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Amber rear turn signals?
- Thread starter Stuart
- Start date
sp4rk
Banned
A video of the turn indicators can be found here: Tesla Model S P85+ EU spec interior and exterior - YouTube
It was already posted in this topic: Current differences between US and EU version?
It was already posted in this topic: Current differences between US and EU version?
mknox
Well-Known Member
Yep. Current US cars have the brake and turn signal combined, but you need discrete brake and left/right turn indicator signals for these to work. Traditional cars did this with individual wires, but maybe (probably) Tesla does it in software at the tail light itself.
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As far as I know, Euro-spec lights are perfectly legal in Canada (just not required). I replaced a set of junky plastic headlights with Euro-spec glass, self-leveling H4 units with no issues in the past. If so, the Euro Model S tail lights should be just fine here. (Personally, I prefer the all red lights, although I do prefer discrete brake and turn signal elements).
Does anyone else want amber rear blinkers?
Seeing as how studies have shown a reduction in accidents with the use of amber rear blinkers, why wouldn't the "world's safest car" offer these to the USDM? I would love to modify my tail lights, but what would be the rear blinker (smaller "U" shape in the outer light) is red and also used with the brake light. Maybe I need to wait and see if they pop up on Ebay over there, someday
Seeing as how studies have shown a reduction in accidents with the use of amber rear blinkers, why wouldn't the "world's safest car" offer these to the USDM? I would love to modify my tail lights, but what would be the rear blinker (smaller "U" shape in the outer light) is red and also used with the brake light. Maybe I need to wait and see if they pop up on Ebay over there, someday
I just started a thread in the "ordering / delivering" section about ordering amber rear blinkers and came across this fine thread.
As for people wondering about the tail lamps (Model S) here is a USDM unit for sale:
2012 2013 Tesla Model s Brand New Left Taillight | eBay
I wonder if each tail light is a CAN bus node which the light pattern is dictated by the system firmware. I also have a slight hunch that both the USDM and euro tail lights are the same and the little "U" part has both red and amber LEDs. It would make the most sense to have a single part that works in both markets. If that's the case, swapping them out will do nothing. The only way to verify this would be to have someone across the pond remove the three nuts and single plug to check the part numbers. If they are the same as the US version, then it's as "simple" as telling the car to change from red program to amber program.
Or, someone over here can cut their tail light open and see if there are both red and amber LEDs.
As for people wondering about the tail lamps (Model S) here is a USDM unit for sale:
2012 2013 Tesla Model s Brand New Left Taillight | eBay
I wonder if each tail light is a CAN bus node which the light pattern is dictated by the system firmware. I also have a slight hunch that both the USDM and euro tail lights are the same and the little "U" part has both red and amber LEDs. It would make the most sense to have a single part that works in both markets. If that's the case, swapping them out will do nothing. The only way to verify this would be to have someone across the pond remove the three nuts and single plug to check the part numbers. If they are the same as the US version, then it's as "simple" as telling the car to change from red program to amber program.
Or, someone over here can cut their tail light open and see if there are both red and amber LEDs.
Check out the Ebay link I posted. It doesn't look like the charge port is attached.
Yeah, I think the chargeport area exists on both sides of the car (though only one is used). Probably so that they could switch it on EU models easily.
passion4audio
member
While the amber turn signals "may" not look as blended in with the entire package, visually, I'm 100 percent FOR them due to being easier to spot.
So, do we do a petition.org or how would this work? A bunch of people just saying "I would rather have ...." on a forum doesn't always get their attention. I've already called customer service to see if amber tails can be put on mine during the build, and he said something about the red ones are for the NA market and the amber ones are for everywhere else.
I call BS and want my car to be the safest in crash tests AND safest at avoiding crashes altogether!
I'm going to post on their FB page about this. Everyone that wants ambers or at least the CHOICE of ambers, feel free to reply.
I call BS and want my car to be the safest in crash tests AND safest at avoiding crashes altogether!
I'm going to post on their FB page about this. Everyone that wants ambers or at least the CHOICE of ambers, feel free to reply.
strider
Active Member
It is NOT in fact, BS. It's because of US DOT regulations. The US DOT requires a minimum SURFACE AREA for brake lights and turn signals. 7.75in^2 each. So if you look at the euro lights on like a Corvette, the brake light lens is smaller because the amber turn signal takes up part of the area. That is what is not legal in the US. They need the whole area to be the brake light and the whole area again to be the turn signal in order to satisfy the surface area requirement. In the rest of the world they just have a luminosity requirement, only the US (AFAIK) has this surface area requirement in addition to luminosity. So if you want a compact light cluster, the same lens needs to do double duty. So it becomes a function vs form thing - if you want small light clusters you have to go w/ red brake lights.Seeing as how studies have shown a reduction in accidents with the use of amber rear blinkers, why wouldn't the "world's safest car" offer these to the USDM? I would love to modify my tail lights, but what would be the rear blinker (smaller "U" shape in the outer light) is red and also used with the brake light. Maybe I need to wait and see if they pop up on Ebay over there, someday
In other cars (VW's come to mind) you have to reprogram the car's computer to tell it is a Euro-spec model so it know how to activate the separate red and amber lights. My fear w/ the Model S is that "flag" that tells it is a Euro car is used by a bunch of other systems such that if you were able to change that flag to make the lights work it would break lots of other stuff.
mknox
Well-Known Member
Can't speak to US DOT, but I always thought US and Canadian regulations were pretty close in this regard (not 100%, but close). I was given to understand that EU-spec tail lights, while not required, are legal here. Anyone know for sure?
strider
Active Member
As I understand it the EU only has a luminosity requirement so as long as the lights are bright enough they can be whatever shape/size. In the US, separate amber turn signals are legal but you must satisfy the surface area requirement for the brake lights. I haven't measured it but I assume if you remove the inner "c" of lights from the brake light then the Model S will not meet the brake light surface area requirement. If it did I assume Tesla would have built the car this way as it would be simpler/cheaper to have a single taillight used worldwide.
Gizmotoy
Active Member
I was surprised to see that the red LED ring on the S didn't have an amber LED ring right along it. Separate turn signals are a good thing.
mknox
Well-Known Member
True. Makes you wonder why Tesla didn't consider this in their tail light design from the get-go.
One significant problem with rear amber turn signal lights is that when people turn on their emergency flasher you can't tell the difference between the front and rear of the car. This is particularly a problem on two lane roads in heavy rain when some drivers use their flashers to indicate they are going slowly. The other problem the bright amber flashes 'hide' brakes lights.
A stopped car is a stopped car. It doesn't matter which way it's facing. Just don't hit it
mknox
Well-Known Member
I agree with this. Many years ago when amber signals were just coming on the scene I came across flashing yellow lights on the right shoulder on a foggy night. It threw me because I thought I was looking at the front of some car facing the wrong way until I remembered that amber rear flashers were becoming popular. That is, until headlights came on and scared the crap out of me. I was looking at a car facing the wrong way. I didn't hit it (thanks, Chris TX!)
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