Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Anyone else worried that V3 Superchargers not being shared might be a mistake?

This site may earn commission on affiliate links.
You mean S85? At this rate you will be at 80% not 65% at 50 minutes. But I think you can do at least 90kW peak even with degradation?!

No, it was discovered that the advertised 85kWh battery was really 81kWh, with 77 available for locomotion and ancillary activities. The 85kWh moniker was just Tesla marketing hype. So, I now refer to our Model S as an 81.

Today, the degradation in our battery is about 4%. But with Tesla's recent voltage capping and charge rate capping on older models no one really knows just how good their batteries are, or if the information that is provided is accurate.

Yes, before the software update it was about a 50-minute wait to charge from 15-20% to 80%. No more. It took me 1:25 to charge from 15% to 92% in Eureka in August. Charge rates above 65-70% drop to a trickle now. The car started charging at 80kW or so, but dropped to under 65kW by 30%.
 
I know, 81kWh full pack 77 available. But regardless at the rate you are saying it will not take that long. Obviously times above 85% don't matter as they are slow even on Model 3(although not that slow)
20-80% will still be below 50 minutes, even if you avg as low as 60kW, which you are probably way above...
Regardless I would have Tesla look at the battery and try to get it under warranty.
 
No, it was discovered that the advertised 85kWh battery was really 81kWh, with 77 available for locomotion and ancillary activities. The 85kWh moniker was just Tesla marketing hype. So, I now refer to our Model S as an 81.

Today, the degradation in our battery is about 4%. But with Tesla's recent voltage capping and charge rate capping on older models no one really knows just how good their batteries are, or if the information that is provided is accurate.

Yes, before the software update it was about a 50-minute wait to charge from 15-20% to 80%. No more. It took me 1:25 to charge from 15% to 92% in Eureka in August. Charge rates above 65-70% drop to a trickle now. The car started charging at 80kW or so, but dropped to under 65kW by 30%.
And it seems like everyone is dismissing the possibility the capping that hit the 85 and below could be rolled out to others later.

I get there are upgrades to cooling and cells in a 3 but if a 85kw pack can't handle 120kwh anymore it seems like a stretch to think a smaller 3 pack can really take 150+ especially plus, rates long term.

Have to wonder if this is all marketing that will be taken away later.
 
I know, 81kWh full pack 77 available. But regardless at the rate you are saying it will not take that long. Obviously times above 85% don't matter as they are slow even on Model 3(although not that slow)
20-80% will still be below 50 minutes, even if you avg as low as 60kW, which you are probably way above...
Regardless I would have Tesla look at the battery and try to get it under warranty.

We arrived at Kettleman City after driving for 75 minutes. We even tried the new Version 3 Supercharger. Plugged in at 38%. Unplugged 20 minutes later at 52%. Forty-two kilowatts tapered down to thirty-six when I unplugged.
 
We arrived at Kettleman City after driving for 75 minutes. We even tried the new Version 3 Supercharger. Plugged in at 38%. Unplugged 20 minutes later at 52%. Forty-two kilowatts tapered down to thirty-six when I unplugged.
I would get a CAN OBDII reader and check the cell imbalance. Those speeds are definetely not normal. Talk to Tesla, it should be under warranty. You should at least get 80kW.
 
Thank you for the suggestion. Tesla no longer shares diagnostic testing results, only that they are “within specifications.” Since the dread software update that gimped supercharging speeds and reduced cell voltage for others, Tesla no longer operates in good faith. Their service centers spew misinformation.
 
Just Stopped at the V3 charger in Valdosta, GA today on the way from NC to FL. This was our 2nd stop on a 600 mi trip so for something new I decided to make this the last stop and charge fully to make Orlando. Unfortunately the station was not cooperating: after a few seconds, stall 1B quit and I could not restart it.

I was already in the bathroom so 10 min. were lost until I got back. Once I shifted to 1A, the charge rate did go right up to 211 KW, however as I was at about 15% SOC it should have been the full 250 KW which I have seen at this very charger.

Then, it tapered off rapidly much faster than I have seen in previous stops. It ended up taking us about 75 min. to do the full charge which was painful and something I will never do again. Out of curiosity once I got the charging restarted, I took a close look at the electrical placards on the two charging modules. Turns out there is no MW charger at this one.

There are actually two units, each only rated at 250KW DC output. That's it. I looked around and there is absolutely nothing else there so the total rating is 500KW for 8 chargers. Presumably each unit is connected to 4 so that means if 4 cars are charging, each one could be limited to 62.5 KW which is actually lower than a shared V2 charger with 145 KW or 72.5 KW each. Color me not impressed.

What really disappoints me is that Tesla is in control of the car and the charger and promises 15-20 min typical charge times with the V3. This has not been my experience on anything like a consistent basis.

I am actually really weary of the total in consistency of the Tesla Supercharging network (some of which I'm sure is related to the cars and not the chargers). We used to do the NC/FL trip in 8 1/2 hours with ICE cars. The best I have ever done with a MS and a M3 LR-AWD is 9 1/2 hours. Today it was 10 1/2.

I have to admit I am tired of the electric car time penalty for long trips. Next week we embark on a 1,000 mi trip to Houston and I anticipate 7 stops and 3 hr of charging. No fun.

(moderator note: added spacing to make post more readable. no other change made other than to add line spacing)
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Just Stopped at the V3 charger in Valdosta, GA today on the way from NC to FL. This was our 2nd stop on a 600 mi trip so for something new I decided to make this the last stop and charge fully to make Orlando. Unfortunately the station was not cooperating: after a few seconds, stall 1B quit and I could not restart it.

I was already in the bathroom so 10 min. were lost until I got back. Once I shifted to 1A, the charge rate did go right up to 211 KW, however as I was at about 15% SOC it should have been the full 250 KW which I have seen at this very charger.

Then, it tapered off rapidly much faster than I have seen in previous stops. It ended up taking us about 75 min. to do the full charge which was painful and something I will never do again. Out of curiosity once I got the charging restarted, I took a close look at the electrical placards on the two charging modules. Turns out there is no MW charger at this one.

There are actually two units, each only rated at 250KW DC output. That's it. I looked around and there is absolutely nothing else there so the total rating is 500KW for 8 chargers. Presumably each unit is connected to 4 so that means if 4 cars are charging, each one could be limited to 62.5 KW which is actually lower than a shared V2 charger with 145 KW or 72.5 KW each. Color me not impressed.

What really disappoints me is that Tesla is in control of the car and the charger and promises 15-20 min typical charge times with the V3. This has not been my experience on anything like a consistent basis.

I am actually really weary of the total in consistency of the Tesla Supercharging network (some of which I'm sure is related to the cars and not the chargers). We used to do the NC/FL trip in 8 1/2 hours with ICE cars. The best I have ever done with a MS and a M3 LR-AWD is 9 1/2 hours. Today it was 10 1/2.

I have to admit I am tired of the electric car time penalty for long trips. Next week we embark on a 1,000 mi trip to Houston and I anticipate 7 stops and 3 hr of charging. No fun.

(moderator note: added spacing to make post more readable. no other change made other than to add line spacing)
Are you saying you tried to do NC-FL, 600 miles in just 2 stops, and you charge up to 100% at those 2 stops? So, let's say 200 miles per 3 legs? As it sounds like you've owned a couple Teslas already, you know that's generally inefficient if you're trying to do the trip in as little time as possible due to the charge taper. From my experience, the fastest trip times have you charging from 15% to 65%, or about half a battery, around 40kWh. That gives you about 120+miles, so legs should be around 120miles, for fastest trip times.

Punch that in to ABRP, and you get at 115% of speed limit, and 70F, a total trip time of 8h45m. 4 stops, longest being 16mins, for a total SC time of 52mins.

Trying your way, with two long stops in Macon and Valdosta, gives a result of 10h9m, with each stop taking 1h to charge. And, ABRP says you have to limit yourself to 70mph if you want to make it to Orlando with 15% SOC. That's at 70F. Much colder, and you'll have to make another short stop in Lake City.

Maybe you should try altering your charging strategy to lower your trip times.
 
Once I shifted to 1A, the charge rate did go right up to 211 KW, however as I was at about 15% SOC it should have been the full 250 KW which I have seen at this very charger.
There are a hundred different reasons you might have gotten 211kw instead of 250, and indeed this is the very meaning of “up to” 250kw.

Out of curiosity once I got the charging restarted, I took a close look at the electrical placards on the two charging modules. Turns out there is no MW charger at this one.

There are actually two units, each only rated at 250KW DC output. That's it. I looked around and there is absolutely nothing else there so the total rating is 500KW for 8 chargers. Presumably each unit is connected to 4 so that means if 4 cars are charging, each one could be limited to 62.5 KW which is actually lower than a shared V2 charger with 145 KW or 72.5 KW each. Color me not impressed.
While you’re right that there really isn’t a single cabinet that can provide “1 megawatt”, your interpretation of the cabinet placard is not accurate.

Each cabinet serves 4 stalls and has a max input from the grid of 350kva (~350kw), which it can output to any ONE pedestal at up to 250kw, or split up to 4 ways for 87.5kw each.

However, each individual cabinet is also connected by a 575kw DC bus to up to 6 other cabinets, which allows for the site to share power across up to 28 stalls. So one cabinet can theoretically provide 575 + 350kw to four stalls = 925kw = close enough for marketing to call 1MW.

Yes, there is still a max energy budget of 87.5kw per stall / 700kw at an 8-stall site like you were at - but real world scenarios simply don’t often present that set of conditions, and in any case v3 stations are far more capable at providing full power to cars that can take it than v2 sites, regardless of where they’re plugged in.

And as you no doubt learned today, charging to 100% is stupid and takes lots of time, so only do that if you have other reasons to be stationary. The smart way to travel in an EV is to work the lower half of your battery as much as possible and stop more frequently.
 
Last edited:
There are a hundred different reasons you might have gotten 211kw instead of 250, and indeed this is the very meaning of “up to” 250kw.


While you’re right that there really isn’t a single cabinet that can provide “1 megawatt”, your interpretation of the cabinet placard is not accurate.

Each cabinet serves 4 stalls and has a max input from the grid of 350kva (~350kw), which it can output to any ONE pedestal at up to 250kw, or split up to 4 ways for 87.5kw each.

However, each individual cabinet is also connected by a 575kw DC bus to up to 6 other cabinets, which allows for the site to share power across up to 28 stalls. So one cabinet can theoretically provide 575 + 350kw to four stalls = 925kw = close enough for marketing to call 1MW.

Yes, there is still a max energy budget of 87.5kw per stall / 700kw at an 8-stall site like you were at - but real world scenarios simply don’t often present that set of conditions, and in any case v3 stations are far more capable at providing full power to cars that can take it than v2 sites, regardless of where they’re plugged in.

And as you no doubt learned today, charging to 100% is stupid and takes lots of time, so only do that if you have other reasons to be stationary. The smart way to travel in an EV is to work the lower half of your battery as much as possible and stop more frequently.
Sorry, but I don't believe you are correct. The AC input side did indeed list a 350kva max input for each. However, the DC output side was definitely listed at 250KW max output on each cabinet which means each stall could be limited to 250/4 or 62.5KW ea, unlikely but possible. More likely at a full station are two cars tapering down at say 25KW each and two cars arrive and plug in at around the same time. That leaves about 100KW max each until the first two finish. Regardless, unless you are the only car connected to the cabinet you will certainly not get 250KW.

"And as you no doubt learned today, charging to 100% is stupid ..."

I have owned a 2016 MS75 and now a 2018 M3LR-AWD and I am fully aware of the theoretical time advantage of the 50% and below charging curve. However, what is not included in that calculation is the extra time it takes to drive to the next charger. In my case, the next charger stop in Ocala which I have used before adds a 12 min. time penalty according to Google Maps.

Charging to 95% which is actually what I did, could take as little as 46 min. from 10% SOC according to various online videos of V3 chargers in action, for ex:

In fact it took about 65 min on a cool day in the low 50s.

According to my "Ideal" trip charging rates, I could have charged at Valdosta for 17 min. to 199 and 12 min. at Ocala to 119. Adding the extra stop time of 12 min. totals 41 min. vs 46 min. for the 95% charge. All of these are ideal figures, but the point is that it wasn't even close and for no obvious reason.

BTW, I appreciate your input and suggestions so let's be friends and not use the "S" word :)
 
Are you saying you tried to do NC-FL, 600 miles in just 2 stops, and you charge up to 100% at those 2 stops? So, let's say 200 miles per 3 legs? As it sounds like you've owned a couple Teslas already, you know that's generally inefficient if you're trying to do the trip in as little time as possible due to the charge taper. From my experience, the fastest trip times have you charging from 15% to 65%, or about half a battery, around 40kWh. That gives you about 120+miles, so legs should be around 120miles, for fastest trip times.

Punch that in to ABRP, and you get at 115% of speed limit, and 70F, a total trip time of 8h45m. 4 stops, longest being 16mins, for a total SC time of 52mins.

Trying your way, with two long stops in Macon and Valdosta, gives a result of 10h9m, with each stop taking 1h to charge. And, ABRP says you have to limit yourself to 70mph if you want to make it to Orlando with 15% SOC. That's at 70F. Much colder, and you'll have to make another short stop in Lake City.

Maybe you should try altering your charging strategy to lower your trip times.

See my reply to ucmndd above. The actual trip length is 578 mi. I charge overnight to 100% which is around 295 mi now after 2 years of ownership.

First stop is the Tom Hill Sr. charger in Macon, GA at 213 mi with about 50 mi left. I charge to 240 in about 30 min.

Next stop is Valdosta, 154 mi away. At that point we can either charge to 290 mi to make it the 211 mi home or 199 to make Ocala, 140 mi away. Adding the extra stop time for Ocala, the theoretical time advantage is only 5 min., a reasonable compromise.

Since my experience this trip was so bad at the V3, I will certainly revert back to making more stops with shorter drives in future trips.
 
Last edited:
Just Stopped at the V3 charger in Valdosta, GA today on the way from NC to FL. This was our 2nd stop on a 600 mi trip so for something new I decided to make this the last stop and charge fully to make Orlando. Unfortunately the station was not cooperating: after a few seconds, stall 1B quit and I could not restart it.

I was already in the bathroom so 10 min. were lost until I got back. Once I shifted to 1A, the charge rate did go right up to 211 KW, however as I was at about 15% SOC it should have been the full 250 KW which I have seen at this very charger.

Then, it tapered off rapidly much faster than I have seen in previous stops. It ended up taking us about 75 min. to do the full charge which was painful and something I will never do again. Out of curiosity once I got the charging restarted, I took a close look at the electrical placards on the two charging modules. Turns out there is no MW charger at this one.

There are actually two units, each only rated at 250KW DC output. That's it. I looked around and there is absolutely nothing else there so the total rating is 500KW for 8 chargers. Presumably each unit is connected to 4 so that means if 4 cars are charging, each one could be limited to 62.5 KW which is actually lower than a shared V2 charger with 145 KW or 72.5 KW each. Color me not impressed.

What really disappoints me is that Tesla is in control of the car and the charger and promises 15-20 min typical charge times with the V3. This has not been my experience on anything like a consistent basis.

I am actually really weary of the total in consistency of the Tesla Supercharging network (some of which I'm sure is related to the cars and not the chargers). We used to do the NC/FL trip in 8 1/2 hours with ICE cars. The best I have ever done with a MS and a M3 LR-AWD is 9 1/2 hours. Today it was 10 1/2.

I have to admit I am tired of the electric car time penalty for long trips. Next week we embark on a 1,000 mi trip to Houston and I anticipate 7 stops and 3 hr of charging. No fun.

(moderator note: added spacing to make post more readable. no other change made other than to add line spacing)

1. Stop resurrecting old dead threads. This was from the beginning of 2019 and we are in the year 2021.
2. What you said doesn't make sense and it's not how it works. I see two 1KW cabinets. Supercharger - Valdosta GA
3. What you did wastes your own time and other people's time. Never charge to 100%. I hate people sitting at a charger just so they can charge to a high state of charge when you could have left at 75% and easily made it to the next charger.
4. You own a Tesla for two years and don't know how Tesla charging works and actually complain about EV cars because of your own incompetence. Please educate yourself.
abetterrouteplanner.com says you could have done this trip in 8.5 hours with around 25 min stops for charging.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: APotatoGod
3. What you did wastes your own time and other people's time. Never charge to 100%. I hate people sitting at a charger just so they can charge to a high state of charge when you could have left at 75% and easily made it to the next charger.
Never say never. There are some places around the country where a ~100% charge is required in order to reach a destination that isn't linked by interstates. If someone isn't able to charge to 100% at home or with a destination charger then Supercharging to ~100% might be required. Driving north/south across Kansas, Nebraska, South Dakota, North Dakota, Montana, Wyoming, etc., there aren't a lot of Superchargers that allow one to bridge the gap between I-70 and I-80, I-80 and I-90 or I-90 and I-94. If cars were only charged to 75% charge, it could easily add hours of driving/Supercharging time and more than a hundred miles to the trip. I've made many trips in my S90D and S100D between SD and NE and NE and KS by getting close to a 100% charge before beginning my journey and have saved hundreds, if not thousands of miles over the years.

If I'm starting a journey from my home in Colorado, I usually charge to 100% at home so that I can make it as far as possible before needing to stop. The Supercharger that I've visited the most in my travels is over 225 miles from where I live. If I'm starting a trip from a different city, I try to stay at a hotel with destination charging so I can get a full charge overnight. That's not always possible so sometimes I've had to charge to ~100% at Superchargers.

Of course in states where Superchargers are located closer together and located on other highways in addition to the interstates, it greatly reduces the need to charge over 80%.
 
Sorry, but I don't believe you are correct. The AC input side did indeed list a 350kva max input for each. However, the DC output side was definitely listed at 250KW max output on each cabinet which means each stall could be limited to 250/4 or 62.5KW ea, unlikely but possible. More likely at a full station are two cars tapering down at say 25KW each and two cars arrive and plug in at around the same time. That leaves about 100KW max each until the first two finish. Regardless, unless you are the only car connected to the cabinet you will certainly not get 250KW.
Sorry, you are incorrect. Each cabinet is rated for 4x250 kW DC output - 250 kW per post.

As stated earlier in this thread:

1. V3 cabinet is rated for 350 kVA 3-Phase AC Input (qty 5 70 kW AC-DC inverters)
2. V3 cabinet is rated for 575 kW DC Input (880-1000VDC 640A)
3. V3 cabinet is rated for qty 4 250 kW output (qty 10 DC-DC converters for charging cars)

A V3 Supercharger Cabinet uses a 880-1000 VDC high voltage bus internally that is can also used to share with up to 6 other V3 Cabinets (7 cabinets total)

By itself, a single V3 cabinet can output around 350 kW, or almost 90 kW / post. A dual cabinet V3 SC like Valdosta, GA is capable of about 700 kW total output. So yeah, if it's full you're pretty likely to not get 250 kW peak charging speeds, but given that most people charge to 80% at which point you're only charging at 50-60 kW, you're still pretty likely to get some pretty fast charging speeds on a V3.

Keep in mind that V3 Superchargers aren't any faster than V2 Superchargers above 50% SOC or so on a Model 3. So don't expect any additional speed topping off the car. All the additional speed is below 50%, and like any other Supercharger, if the place is busy, you can get a reduction in peak charging speeds.

On your trip from Franklin, NC to Orlando, FL, yeah you can charge to 100% in Valdosta, and potentially skip stopping in Ocala, but yeah, that will take longer.

I suspect that perhaps you saw lower peak charge rates due to cooler temperatures and a cooler battery pack than normal. Unless the pack is nice and toasty (50C+) you aren't going to see peak charging rates. Did you set the Supercharger as a destination in the car navigation?
 
Never say never. There are some places around the country where a ~100% charge is required in order to reach a destination that isn't linked by interstates. If someone isn't able to charge to 100% at home or with a destination charger then Supercharging to ~100% might be required. Driving north/south across Kansas, Nebraska, South Dakota, North Dakota, Montana, Wyoming, etc., there aren't a lot of Superchargers that allow one to bridge the gap between I-70 and I-80, I-80 and I-90 or I-90 and I-94. If cars were only charged to 75% charge, it could easily add hours of driving/Supercharging time and more than a hundred miles to the trip. I've made many trips in my S90D and S100D between SD and NE and NE and KS by getting close to a 100% charge before beginning my journey and have saved hundreds, if not thousands of miles over the years.

If I'm starting a journey from my home in Colorado, I usually charge to 100% at home so that I can make it as far as possible before needing to stop. The Supercharger that I've visited the most in my travels is over 225 miles from where I live. If I'm starting a trip from a different city, I try to stay at a hotel with destination charging so I can get a full charge overnight. That's not always possible so sometimes I've had to charge to ~100% at Superchargers.

Of course in states where Superchargers are located closer together and located on other highways in addition to the interstates, it greatly reduces the need to charge over 80%.

Obviously if you must, you must. But most people don't educate themselves and just sit at chargers for 45mins from 50-100% charge. If you go to a station close to big cities they are all like that, all 8 stalls full sharing 150KW, people sitting there for 1.5 hours trying to get a full charge...
 
Obviously if you must, you must. But most people don't educate themselves and just sit at chargers for 45mins from 50-100% charge. If you go to a station close to big cities they are all like that, all 8 stalls full sharing 150KW, people sitting there for 1.5 hours trying to get a full charge...
You'd think Tesla could do more to discourage inefficient charging practices. They should label the 60 to 80% range as Commute, then the 90% line as Trip. Didn't they used to do something similar?
 
You'd think Tesla could do more to discourage inefficient charging practices. They should label the 60 to 80% range as Commute, then the 90% line as Trip. Didn't they used to do something similar?
Well, right now 50-90% is listed as "Daily" and 91-100% is listed as "Trip". I wonder if this backfires when on a trip and people think they should always Supercharge to > 90% as well.

Maybe a simple note on the screen when Supercharging that says something like "For fastest Supercharging, leave between 50-80% or enough to get to your destination or next charging stop with some buffer."

But the beauty of V3 Superchargers is that if you get to a full site where most people are not charging fast, you can still get peak charge rates no matter, unlike V2 where if you get unlucky and are paired with someone charging at a healthy rate, your speeds are significantly reduced.