rehash this into another AP1 vs AP2 debate but I agree, even with recent loaner vehicles comparing Model S AP1.0 vs AP2.0.

I find that AP1 still drives smoother, including being relatively lazy about correcting itself when lane lines suddenly shift over. AP2 has more of a tendency to make a dramatic correction.

But with that said, especially when pushing speeds above 65mph on curvy roads, AP2 in 2018.10.4+ is hands down more capable of tracking challenging road conditions compared to AP1.

 

[xav-]

Agree with the dramatic correction. If the correction needs to be dramatic bottom line the drive should be alerted and AP should disengage! That’s it in my view.

 

[chillaban]

FWIW I posted some more detailed thoughts about AP1 vs AP2 based off my experiences in an AP1 loaner this whole week: Really feels like AP2 > AP1 to me