Yep, its all costs related with the loss, both material & immaterial (hence why abuse survivors are currently taking the catholic church to the cleaners). It’s why the more simplistic thinkers fail to grasp that it can (& probably does) go beyond simply an FSD cost refund
-
Want to remove ads? Register an account and login to see fewer ads, and become a Supporting Member to remove almost all ads.
After what time has passed would you consider an FSD class action lawsuit?
- Thread starter Nuclear Fusion
- Start date
With the amount of fundamentally basic errors that the far simpler Navigate on Autopilot makes, I can guarantee FSD will not be out of beta this year
Nope. You are generally not responsible for consequentual damages, and it doesn't apply here anyway. You don't have a robotaxi company and you're not missing any profits as a result of not having FSD.
In cases like this damages are pretty cut-and-dry.
I personally would. Of course, I would demand the lane-keeping to be left intact as it's present in non-FSD packages.
diplomat33
Average guy who loves autonomous vehicles
Welcome to the Tesla family!
You are not alone. I had some really bad experiences with AP too in the beginning. I had serious phantom braking on my very first drive home from the delivery center. It does take time to learn what AP is good at and what it is not good at. Once you understand its strengths and weaknesses, AP is a great driver assist. Tesla does improve the software over time with over-the-air updates. I can tell you AP is light years better now than it was when I got my car in 2018. Now, I love AP and always use it. When used correctly, AP can make driving less tiring and more convenient. And the car itself is great. You did not make a mistake buying it. My advice though is to always pay attention to the road and always keep your hands on or near the wheel and ready to take over. What Tesla calls "FSD" is not actually autonomous. It is a driver assist. When you understand that, you will be fine.
There are enough weasel words in the original contract and on the website that it would be tough for a class action to proceed. Features will continue to be added over time and it was clearly stated what features you’d get when you bought it. I suspect that the only legal action that might have a chance of succeeding would be a claim of deceptive trade practices or false advertising from the FTC.
Probably seems that way for those yet to advance into intellectual puberty
They weren’t suing to recover a portion of $5k to 10k of spend. Lol. There’s a lot more money on the line for lawyers to grab when a big company causes people to get sick and die from cancer than someone that got snookered into buying vaporware. They might take on a class action, but it will be by the hour for an individual case.
Can someone post the "contract" from 2016 that supposedly has weasel words when someone bought FSD? I've never seen it.
We need to decide if the website is allowed to be used- we can't keep pinging back and forth when it suits one point of view. The website absolutely said "all cars Tesla makes have the hardware needed for FSD." Well, we know that to not be true since Mid 2017, and as of a few weeks ago Tesla is forcing and charging people to upgrade to HW3 as part of an MCU1 upgrade, so now there are damages to that misrepresentation even for people that did not buy FSD.
Of course, the website also says all cars come with rain sensing wipers which wasn't true from 2016-2018. and now the ones we have are "beta".- did the website have the right weasel words for stuff like that?
rxlawdude
Active Member
From the Internet Archive, November 8, 2016: "All Tesla vehicles produced in our factory, including Model 3, have the hardware needed for full self-driving capability at a safety level substantially greater than that of a human driver."
April 2019: "
Autopilot is an advanced driver assistance system that enhances safety and convenience behind the wheel. When used properly, Autopilot reduces your overall workload as a driver. 8 external cameras, a radar, 12 ultrasonic sensors and a powerful onboard computer provide an additional layer of safety to guide you on your journey. Cars built between September 2014 and October 2016 include one camera and less-powerful radar and ultrasonic sensors.
Autopilot is intended for use with a fully attentive driver, who has their hands on the wheel and is prepared to take over at any time. While Autopilot is designed to become more capable over time, in its current form, it is not a self-driving system. There are five levels of automation and Autopilot is currently classified as a Level 2 automated system according to SAE J3016, which is endorsed by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration."
April 2019: "
Autopilot is an advanced driver assistance system that enhances safety and convenience behind the wheel. When used properly, Autopilot reduces your overall workload as a driver. 8 external cameras, a radar, 12 ultrasonic sensors and a powerful onboard computer provide an additional layer of safety to guide you on your journey. Cars built between September 2014 and October 2016 include one camera and less-powerful radar and ultrasonic sensors.
Autopilot is intended for use with a fully attentive driver, who has their hands on the wheel and is prepared to take over at any time. While Autopilot is designed to become more capable over time, in its current form, it is not a self-driving system. There are five levels of automation and Autopilot is currently classified as a Level 2 automated system according to SAE J3016, which is endorsed by the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration."
Other fun historical things that show them learning about weaseling out on dates, but that for early cars, they DID have dates listed that they totally missed:
Tesla.com/autopliot on Oct 20th, 2016:
"Tesla’s Enhanced Autopilot software is expected to complete validation and be rolled out to your car via an over-the-air update in December 2016, subject to regulatory approval." (Was deep into 2018 before that was close to true)
"These active safety technologies, including collision avoidance and automatic emergency braking, will become available in December 2016 and roll out through over-the-air software updates" Note this says WILL come out in 2016. It was late 2017 when they came out. On Jan 1st 2017 they removed the date and said "it has begun rolling out." (one of the features, to alpha testers)
And of course, the FSD description:
"All you will need to do is get in and tell your car where to go. If you don’t say anything, the car will look at your calendar and take you there as the assumed destination or just home if nothing is on the calendar. Your Tesla will figure out the optimal route, navigate urban streets (even without lane markings), manage complex intersections with traffic lights, stop signs and roundabouts, and handle densely packed freeways with cars moving at high speed. When you arrive at your destination, simply step out at the entrance and your car will enter park seek mode, automatically search for a spot and park itself. A tap on your phone summons it back to you."
Tesla.com/autopliot on Oct 20th, 2016:
"Tesla’s Enhanced Autopilot software is expected to complete validation and be rolled out to your car via an over-the-air update in December 2016, subject to regulatory approval." (Was deep into 2018 before that was close to true)
"These active safety technologies, including collision avoidance and automatic emergency braking, will become available in December 2016 and roll out through over-the-air software updates" Note this says WILL come out in 2016. It was late 2017 when they came out. On Jan 1st 2017 they removed the date and said "it has begun rolling out." (one of the features, to alpha testers)
And of course, the FSD description:
"All you will need to do is get in and tell your car where to go. If you don’t say anything, the car will look at your calendar and take you there as the assumed destination or just home if nothing is on the calendar. Your Tesla will figure out the optimal route, navigate urban streets (even without lane markings), manage complex intersections with traffic lights, stop signs and roundabouts, and handle densely packed freeways with cars moving at high speed. When you arrive at your destination, simply step out at the entrance and your car will enter park seek mode, automatically search for a spot and park itself. A tap on your phone summons it back to you."
Do you have FSD? I don't know if you answered your own poll, but do you plan on pursuing litigation?
The question becomes one of "will it be enough to make Tesla stop with the scamming?"
If so, it's worth it. I've resigned myself to knowing I'm never going to get what I paid for, and I'm never getting my money back. However, if Tesla lost a big enough case to stop selling vaporware and future customers were protected from Elon's chicanery, perhaps that's what is needed.
The problem though is that class action suits rarely hurt enough to matter. If the profits of being a liar exceed the losses of a class action suit… why not continue lying?
And due to administrative issues, it will take an extra 9 months before you get the $20 supercharging miles in your account.
Similar threads
