Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Another AutoPilot Easter Egg NOT!!!!

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
That was only in reference to the snake charger. He was unequivocal about what wk057 alluded to: "You'll be able to summon the car if you're on private property (you have to be on private property). You can actually summon the car and the car will come to wherever you are."

I guess we both are hearing the video and the words he says differently. Without trying to post a transcript, to my mind, the relevant parts are:
6:47 - Let's look at the various elements of how we are doing autopilot
8:45 - the car can do almost anything. we are able to do lane keeping, automatic cruise control, active emergency breaking, it will self park -- automatic parallel parking or if you are going to go into a garage
9:12 - in fact when you get home you will be able to step out of your car and have it go into your garage including it will open the door and then go in and park itself
9:25 -- then something I'd like to do (in fact many of the engineers are hearing this for the first time).... (emphasis mine)
9:34 -- have the charge connector plug itself in...we'll probably do something like that
9:55 --- and then going a step further, you will be able to summon your car if you're on private property....you could actually summon the car and it will come to wherever you are.
10:31 -- it can actually go a step farther than that which is if you have your calendar turned on, it will meet you there.

So it all goes to how you listen to the remarks. In my experience, presentations like this are carefully worded and prepared (much like Steve Jobs rehearsed and rehearsed and rehearsed what seemed like "off the cuff" product introductions. To my mind:

- at 6:47 he introduces autopilot and points out the various parts of how they have implemented it
- at 8:45 he describes what it can do
- at 9:12 he goes on to say that the car can actually open the garage door and park itself.
*** NOTE: AP1.0 can do everyone of these things
- at 9:25 he says there is something he'd like to do the engineers don't know about yet -- the automated charging snake so you could get out of the car, have it park itself and plug itself in.
- at 9:55 he says "and going a step farther, you will be able to..." To me this is NOT a promise about AP1.0 nor is everything that follows. Rather these are things that he says are on the future product development list for Tesla Autopilot as a program.

Of course when he said this, no one was thinking of AP2.0....we had just heard of AP1.0! To the way I listen to/am interpreting the remarks, everything after 9:25 is something that is not present in autopilot and items that he has placed on the future capabilities list. To me, it actually appears that Elon has delivered on everything he said he would for AP1.0 in that presentation (specifically lane keeping, automatic cruise control, active emergency breaking. automatic parallel parking and the ability to get out of the car before it is in the garage and then have it park itself there). In fact,Tesla has delivered MORE than this list to AP1.0 because he did not mention the ability to change lanes while on autopilot (which it will do if you move the turn signal stalk) nor the ability to do perpendicular parking.

He says he'd like to do the snake and Tesla has demonstrated the snake capability, they just haven't released it to the public for purchase but indications are he intends to release this to superchargers in the future, so let's call that one "in progress".

They he says "going a step farther" and talks about other features. Going a step farther is not defined -- it could mean further development with this hardware, or further development expanding the capabilities of the autopilot program with the next iteration of software or the next iteration of hardware and software. I simply don't read it as a promise that it will come with AP1.0.

To be honest, I hadn't watched this video in over a year and it was a good exercise. For all the recent complaints about autopilot being dumbed down or made useless, it is interesting to note that AP1.0 did achieve all 4 promises (lane keeping, TACC, AEB, auto parallel parking and ability to exit car and have it open the garage door and park itself). And for AP1.0 users, it STILL can do all 4 of those things....

Just my two cents' worth. Obviously others may disagree with how I am interpreting his words....
 
  • Informative
Reactions: Canuck
I'm just curious what the deceleration rate is when it goes into unsafe and stupid mode, dropping the speed down 15/20 MPH. Does it slow down enough to the point where the brake lights activate? The thought of having a new Autopilot "brake check" feature seems dangerous.

After hearing about these slow down issues, I've been cancelling/ignoring the daily nagging update of new firmware because I like how Autopilot is behaving at the moment. I was a bit perturbed about the nanny-features coming into the firmware such as the 3-strikes-and-you're-out feature, but this unexpected slow down seems unacceptable and dangerous for those who know how to use AP1 properly. I don't want to see for myself what the behavior is like because once you upgrade, you can't go back. This new behavior appears to increase the chance of accidents and I don't want to have someone accidentally rear-end me regardless of whose fault it is.
 
I personally think you are wise to wait. Clearly there is another update coming soon (hopefully this week) in version 8.1. While that gives a lot of capabilities to the 2.0 cars, one would think that whatever variant of 8.1 is pushed to the 1.0 cars will address issues including (hopefully) many of the problems people have been complaining about with the latest software release
 
For all we know Tesla is being forced to do every change people complain about to avoid NHTSA issuing an order to turn off AP1.0 in its entirety. It could very well be part of the ongoing investigation and negotiations between Tesla and NHTSA after the fatalities and other accidents involving AP1.0. No orders have been issued so that tells me concessions have been agreed upon. Plus, this only makes sense to me given how Tesla likes to push the boundaries and not restrict them. For all we know, Tesla could be resisting every change, but agreeing to certain concessions only to allow AP1.0 to be kept alive. My criticism of Tesla is that they oversell AP1.0, and while they have some small print caveat about it being "beta", they need to present the beta caveat in large bold font so every potential purchaser knows what they are getting into, including the fact that what you have today may not be there tomorrow.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Mattzilla
I guess we both are hearing the video and the words he says differently. Without trying to post a transcript, to my mind, the relevant parts are:
6:47 - Let's look at the various elements of how we are doing autopilot
8:45 - the car can do almost anything. we are able to do lane keeping, automatic cruise control, active emergency breaking, it will self park -- automatic parallel parking or if you are going to go into a garage
9:12 - in fact when you get home you will be able to step out of your car and have it go into your garage including it will open the door and then go in and park itself
9:25 -- then something I'd like to do (in fact many of the engineers are hearing this for the first time).... (emphasis mine)
9:34 -- have the charge connector plug itself in...we'll probably do something like that
9:55 --- and then going a step further, you will be able to summon your car if you're on private property....you could actually summon the car and it will come to wherever you are.
10:31 -- it can actually go a step farther than that which is if you have your calendar turned on, it will meet you there.

So it all goes to how you listen to the remarks. In my experience, presentations like this are carefully worded and prepared (much like Steve Jobs rehearsed and rehearsed and rehearsed what seemed like "off the cuff" product introductions. To my mind:

- at 6:47 he introduces autopilot and points out the various parts of how they have implemented it
- at 8:45 he describes what it can do
- at 9:12 he goes on to say that the car can actually open the garage door and park itself.
*** NOTE: AP1.0 can do everyone of these things
- at 9:25 he says there is something he'd like to do the engineers don't know about yet -- the automated charging snake so you could get out of the car, have it park itself and plug itself in.
- at 9:55 he says "and going a step farther, you will be able to..." To me this is NOT a promise about AP1.0 nor is everything that follows. Rather these are things that he says are on the future product development list for Tesla Autopilot as a program.

Of course when he said this, no one was thinking of AP2.0....we had just heard of AP1.0! To the way I listen to/am interpreting the remarks, everything after 9:25 is something that is not present in autopilot and items that he has placed on the future capabilities list. To me, it actually appears that Elon has delivered on everything he said he would for AP1.0 in that presentation (specifically lane keeping, automatic cruise control, active emergency breaking. automatic parallel parking and the ability to get out of the car before it is in the garage and then have it park itself there). In fact,Tesla has delivered MORE than this list to AP1.0 because he did not mention the ability to change lanes while on autopilot (which it will do if you move the turn signal stalk) nor the ability to do perpendicular parking.

He says he'd like to do the snake and Tesla has demonstrated the snake capability, they just haven't released it to the public for purchase but indications are he intends to release this to superchargers in the future, so let's call that one "in progress".

They he says "going a step farther" and talks about other features. Going a step farther is not defined -- it could mean further development with this hardware, or further development expanding the capabilities of the autopilot program with the next iteration of software or the next iteration of hardware and software. I simply don't read it as a promise that it will come with AP1.0.

To be honest, I hadn't watched this video in over a year and it was a good exercise. For all the recent complaints about autopilot being dumbed down or made useless, it is interesting to note that AP1.0 did achieve all 4 promises (lane keeping, TACC, AEB, auto parallel parking and ability to exit car and have it open the garage door and park itself). And for AP1.0 users, it STILL can do all 4 of those things....

Just my two cents' worth. Obviously others may disagree with how I am interpreting his words....

It takes a lot of mental gymnastics for me to predicate the rest of the talk on one off-hand remark he made about the snake charger. The idea of the car meeting you at the curb was well-covered in the media and Tesla certainly never clarified it if they didn't mean it. In fact they went on to put that claim up on their own web site (see below).

original-ap.png
 
For all we know Tesla is being forced to do every change people complain about to avoid NHTSA issuing an order to turn off AP1.0 in its entirety. It could very well be part of the ongoing investigation and negotiations between Tesla and NHTSA after the fatalities and other accidents involving AP1.0. No orders have been issued so that tells me concessions have been agreed upon. Plus, this only makes sense to me given how Tesla likes to push the boundaries and not restrict them. For all we know, Tesla could be resisting every change, but agreeing to certain concessions only to allow AP1.0 to be kept alive. My criticism of Tesla is that they oversell AP1.0, and while they have some small print caveat about it being "beta", they need to present the beta caveat in large bold font so every potential purchaser knows what they are getting into, including the fact that what you have today may not be there tomorrow.

If if was driven by NHTSA, Tesla should at least tell their customers and not surprise us with a feature and safety regression. At least give us the ability to turn off "stupid" with such caveats. It erodes trust in a company that plays those kind of games with our cars.
 
I still don't know how to get it to navigate to my next appointment without tapping on it (eg. tried "navigate to my next appointment" but no luck). And what Elon said about your calendar just wouldn't work as the calendar integration works through Bluetooth to your phone's Tesla app. So if your phone is out of range (basically outside of the car) the car can't know where and when you're going (yet) ;)
 
@drklain, you missed (conveniently omitted?) the parts about it reading stop signs and traffic lights, which were clearly touted as abilities of AP1 in the presentation. I also fully disagree that the off-hand comment regarding the snake charger invalidates the remainder of the presentation.

As others mentioned all of these promises were on the website and have since been removed after thousands of customers already purchased.
 
If if was driven by NHTSA, Tesla should at least tell their customers and not surprise us with a feature and safety regression.

Resolutions by way of agreements and concessions with the NHTSA likely involve a confidentiality clause. In fact, the entire process is mostly confidential. So perhaps Tesla can't do what you are asking.

At least give us the ability to turn off "stupid" with such caveats. It erodes trust in a company that plays those kind of games with our cars.

Why would the NHTSA allow that? The purpose of the ongoing investigation by the NHTSA is to attempt to put in place restrictions that will make AP1.0 safer. Allowing those restrictions to be turned off defeats that purpose.

I have no idea what is going on in the background but it certainly seems unfair to me for people to be blaming Tesla when it is entirely possible that Tesla may be battling just to keep AP1.0 alive.
 
Last edited:
Ah, the never ending NHTSA conspiracy theory, where the rabid Tesla fans insist that the NHTSA is going against their very mandate by secretly dictating things to one single manufacturer without letting anyone else in the world know. Never mind that they would want the most possible publicity on this so as to help other manufacturers avoid going against their wishes, never mind that they are mandated to be open and transparent. Never mind that they don't even have jurisdiction outside the USA. And never mind that all their public statements actually go against this very idea by saying how much they want to push for more driver assistance and greater autonomy. The Tesla fanboys insist that the NHTSA has taken the following unprecedented steps, none of which have never once been done in the entire history of the automobile:
- forced a secret recall that only the manufacturer is allowed to know about and deliberately hid it from the owners of the vehicle
- made it mandatory that all owners participate
- made it worldwide, even outside the USA

give it a rest!!!! there is a ZERO chance that this is due to an NHTSA request. ZERO. this is 100% Tesla's CHOICE to screw over their customers.
 
Certainly different interpretations of the same remarks. I guess I just look at it as logical sections: (1) what you get now, (2) what we hope to/plan on giving you. In my mind everything from the snake charger forward are (a) not existing at the time of the video and (b) stated as goals or future upgrades...but not necessarily to the existing hardware suite. Obviously others feel differently.

I do agree that other things were said in marketing materials, the website and by Owner-Advisors WRT Autopilot and it's capabilities. My comments on this were purely in response to the poster who posted Elon's video and said Elon had not delivered on what he said he would in the video....

the beauty of this is we don't all have to agree and everyone is entitled to his/her own opinion and interpretation as to what Elon meant during that video or any of his other public statements/tweets/etc.! :)
 
the beauty of this is we don't all have to agree and everyone is entitled to his/her own opinion and interpretation as to what Elon meant during that video or any of his other public statements/tweets/etc.! :)
Don't worry. We will very shortly have the official legal decision on what he meant there, and in many other places. They don't get to promise one thing and deliver something completely different and get away with it forever.
 
Resolutions by way of agreements and concessions with the NHTSA likely involve a confidentiality clause. In fact, the entire process is mostly confidential. So perhaps Tesla can't do what you are asking.



Why would the NHTSA allow that? The purpose of the ongoing investigation by the NHTSA is to attempt to put in place restrictions that will make AP1.0 safer. Allowing those restrictions to be turned off defeats that purpose.

I have no idea what is going on in the background but it certainly seems unfair to me for people to be blaming Tesla when it is entirely possible that Tesla may be battling just to keep AP1.0 alive.

It's important to keep in mind what separated AP from similar systems on the market. What separated it was how long you could go without being nagged, and how well it performed overall.

With 8.0 Tesla added the nags, and the lockout. Most of us accepted the changes because we felt like it was necessary to match what the NHTSA wanted. Where we were told by Tesla that the NHTSA was okay with the changes. I can't speak for anyone else, but I believed that everything was taken care of.

With this latest update it really came out of left field with no reason. It landed in an update without being in the release notes. The only information on it is from from some media websites.

Now I'm not sure it really matters how it landed. All we know is it doesn't work. So it needs to removed ASAP.
 
  • Helpful
Reactions: Lex
Last edited:
I'm a little concerned that there are disagreements about "the bigger picture" that have nothing to do with this specific update.

The most important thing to keep in mind is that this update is unsafe for ALL OF US that use AP.

There should not be any disagreement about that. There is plenty of data collected so for that shows it slowing down the car when it shouldn't.
 
  • Love
Reactions: davidc18
Ah, the never ending NHTSA conspiracy theory, where the rabid Tesla fans insist that the NHTSA is going against their very mandate by secretly dictating things to one single manufacturer without letting anyone else in the world know. Never mind that they would want the most possible publicity on this so as to help other manufacturers avoid going against their wishes, never mind that they are mandated to be open and transparent. Never mind that they don't even have jurisdiction outside the USA. And never mind that all their public statements actually go against this very idea by saying how much they want to push for more driver assistance and greater autonomy. The Tesla fanboys insist that the NHTSA has taken the following unprecedented steps, none of which have never once been done in the entire history of the automobile:
- forced a secret recall that only the manufacturer is allowed to know about and deliberately hid it from the owners of the vehicle
- made it mandatory that all owners participate
- made it worldwide, even outside the USA

give it a rest!!!! there is a ZERO chance that this is due to an NHTSA request. ZERO. this is 100% Tesla's CHOICE to screw over their customers.

It's unfortunate that you cannot have a respectful discussion without personal attacks and telling me to "give it a rest". I've never told you to stop posting. You do know that you can place me on ignore, right? Please do that because telling me to stop posting will only be ignored by me.

"We have done most of these changes with NHTSA and I don’t want to speak for them but they appear to be pretty happy with the changes and the reactions from them is quite positive."

Transcript: Elon Musk’s press conference about Tesla Autopilot under v8.0 update [Part 6]

Great thanks. That's exactly what I thought was going on in the background. As said by another member here who has worked with the NHTSA, in reply to @green1's comments above, which he repeats every time this issue comes up, this is exactly how the NHTSA implements changes. Moreover, Transport Canada follows, and often copies to the letter, the NHTSA, so @green1's comments about "jurisdiction" also makes no sense. There's not a chance we will have different AP1.0 behaviour in Canada than in the US. But right, it's all a great "conspiracy theory" from this rabid Tesla fanboy who wrote above:

My criticism of Tesla is that they oversold AP1.0, and while they have some small print caveat about it being "beta", they need to present the beta caveat in large bold font so every potential purchaser knows what they are getting into, including the fact that what you have today may not be there tomorrow.

Yes, that's one rabid fanboy! ... :rolleyes:
 
Last edited:
  • Helpful
Reactions: Lanny
I have no idea what is going on in the background but it certainly seems unfair to me for people to be blaming Tesla when it is entirely possible that Tesla may be battling just to keep AP1.0 alive.

You are making guesses as to why they have made changes like it was a secret conspiracy between Tesla and NHTSA to keep AP 1.0 alive without any real facts. What we do know is these changes that have been put in place seems unsafe with an increased chance of getting rear-ended as it slows the car down without any forewarning or alert other than perhaps a little triangle on the dash.
 
You are making guesses as to why they have made changes like it was a secret conspiracy between Tesla and NHTSA to keep AP 1.0 alive without any real facts. What we do know is these changes that have been put in place seems unsafe with an increased chance of getting rear-ended as it slows the car down without any forewarning or alert other than perhaps a little triangle on the dash.

Elon said, as posted above, "We have done most of these changes with NHTSA and I don’t want to speak for them but they appear to be pretty happy with the changes and the reactions from them is quite positive." This is how the NHTSA works with automakers. No conspiracy theory is required to understand how the real world works. While you may find the changes "unsafe" it may be that the NHTSA has a different view. Also, I am only offering a differing viewpoint. Of course, I could be wrong. But you don't need to label someone with a different point of view as presenting a theory that requires a conspiracy. That would make sense to me if I was arguing like Alex Jones and spewing out some real nonsense but I think my arguments make the most sense as to why you are seeing these changes. But even if they don't they should be able to be challenged without calling it a conspiracy theory.