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Any 300,000 mile Model S drivers out there?

Discussion in 'Model S: Driving Dynamics' started by Electricfan, Mar 6, 2016.

  1. Electricfan

    Electricfan Member

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  2. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    Note that the data is directly collected via telemetry (OnStar), the users do not enter the data.

    He logged 105K miles on just pure EV power. So certainly a Prius Killer.

    So you would compare his numbers to a 100,000 mile Model S. However, if you are playing with battery life, it would be for 500,000 mile Model S's due to the very high number of full charge cycles his Volt has endured.

    I would have never thought any EV would endure that many full charge cycles + regen charging. It is amazing what batteries are doing today.
     
  3. Electricfan

    Electricfan Member

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    #3 Electricfan, Mar 6, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2016
    Wow. I wasn't actually thinking about it that deep at all. But now that you mention it, his battery has been working hard! I'm going to go ask him if he's seen much loss in full charge miles. How can you tell he logged 105k EV miles?

    Edit, already asked and answered - 25 miles full charge. That's quite a loss. But then again, on a car with that many miles its very good.
     
  4. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    Volt Stats! Tracking real world usage of Chevy Volts in the wild... filter on EV miles high to low. There is a guy with 91k miles total miles with 91k miles on EV, with 99.8% of his miles on EV. And many people still say a Volt is ALWAYS a hybrid... :D

    Only about 2% of owners (1,800) are listed on Voltstats, so there may be cars with over 300,000 miles.
     
  5. cwerdna

    cwerdna Active Member

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  6. Electricfan

    Electricfan Member

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    I had forgotten that website. I entered my Volt, but for some reason the site keeps saying my car needs "reauthorization". I do it, but it still won't show up. Guess they don't like me!
     
  7. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    #7 McRat, Mar 6, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2016
    He says no battery degradation, but is only getting 25 miles per charge on snow tires, driving 150 highway miles each day, in 30°F weather with the heater on. That is not unusual to be honest. 1/3 loss of EPA range in the winter at freeway speeds on snow tires isn't that weird for any EV. I bought Volts for my two teen drivers. My daughter only gets 28 miles in the winter of EV range because she doesn't preheat the car, and uses the heater full blast. When I drive her car in the summer, I go past 40 miles routinely (2013).
     
  8. dhanson865

    dhanson865 Active Member

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    #8 dhanson865, Mar 6, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2016
    Keep in mind the Prius number is over 600,000 miles.

    299,999+ Mile Club | PriusChat


    • 2 fas 4 u - (2009 - 687,500)
    • brownsnoutuk (2005 - Reported ODO stuck at 299,999, later reported over 680,000 miles replaced engine at 400,000 but still has OEM battery, replace battery pack warning started around 650,000 miles)
    • M.I.G. Security (2005 - 489,895)
    • epop23 over 400,000 miles
    • ktang 2005 over 340,000 miles
    • priushippie (2003 - Totaled at 314,490 miles)

    and more that I didn't bother to update.

    brownsnoutuk last checked in that thread in 2015. He was talking about buying a new car instead of replacing the battery pack since it'd cost $1,500 to $2,000 to replace it.


    "2 fas 4 u" is another special case

    He went through a 2009 Prius that went 687,500, then a 2012 Prius V (wagon) that went 369,530 miles, and is now on a 2014 Prius (not sure if wagon or not). I think he does medical supply deliveries in FL. It only took him something like 25 to 30 months to do 687,500 miles. Just insane. I'm pretty sure he didn't replace the engine or battery pack but he sure as heck did a lot of oil changes. That's something like 2 or 3 oil changes a month.
     
  9. chriSharek

    chriSharek Member

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    #9 chriSharek, Mar 6, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2016
    Unsure how anyone can bring the Prius into this thread and discussion. COMPLETELY different than the Volt. I'm at 88,000 miles on my 2011 Volt and 75,000 of those are completely emission free.

    I wish GM would actually educate the public on why it's such a great car ...
     
  10. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    #10 McRat, Mar 6, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2016
    680k in 2 years is about 1000 miles per day, or 20 hours per day driving. Check my math.

    Are the Prius Stats done with telemetry like the Volt stats are? Or can you just fib about it?

    It's really common to go over 500,000 miles hotshotting on a pickup on the original engine. That means towing, and that means big horsepower, not a little lightly stressed engine.

    Neither are EV powertrains.
     
  11. dhanson865

    dhanson865 Active Member

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    #11 dhanson865, Mar 6, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2016
    It was over 2 years, as in more than 24 months, I just don't know the exact number of months so I wrote 20 to 24 months by way of a mental math mistake. I should have added months to 24 instead of subtracting months or I should have subtracted from 36 months. He literally does drive all day and a bit of night, sometimes sleeps in the car if needed. Go read the thread if you want more details.

    As to how the thread was done, they used photos of the dash for the mileage and anyone that went over 299,999 miles had to buy a new dash unit and have the dealer install it or their odometer stopped working. The high mileage guys are all on their 2nd or 3rd odometer.

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    I bring it in because the Prius is the baseline I use for cost per mile and reliability / TCO and it isn't uncommon to see them hit hundreds of thousands of miles.

    You'll find there are a several Tesla motors club members that have come to Tesla from the Prius or the Leaf and thus make comparisons to them.

    In my case the progression is Prius -> Leaf -> Tesla?

    I might be getting a Model 3 or maybe I end up with a CPO S or X. But if you don't see how the Prius was the "gateway drug" that prepped hundreds of thousands of drivers to consider a proper EV then you just have a different mindset.

    Myself I don't consider the Volt a proper EV. I'll be glad to consider a Bolt but I won't buy another car with a gas engine in it. I'll only use the cars with gas engines in them as a source of past data for comparing to my current EV choices. But once someone brought the Volt into it the Prius is fair game as well. It was the first mass market hybrid and was the better hybrid for a long time before Toyota dropped the ball and forced people to jump to other manufacturers to get a proper EV.
     
  12. Electricfan

    Electricfan Member

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    I mainly wanted to know what the highest mileage Model S has on it now. Has one hit 200k yet?

    The Prius started it all - a high mileage gas car that used a battery and electric motor. Agree its too bad Toyota didn't see the "light" and go for a pure EV. Very bad mistake on someone's part in upper management.

    I disagree - the Volt is a pure EV - lots of people don't use gas in their Volt. But some do - for them its not a pure EV. How can you argue a car that goes for months without using a drop of gas isn't an EV? I did that in mine. But who cares anyway? I don't. Call it what you like. The Volt is an awesome car. I am tetering on the edge of trading my 2011 for a 2017, but then another part of me wants a Bolt. And part of me never wants to let go of the 2011 for sentimental reasons. Decisions decisions!
     
  13. Evbwcaer

    Evbwcaer Member

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    As a proud former Insight owner, I've gotta correct you and note that the Insight started the hybrid era (and at 61/70mpg, has still not been challenged at all by a non plug-in, and that was about 17 years ago)
     
  14. McRat

    McRat Active Member

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    #14 McRat, Mar 6, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2016
    That's what I was thinking. The Insight arrived in 2000, and if you look at Fuelly.com where real owners post their mileage, Toyota has not caught them yet. Honda Insight Mileage | Fuelly

    Toyota is sort of like Apple. Apple did not invent the desktop, but they made it popular at first.
    Apple did not invent the MP3 player, they just made it popular.
    Apple did not invent the data phone, they just made it popular.

    Similarly, Toyota is has done well building a brand image and have risen to the top. But they have never really been too much into new innovation. They are promoting the Mirai as the first Fuel Cell car, but I don't think that's the case either.
     
  15. cwerdna

    cwerdna Active Member

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    #15 cwerdna, Mar 6, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 6, 2016
    So, ALL 75K miles were from 0 (GHG) emission electricity sources (e.g. nuclear, solar or wind)?


    • No, 2 fas 4 u hit 465K miles on his 09 Prius before trading it on for a '12 Prius v wagon that you refer to below.

      I added him to Lifespan/Operating costs - Prius Wiki - Wikia, where we also collect info about high mileage Prius family vehicles.
      That's right: Prius v: 300,000 miles club | Page 10 | PriusChat. That one didn't hold up as well as he had to change the engine at around 350K (Prius v: 300,000 miles club | Page 8 | PriusChat) but then he developed some other big problems.

      He changed to a '14 Prius v wagon.
      Yes, I'm pretty sure he was on the original engine on the 09 Prius but hit was having high oil consumption eventually and he was on the original battery per 299,999+ Mile Club | Page 27 | PriusChat.

      - - - Updated - - -

      Ummm, Toyota did have a Gen 1 Rav4 EV and then did the Gen 2 (only 2600 built) '12 to '14 Tesla-powered CA compliance car Rav4 EV (2012 Toyota RAV4 EV: First Drive Of Tesla-Powered Crossover and Toyota Wraps Up Production of RAV4 EV | PluginCars.com). I've test driven them a few times and know some folks with them. There's also The New RAV4 EV and Toyota Rav4 EV Forum View active topics on the Gen 2.

      I occasionally see some of the Gen 2s on the road. I used to see Gen 1s long ago but haven't seen one in a long time, except at EVents.

      They also had some weak EVs like 2013 Scion iQ EV. I saw one of EV / Products Line-up / Products / TOYOTA AUTO BODY in Japan as part of some car sharing service.

      However, Toyota clearly doesn't care about pure EVs at the point (at least from their current actions visible to the public and interviews w/the press) and are continuing w/ICEVs, hybrids and hydrogen FCEVs.
      No. The Volt is NOT a pure EV. Pure EVs don't have engines, fuel tanks, ignition coils, spark plugs, and exhaust systems. There were also cases on Gen 1 Volt where when the car was in CS mode, the engine has some mechanical connection to the wheels.

      - - - Updated - - -

      Although the Honda Insight arrived in the US before any Prius did, the NHW10 Prius which was JDM-only and NEVER came to the US went on sale before the Insight went into production.

      See http://john1701a.com/prius/prius-history.htm re: the Dec 1997 Prius. It was almost a science experiment with D-cell batteries instead of prismatic cells.

      The version we got in the US was NHW11 which looks externally similar (like a Toyota Echo) but had a touchscreen (instead of buttons below the color LCD), prismatic format cells, more power, better acceleration, etc.

      Both the NHW10 and 11 are generally referred to as Gen 1 Prius, but I'd possibly argue that NHW10 was gen 0 or 0.9 or something like that. Or NHW10 was version 1.0 and NHW11 was 1.1. Gen 2 Prius (04 to 09 model year) was NHW20 and Gen 3 was ZVW30.

      And yep, the Gen 1 Insight was the gas mileage king in the US and unchallenged until Gen 4 Prius. Those 61/70 mpg numbers were on the old EPA test before the changes that began w/the 08 model year. Now, after adjustments for the 08+ test, the '16 Prius Eco now bests the Gen 1 Insight in combined mileage. See Compare Side-by-Side
      .
     
  16. chriSharek

    chriSharek Member

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    #16 chriSharek, Mar 7, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2016


    1) I can't control the power from the grid - but I can control what vehicle I buy. 65% of our power in Florida is from Natural Gas - much cleaner than coal/oil.
    2) I've read lots of articles about the Volt's drivetrain too. But, I can assure you I've done 101 MPH (governed) down the interstate on all electric. I've gone 4 months without buying gas. I can assure you that the GEN 1 Volt (not the new GEN 2) is purely electric for the first ~40 miles.
     
  17. Electricfan

    Electricfan Member

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    LOL! Man, you are so serious! I know the car has a gas engine - I've put gas in the tank before!

    Yesterday I drove my Volt to a movie theater downtown. Round trip was pure electric. Got home with 9 miles left in the battery. So I drove a "PURE EV" to the movies. That's how I see it. If you don't, good for you. I recognize your right to have a different opinion than mine.
     
  18. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

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    Currently I'm at 103,488 miles :)
     
  19. RiverBrick

    RiverBrick Active Member

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    Unless hacked, doesn't the Volt BMS block you from using a third of the battery's capacity? Wouldn't this prevent issues from "deep" cycling?
     
  20. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    They're too busy obstructing Tesla.

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    An EV doesn't require an emissions test to be registered in WA state. Does a Volt?

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    Cognitive dissonance error, line 2.
     

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