Any way to dispute FSD strike?

[everydaychris]

Do you guys get strikes by trying the raising and lowering autopilot speed trick?

I tried it the other day. Saw the blue screen flashing, raised/lowered the speed by 1 and it went away. Looking straight nothing new. And after maybe 3-5 flashing blue screens, all of a sudden, take over immediately and I got a strike.

I'm wondering if it acts similar to a cell phone being used without the "pay attention to the road" and that if you don't actually counter force the steering wheel after a few times it will lock you out.

 

[Supcom]

Do you guys get strikes by trying the raising and lowering autopilot speed trick?

I tried it the other day. Saw the blue screen flashing, raised/lowered the speed by 1 and it went away. Looking straight nothing new. And after maybe 3-5 flashing blue screens, all of a sudden, take over immediately and I got a strike.

I'm wondering if it acts similar to a cell phone being used without the "pay attention to the road" and that if you don't actually counter force the steering wheel after a few times it will lock you out.

Periodically, my car stops recognizing steering wheel inputs. Neither tugging not button/rollers are effective. Simply disengaging and reengaging resets something and it works again. Normally, using the rollers is treated the same as tugging the wheel.

 

[dcesq06]

I have no idea what the incentive is except to stop people from badgering him. They have plenty of testers without letting more people back in. Your hypothetical is what I would be concerned about. Seems like quite a good possibility.

See the linked video. My main metric is that Tesla says “wrong thing, worst time,” which they are serious about! It is not just a disclaimer or CYA. If they remove that warning I think we can revisit the strike system.

This danger is increased by letting people back in who have propensity to rack up strikes due to inattention and improper use (yes, there are other reasons for strikes, but I suspect those legitimate excuses are not the primary reason for strikeouts).

If a user’s peripheral visual field is impaired enough to not see the flashing blue screen, then it may be best to wait until FSD is out of Beta, as it requires good vision to monitor safely. There will be a time when FSD will help these people by accommodating their visual deficits!

I respect your opinion and I have no issue with your opinion being subjective (which appears to be the case as a quote isn't a metric). In my opinion, it just doesn't make a lot of sense - that Tesla, at the peak of government and public scrutiny, would reset the strike counter and jeopardize everything (merely because Elon is sick of being pestered) unless it was reasonably comfortable that the current state of its software wasn't per se "dangerous." Tesla's stock price, the demand for FSD, etc would plummet. From a practical, financial and legal liability perspective, it (resetting the strike counter) wouldn't be worth it.

Notwithstanding the above, I absolutely do understand where you are coming from and your concern.

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

From a practical, financial and legal liability perspective, it (resetting the strike counter) wouldn't be worth it.

I think a better question to ask is when would it be worth it? I can’t think of any conditions which would make it worth it. Risk would have to be basically zero and clearly that is not the case.

I don’t think it makes any sense, but Elon calls the shots, and I think he truly believes FSD Beta improves safety (that would be a reason to reinstate people; the only one that I can think of that would make sense).

 

[LincolnsDoctor]

I wonder if they are reviewing cabin camera data and seeing a lot of false positives. I don't recall getting put in Autopilot jail when I had FSD beta on my 3, but it has happened to me 5 times in about 800 miles on the S. Not obvious how Tesla makes the system sensitive without making it so sensitive that it is unusable for many attentive drivers

 

[Popabear39]

Anyway, this should be resolved “this week:”

https://twitter.com/x/status/1564021930222649345

Just received this latest download decided to try it out. About 0.5 miles into my first drive I got an "instant" forced disengagfement, apparently because I was holding the wheel to to loosely (I didn't want to inadvertently disengage while allowing FSD to make turns). The system then informed me that I had used one strike out of THREE. I thought Musk had changed from three strikes to five in a past update. Has he now gone back to three?

 

[Dewg]

Just received this latest download decided to try it out. About 0.5 miles into my first drive I got an "instant" forced disengagfement, apparently because I was holding the wheel to to loosely (I didn't want to inadvertently disengage while allowing FSD to make turns). The system then informed me that I had used one strike out of THREE. I thought Musk had changed from three strikes to five in a past update. Has he now gone back to three?

Some models, including the S/X get 3 strikes instead of 5 on the 3/Y

 

[uscbucsfan]

Just received this latest download decided to try it out. About 0.5 miles into my first drive I got an "instant" forced disengagfement, apparently because I was holding the wheel to to loosely (I didn't want to inadvertently disengage while allowing FSD to make turns). The system then informed me that I had used one strike out of THREE. I thought Musk had changed from three strikes to five in a past update. Has he now gone back to three?

It has been and always will be 3 if you don't have a cabin camera.

 

[nvx1977]

It has been and always will be 3 if you don't have a cabin camera.

Interesting. that means we have to reconsider if these insta-strikes are actually cabin-camera related at all.

At the moment, given the fairly high number of people reporting insta-strikes on TMC, I'm still willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and assume these things exist and could be bugs. But if there's a high frequency of these things happening, then there should be a greater chance someone catches this on a gopro or something. That we haven't seen any real evidence of an insta-strike makes me suspicious, exactly like "sudden unintended acceleration" claims. Person might believe one thing happened, but in reality, something entirely different happened (pedal misapplication, for example).

If I were to assume that an insta-strike bug does not exist, then the most reasonable explanation is that the person didn't notice the nag until it was too late, making it feel like an insta-strike.

 

[Darmie]

Small claims court?

Large claims court now. They hired a stack of lawyers.

 

[Nubo]

So I got a false strike today. Driving on freeway, eyes were on road, hands on steering wheel. Screen flashes blue once AND THEN IMMEDIATELY throws me out of autopilot. I even confirmed with my passenger that the autopilot ejection was immediate.

Is there any way to dispute this or at least give some feedback to Tesla? It was my fifth strike so no beta FSD for me which really sucks.

Before anyone asks, here is my setup:
2022 Model 3 LR
Was wearing hat and sunglasses
Time was noon

This is the AI that we're supposed to be looking forward to driving for us while we nap?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

Just want to see videos, otherwise I have a hard time believing any of this is happening as described.

 

[LincolnsDoctor]

My theory is that insta strikes are caused by some sort of "race condition" where one warning, e.g. "Move Away From the Scary Orange Cones!" prevents the nag warning from appearing until it is too late. I wonder what happens if the car has a wheel torque warning and a camera warning at the same time?

 

[AlanSubie4Life]

My theory is that insta strikes are caused by some sort of "race condition" where one warning, e.g. "Move Away From the Scary Orange Cones!" prevents the nag warning from appearing until it is too late. I wonder what happens if the car has a wheel torque warning and a camera warning at the same time?

I got tons of these beeps (maybe 4 or 5) on my 500-mile trip recently; it really likes to do the quick beep-beep (with no prior warnings) in construction zones and requires basically constant torque.

But no strikes. In those cases I just disengaged usually since the car clearly couldn’t handle these basic situations.

 

[Daniel in SD]

Strikes can be disputed and removed. Blaming your wife works!

https://twitter.com/x/status/1528162058583150592

https://twitter.com/x/status/1532414094694707200

Even a second time!

https://twitter.com/x/status/1565427298521690112

 

[Helen20100]

So I got a false strike today. Driving on freeway, eyes were on road, hands on steering wheel. Screen flashes blue once AND THEN IMMEDIATELY throws me out of autopilot. I even confirmed with my passenger that the autopilot ejection was immediate.

Is there any way to dispute this or at least give some feedback to Tesla? It was my fifth strike so no beta FSD for me which really sucks.

Before anyone asks, here is my setup:
2022 Model 3 LR
Was wearing hat and sunglasses
Time was noon

I had the same. Sorry for you… and me

 

[Darmie]

Strikes can be disputed and removed. Blaming your wife works!

https://twitter.com/x/status/1528162058583150592

https://twitter.com/x/status/1532414094694707200

Even a second time!

https://twitter.com/x/status/1565427298521690112

That's some funny stuff right there. Is FSD now profile dependent? It's more like the wife would blame me.

 

[DCGOO]

That's some funny stuff right there. Is FSD now profile dependent? It's more like the wife would blame me.

FSD is configured by profile, but the strikes are to the car, regardless of the profile in use.