Any Porsche defectors?

[S4WRXTTCS]

I'm not sure if I'm a Porsche defector or a Ferrari defector.

Maybe I'm a mid-engine sports car defector. But, that makes sense as electric cars with low-slung batteries do handle like mid-engine cars.

As to my story I had a Porsche Cayman S so I was l looking for the next stage in evolution. Obviously I looked at the Porsche 911, but it never really captured me.

The Model S was was starting to get more, and more of my attention while at the same time Audi/Porsche seemed hopelessly lost.

So it ultimately came down to a used Ferrari versus a new Model S. Basically a best of the old-world (of what I could afford) versus the new world.

I went with the new world.

I'm not done with ICE cars forever. I do think they have a place, and a purpose. For me they work great as a second specific needs type vehicle. Right now my second vehicle is a Jeep Wrangler Unlimited as it's pretty opposite from a Tesla. I was planning on selling it when I got a 4x4 camper van, but I'm having a hard time letting go.

As to my next primary car it's looking like it's going to come down to Model S vs. Model 3P vs. Porsche Taycan.

For Tesla to lose will require Tesla to go nowhere with EAP/FSD, and for Porsche/Audi/VW to do a stellar job on the roll out of their Supercharger network.

One thing I really dislike about the idea of getting a Taycan is VW/Audi/Porsche is a forced competitor. It didn't happen naturally, but it happened as a result of diesel gate. That's why VW has committed so much money to it.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

I think right now that's what puts Tesla above the competition. The Model 3, S and X are all vehicles you can have as a daily driver.

I thought that's what Porsche had above their competition.

It was a sports car that you could drive everyday. I know I drove my Cayman every day with no issues except when it snowed which is an extremely rare occasion in my neck of the woods.

The problem with a Tesla as a daily driver is if you get hit then you've lost your Tesla for many, many months.

I admit I've been driving my Jeep more because their is a fear in the back of my mind of someone hitting my Tesla, and not being able to drive it. It wouldn't be that big of a deal if people these days weren't complete idiots on the road.

 

[ℬête Noire]

I know it would be more expensive

It is looking about 2 years out before you can get one, so it's kinda foggy, but in the US if the current Plug-in Tax Credit remains in it's current form ($7500 for a Porsche, nothing for a Tesla) it might end up a very similar "base" price. Not sure if they've nailed down the price yet(?) but speculation has run as low as $75K for the baseline Taycan. With Tax Credit that's very similar to, actually slightly below, what a Performance w/Upgrade package costs w/o Tax Credit.

 

[chronopc]

I thought that's what Porsche had above their competition.

It was a sports car that you could drive everyday. I know I drove my Cayman every day with no issues except when it snowed which is an extremely rare occasion in my neck of the woods.

The problem with a Tesla as a daily driver is if you get hit then you've lost your Tesla for many, many months.

I admit I've been driving my Jeep more because their is a fear in the back of my mind of someone hitting my Tesla, and not being able to drive it. It wouldn't be that big of a deal if people these days weren't complete idiots on the road.

That may very well be true for ICE vehicles. But for EV there is not currently another car out there that is a practical daily driver. The closest is the Bolt. However the Bolt is not a good looking car, does not have any type of auto pilot feature, and is lacking a strong charging network.

 

[Tmoody]

I had a 997 C4S and then transitioned into a 991...both manual. I traded in the 991 back in 2014 for an inventory MS P85 and never looked back. Moved from the P85 to a ModelX P90D....wife has the M3 AWD on order.

 

[ℬête Noire]

That may very well be true for ICE vehicles. But for EV there is not currently another car out there that is a practical daily driver. The closest is the Bolt. However the Bolt is not a good looking car, does not have any type of auto pilot feature, and is lacking a strong charging network.

This pretty much locks the Bolt into the role of "daily driver". My wife is liking it but I know damn well as soon as she tries out EAP on trip to work she'll want to be using the 3 for commuting.

 

[chronopc]

This pretty much locks the Bolt into the role of "daily driver". My wife is liking it but I know damn well as soon as she tries out EAP on trip to work she'll want to be using the 3 for commuting.

I guess what I really mean is an all purpose car instead of "daily driver". The Model 3 is the only car I have now and I can use it for all my driving needs.

 

[JeffK]

Keep both. If it's a manual...you might miss the more engaged driving experience....the engine hum and growl, the exhaust pops, the feeling of RPMs as you shift, the feeling of that clutch pedal.

For me...the instant torque, accel with just the whine of the electric motor is nice...but I'd do miss the growl, pops, and clutch and stick feel.

I wonder if they can make this an easter egg. ICE simulation with ICE power curves and appropriate regen for each virtual gear.

 

[wbhokie]

It is looking about 2 years out before you can get one, so it's kinda foggy, but in the US if the current Plug-in Tax Credit remains in it's current form ($7500 for a Porsche, nothing for a Tesla) it might end up a very similar "base" price. Not sure if they've nailed down the price yet(?) but speculation has run as low as $75K for the baseline Taycan. With Tax Credit that's very similar to, actually slightly below, what a Performance w/Upgrade package costs w/o Tax Credit.

Well, I won't have any problems getting the full tax credit on the model 3. So that part of the argument doesn't apply for me. (full credit through the rest of the year) And likely the way companies like Porsche do upgrades no one would ever end up anywhere close to the base price of the car. Tesla has spoiled us with very basic options. Mercedes, Porsche, Jaguar, etc have so many options in some of their cars you could drown in them. But you are right that things are still vague with it, and it is still about a 2 year wait to get one. Still, the Taycan looks like it will be a beautiful vehicle.

 

[Asterix187]

i still have my 997.2 S Cab and drive it at the weekends. The handling and grip as well as sheer enjoyment levels are 10x what I get from my MS.

 

[Twiglett]

Porsche will always be Porsche regardless of power plant.
The best part of what they are doing with the Taycan is that they are marketing a performance car that happens to be an EV and they are taking a sensible approach to charging. Only Tesla has done the same thing so far and its seems to have paid off.
If Porsche can continue to push the EV halo car then it can only be better for all of us.
The Taycan isn't a Tesla competitor - its a Porsche, so not exactly mass market

 

[chickensworth]

Well, I won't have any problems getting the full tax credit on the model 3. So that part of the argument doesn't apply for me. (full credit through the rest of the year) And likely the way companies like Porsche do upgrades no one would ever end up anywhere close to the base price of the car. Tesla has spoiled us with very basic options. Mercedes, Porsche, Jaguar, etc have so many options in some of their cars you could drown in them. But you are right that things are still vague with it, and it is still about a 2 year wait to get one. Still, the Taycan looks like it will be a beautiful vehicle.

if the Taycan is anything like the concept, it will be stunning... but i don't think there's any way it's coming in at under 100k with the specs they've announced...
The claimed specs puts it inline with their much more expensive offerings... no way they'll offer near equivalent performance of their Turbo trim cars for Cayman level pricing... Panamera Turbo S e-Hybird is 185k for reference. They've always been very structured with their pricing / performance bracketing to prevent cannibalization.
But for all that money, you get a Porsche... and they are very finely engineered and detailed machines. I can't wait to see their electrified future lineup.

 

[chronopc]

if the Taycan is anything like the concept, it will be stunning... but i don't think there's any way it's coming in at under 100k with the specs they've announced...
The claimed specs puts it inline with their much more expensive offerings... no way they'll offer near equivalent performance of their Turbo trim cars for Cayman level pricing... Panamera Turbo S e-Hybird is 185k for reference. They've always been very structured with their pricing / performance bracketing to prevent cannibalization.
But for all that money, you get a Porsche... and they are very finely engineered and detailed machines. I can't wait to see their electrified future lineup.

Sources says it'll be priced in the $75k-$80k range? Not sure how accurate that is.

Porsche Taycan Hits Nürburgring For More Pre-Production Testing | CleanTechnica

 

[chickensworth]

Sources says it'll be priced in the $75k-$80k range? Not sure how accurate that is.

Porsche Taycan Hits Nürburgring For More Pre-Production Testing | CleanTechnica

yeah... i've seen that speculative pricing and i'm not convinced... i could be wrong, but what happens to their whole lineup and pricing structure?
A base Panamera starts at 85K and does 0-60 in 5.4 sec...
A base 911 starts at 91k and does 0-60 in 4.4 sec...
How is their new electrified car with pure sex for body work and 0-60 in 3.5 seconds going to undercut their slower cars by 10-15k? Pricing is not official yet, but i still think it's going to be more expensive. No way it starts at less than my Performance 3... and if it really does, i'll highly consider switching.

 

[bhzmark]

FYI, MT found the 3 to compare favorably to Cayman and Boxster:

“This is a very digital car to drive: Brake, dial in one single steering angle, wait for the corner to end, and tidily accelerate. Most sedans are a conga line of steering corrections and throttle stabs. After thinking about it, perhaps just the Porsche Cayman and Boxster and the Honda Civic Type R that were on hand today drive this precisely.”
https://www.motortrend.com/cars/tes...e-tesla-model-3-long-range-first-test-review/

 

[Asterix187]

yeah... i've seen that speculative pricing and i'm not convinced... i could be wrong, but what happens to their whole lineup and pricing structure?
A base Panamera starts at 85K and does 0-60 in 5.4 sec...
A base 911 starts at 91k and does 0-60 in 4.4 sec...
How is their new electrified car with pure sex for body work and 0-60 in 3.5 seconds going to undercut their slower cars by 10-15k? Pricing is not official yet, but i still think it's going to be more expensive. No way it starts at less than my Performance 3... and if it really does, i'll highly consider switching.

If you have to ask why a flat v6 engined porsche 911 (albeit slower) would cost more than an electric Porsche then I take it your not a Porsche enthusiast.

It’s the same reason why Formula E isn’t as exciting as Formula 1. Can you imagine electric NASCAR?

 

[MXWing]

A little bit off topic: one day I parked alone side a Porsche, they were like twins:
View attachment 317661View attachment 317662

One being Ahhnold and one being Danny Devito?

 

[MXWing]

I am probably never going to have the money for either a P3 or a Porsche

I’m hiring in CA if a persons desire to produce (not work but produce) matches their desire for a nice car.

Please don’t ever think that way. I drove cars that are worth less than the value of the EAP option on a Model 3 as recent as five years ago.

Just produce more than the next person and manage finances well.

You will absolutely get there.

 

[chickensworth]

If you have to ask why a flat v6 engined porsche 911 (albeit slower) would cost more than an electric Porsche then I take it your not a Porsche enthusiast.

It’s the same reason why Formula E isn’t as exciting as Formula 1. Can you imagine electric NASCAR?

Never asked the question... and I take it you're not a Porsche enthusiast if you think there's such thing as a flat V6.

 

[ℬête Noire]

...and I take it you're not a Porsche enthusiast if you think there's such thing as a flat V6.

I took it as "likes noise a lot, doesn't know much about what makes the noise".