Anti-roll bar(s) in AWD and P-AWD Model 3

[hdAge]

Now that the report of first P-AWD test drive is out, I noticed that it mentions having two anti-roll bars (front and rear) which would be great for cornering.

Wall Street Journal reviews M3 Performance

The Model 3’s uncanny stability while cornering is mostly the product of its lithium-battery keel; but Tesla didn’t skimp on the suspension bits: upper and lower A arms (aluminum and steel) with virtual steer axis geometry, twin-tube coilovers and anti-roll bar in front; in the rear, a multi-link geometry, also with twin-tube shocks and anti-roll bar.

The LR RWD seems to just have the front anti-roll bar, which makes sense.
2017 Tesla Model 3 Specifications

Does anyone have an idea if the non-P AWD also comes with two anti-roll bars? Obviously there is no AWD car out yet, but given that its a AWD, does it mean that it comes with anti-roll bars in both front and rear yet? If not, this would persuade me to change my booking from AWD to P-AWD, while I still can.

Secondly I'm hoping this is not in the $5k performance upgrade package, as I already have plans to getting all those items (20" wheels, rear spoiler, suspension drop) after market.

 

[Skione65]

Now that the report of first P-AWD test drive is out, I noticed that it mentions having two anti-roll bars (front and rear) which would be great for cornering.

Wall Street Journal reviews M3 Performance

The Model 3’s uncanny stability while cornering is mostly the product of its lithium-battery keel; but Tesla didn’t skimp on the suspension bits: upper and lower A arms (aluminum and steel) with virtual steer axis geometry, twin-tube coilovers and anti-roll bar in front; in the rear, a multi-link geometry, also with twin-tube shocks and anti-roll bar.

The LR RWD seems to just have the front anti-roll bar, which makes sense.
2017 Tesla Model 3 Specifications

Does anyone have an idea if the non-P AWD also comes with two anti-roll bars? Obviously there is no AWD car out yet, but given that its a AWD, does it mean that it comes with anti-roll bars in both front and rear yet? If not, this would persuade me to change my booking from AWD to P-AWD, while I still can.

Secondly I'm hoping this is not in the $5k performance upgrade package, as I already have plans to getting all those items (20" wheels, rear spoiler, suspension drop) after market.

@hdAge,

Agreed.....that’s the first thing that leapt off the page at me when I read the review. You may need the PUO to get those anti-rolls.

Ski

 

[jelloslug]

If they are not there in the non-P version or they are a part of the Performance package, installing them after the fact should be an easy task. Seeing how streamlined the body production is for the 3, I cannot see Tesla omitting the mounting holes on the non-P versions.

 

[Knightshade]

All models have front and rear bars already according to this:

Exclusive: Tesla Model 3 Long Range First Test - Motor Trend

confirmed here-

2018 Tesla Model 3: Everything We Know | Feature | Car and Driver

anti-roll bars at both ends.

For the most part that WSJ article seems like he cut and pasted a RWD review and added a couple of comments about the tires and horsepower (mistakenly listing the AWD not P number for that to boot)

 

[hdAge]

All models have front and rear bars already according to this:

Exclusive: Tesla Model 3 Long Range First Test - Motor Trend

confirmed here-

2018 Tesla Model 3: Everything We Know | Feature | Car and Driver

For the most part that WSJ article seems like he cut and pasted a RWD review and added a couple of comments about the tires and horsepower (mistakenly listing the AWD not P number for that to boot)

@Knightshade Thanks. So it looks like all Model 3's will have both anti-roll bars, this is great. I want to stay with AWD, but yet another news article that I ready today makes me want to performance model It looks like with the right setup, we can get 3.3 from 0-60.

Tesla Model 3 Performance 0-60 time could improve to under 3.3 seconds with upgraded tires, says Elon Musk

 

[Snow Drift]

I've never had a car without sway bars (roll bars). The Performance probably just comes with stiffer sway bars than the normal cars.

The WRX/STI guys always buy aftermarket sway bars for tighter cornering.

 

[Knightshade]

I've never had a car without sway bars (roll bars). The Performance probably just comes with stiffer sway bars than the normal cars.

Or maybe exactly the same ones.

Thusfar Tesla has indicated no actual difference in suspension other than the P with the 20s (and only with the 20s) sits 0.39 inches lower... it remains unclear if that's entirely from changing the geometry for the 20s (as the optional 20" package already does for other 3s) or if there's actual substantive changes to things.


This, and the lack of any info on the added control over stability systems in the software for the P, are on the list of "Stuff that would probably get more people to actually switch to the P if Tesla would bother explaining it- unless the explanation turns out to be it's not really any different on the P"

It looks like with the right setup, we can get 3.3 from 0-60.

Sure... and AWD can probably get 4.3 from 0-60 if they do the same.... and RWD in the high 4s... Tesla picked range over traction with all their tire choices, even on the P with upgrade package (heck, even moreso on the other versions of the car)

So if Musk is confirming all the "official" 0-60 times are with the stock-from-the-factory tires that bodes really well for every person who ordered the 18s and plans to swap the "good" PS 4s tires on them.[/user]

 

[hdAge]

Thusfar Tesla has indicated no actual difference in suspension other than the P with the 20s (and only with the 20s) sits 0.39 inches lower... it remains unclear if that's entirely from changing the geometry for the 20s (as the optional 20" package already does for other 3s) or if there's actual substantive changes to things.

This, and the lack of any info on the added control over stability systems in the software for the P, are on the list of "Stuff that would probably get more people to actually switch to the P if Tesla would bother explaining it- unless the explanation turns out to be it's not really any different on the P" [/user]

We will hopefully know more details about the Performance model in the next few weeks. It will be very interesting to see if Tesla manages the performance bump purely in software compared to AWD. We will certainly get a chance to experience the test drive very soon.

Sure... and AWD can probably get 4.3 from 0-60 if they do the same.... and RWD in the high 4s... Tesla picked range over traction with all their tire choices, even on the P with upgrade package (heck, even moreso on the other versions of the car)

So if Musk is confirming all the "official" 0-60 times are with the stock-from-the-factory tires that bodes really well for every person who ordered the 18s and plans to swap the "good" PS 4s tires on them.[/user]

This is one thing that I always like about Tesla, their numbers are conservative. Also I like how some time back Model S got a software update that took the 0-60 from 5.2 to 4.2 secs. Even with the conservative numbers for AWD, I'm thinking about upgrading to Performance, kinda getting addicted without even test driving

 

[Knightshade]

This is one thing that I always like about Tesla, their numbers are conservative. Also I like how some time back Model S got a software update that took the 0-60 from 5.2 to 4.2 secs. Even with the conservative numbers for AWD, I'm thinking about upgrading to Performance, kinda getting addicted without even test driving

well, one tricky thing here....

On the S when they list 0-60 specs on the regular models, it's without rollout. With the P models specifically it's WITH rollout.

This makes the P numbers look roughly .2-.3 seconds better than they really are compared to non-P

Assuming they're doing the same with the 3 the "real" difference between the AWD and P will be less than the 1 second it currently looks like... (and also explains why Tesla says 5.1 for the RWD, but Motor Trend got 4.8 with rollout).

So apples to apples (if the P # is with it) you're talking RWD at 4.8, AWD likely at 4.2-4.3, and the P still at 3.5. Obviously the P is still significantly quicker... but if all those #s are with "factory" tires one has to wonder what putting a real set of tires on will get you on top... (presumably 3.3 or better on the P anyway, maybe another tenth or two on the other models?)