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Another 'Sudden Acceleration' lawsuit

Discussion in 'Tesla' started by Joelc, Dec 30, 2016.

  1. Joelc

    Joelc Member

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    Tesla owner files lawsuit in California claiming sudden acceleration.

    What's next? Blaming it was on autopilot?
     
  2. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    Yet another owner who does not understand that the vehicle logs will demonstrate that he applied pressure to the accelerator pedal, resulting in his car coming to rest in his living room instead of his garage.
     
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  3. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if a defect in the (what is most likely) rheostat in the accelerator mechanism could cause this? It would log as someone applying pressure to the pedal (due to a hardware defect) even though pressure was not applied.
     
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  4. Zythryn

    Zythryn MS 70D, MX 90D

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    My understanding is that this is not a single sensor issue.
    So, pressure and pedal position of both brake and accelerator are measured. There may be more that can corroborate the readings.
    For two to four separate sensors to temporarily fail at the same time...
    Well, let's just say I don't like their odds.
     
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  5. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    Not normally. Usually there is a minimum of two position reading sensors. Any conflict in the readings sets the accelerator position to 0 and throws a trouble code.
     
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  6. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    I don't think this is a first complaint of unintended accelerations but this is a first to sue.

    It will be interesting to see how Model X owner Ji Chang Son could prove that he did not mistaken accelerator for brake pedal.
     
  7. oktane

    oktane Banned

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    Perhaps logs will show simultaneous activations of the brake and accelerator pedal. That's probably the only hope.
     
  8. Xenoilphobe

    Xenoilphobe Active Member

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    Totally BS...
     
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  9. MP3Mike

    MP3Mike Active Member

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    Unlikely that it was both pedals as I think if a Tesla detects both pedals it cuts the power to the motor and puts an alert up on the IC. (Though I'm not positive in exactly which conditions that happens.)
     
  10. NikeWings

    NikeWings Active Member

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  11. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    Driver is responsible for correct placement of foot to a correct pedal.

    I don't see how improper use of 2 pedals could be justified in court.
     
  12. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    I'm sure the Model S accelerator pedal is at least as sophisticated as the Roadster accelerator pedal, and I know how that one works:

    There are two rheostats. One increases in resistance as you push the pedal, and the other decreases in resistance. If the controller doesn't see both rheostats moving in lock step - in opposite directions - then it refuses to apply power and flags an error to the console.

    That's really fail safe - it's hard to imagine any fault that would emulate the two rheostats moving in opposite directions.

    Tesla claims the pedal was to the floor. They're almost certainly correct in that assessment. Yet another classic case of confusing the brake pedal for the accelerator. Happens all the time on all models of vehicles. I've seen it happen, and I've seen the aftermath from two other incidents.
     
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  13. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    So, this is a reason for why it is a first for Tesla unintended acceleration lawsuit:

    “Before filing his class action lawsuit against Tesla, Mr. Son had threatened to use his celebrity status in Korea to hurt Tesla unless we agreed to make a financial payment and acknowledge that the vehicle accelerated on its own. However, the evidence clearly shows the vehicle was not at fault. Our policy is to stand by the evidence and not to give in to ultimatums.”
     
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  14. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    “For example, the vehicle will cut motor torque in cases where the accelerator pedal and the brake pedal are simultaneously pressed. Furthermore, current Tesla software uses the Autopilot sensor suite to distinguish potential pedal misapplication events from normal cases when a driver intentionally presses the accelerator pedal. In cases of unambiguous pedal misapplication, the vehicle cuts torque to mitigate the effects of the driver’s error.”
     
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  15. oktane

    oktane Banned

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    Great in theory, clearly didn't work. At least that's what the Tesla on the sofa tells me.
     
  16. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    I am not sure what theory are you referring to.

    Mr Son did not say that he pressed 2 pedals at the same time.

    Tesla did not say that Vehicle Logs showed that a human pressed 2 pedals at the same time.

    The news report did not say which pedal did Mr Son claimed to apply at the time of the collision. It said that he was "pulling into his driveway.."

    Tesla claimed "the crash was the result of Mr. Son pressing the accelerator pedal all the way to 100%.”
     
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  17. Jason S

    Jason S Model S Sig Perf (P85)

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    I think oktane may be referring to the 'In cases of unambiguous pedal misapplication, the vehicle cuts torque to mitigate the effects of the driver’s error.”
    Of course the vehicle still has plenty of power to spare so cutting torque is not the same as stopping. Vehicle is still applying power due to the accelerator pedal being at 100%.
     
  18. Phil Seastrand

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    No, when they saw "cutting torque" they mean cutting to zero. I've had this situation happen several times when pulling a trailer up a hill from a stop. Not only does it cut the torque to zero, it beeps and flashes a warning on the dash display.
     
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  19. azred

    azred Member

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    Gven the fact Teslas' heavy regenerative braking almost makes the brake pedal obsolete, is it really surprising that one could inadvertently hit the accelerator convinced that he or she was braking? I'll admit though the simplest and most likely explanation for any of these cases is dishonesty on the part of the drivers.
     
  20. 182RG

    182RG Free The Service Manuals From Tyranny

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    Saving face is a hugely powerful part of the Asian culture. They will blatantly lie, cheat, and steal to avoid public embarrassment. Seriously, not trying to be insensitive. Unless someone has witnessed it with interaction, you may not understand it.

    Whatever You Do, Try Not to Make Someone "Lose Face" in Asia
     
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