Anyone thinking about an VW ID.4 Instead?

[Watts_Up]

I went to the VW ID.4 Roadshow for a 30 minutes test drive. This car a first view has a lot of potential,
I liked in particular the sliding roof cover that you can maneuver by sliding your finger on a small screen sensor.

I didn't like the frunk full of hoses with a lot of empty spaces as this was the rear wheel drive, but no luggage compartment.
I didn't like also the included charger who can only be used on 120 V and to use 240 V you need to buy a wall charger.
There is no portable charger that you can use directly using the 240 V plug of your dryer in your garage.

Compare to Tesla, the navigation control is very very bad. I felt like Sandy Munro experience.
I installed in advance on my phone the Electrify America App.
Using this App, I was immediately able to find a charging less than two miles away.

However, when I open the ID.4 central display map, I was not able to find the Electrify America charger location.
I moved the map just above the location of the charger but only gas stations were display.
I asked for some help from the assistant who told me to enter the address on the screen.
Even though I was not able to find the charging station, using the voice activated didn't help either.

Electrify America is own by VW, so why the chargers didn't show up immediately when looking at the map.
The assistant told me to use an App instead of the map, but didn't show me how to do it.

Honestly after this test drive I was not very enthusiast. I think VW need to make a lot of progresses with the display interface.
I was not able to test the driving assist because you need to drive above 35 miles/hour from what the assistant told me.

I would be very interested if someone could point me out to a Youtube video showing the ID.4 navigation usage.
I looked a several video, in particular from Bjørn Nyland, but could not find too much help.

 

[Pianewman]

I was a devoted VAG owner since 1983, until the "clean diesel" issues, bailed in 2016. 33 years. After having owned my Tesla MY for 4 months (this was in April?), I test drove the VW ID.4. Twice. I have only one word for the experience.

Meh.

 

[AlexHung]

I didn't like the frunk full of hoses with a lot of empty spaces as this was the rear wheel drive, but no luggage compartment.

But not as many hoses as the Ford Mach-E!

 

[Pianewman]

HAHAHAHAHA!!!!

 

[WADan]

But not as many hoses as the Ford Mach-E!

Looks like a second grade science project if you ask me (or use as many from the existing part bin as possible)!

 

[Pianewman]

I'm with Munro on the choice of weak spring clamps instead of legit worm-gear clamps...which, of course, would require much more assembly time, AND adequate access to turning the head of the clamp screw.

The MachE just looks so sad. It is very disappointing. Tesla needs real competition.

 

[Watts_Up]

But not as many hoses as the Ford Mach-E!

I can tell you for sure, all the VW ID.4, Ford Mach-E, and Volvo or Polestar, have been designed
to use in the future a Fuel Cell Stack or a range extender, which explain why the frunk cannot
be open with an App or a button on the screen display, but only using an handle on the driver side.

In the same way, the new generation of BMW i4 and iX frunk is not accessible, why bother in fact to let user accessing it,
so the cover can only be open by a mechanic, and the emblem is used as a opening to refill the windshield washer.

After catching few videos this weekend, the VW ID.4 is far from my though as alternative for a Model Y.
In fact I start to like new Hyundai Ioniq 5, which provides a lot of new designs, in particular the two way charging.

Ironically the new Hyundai Ioniq 5 looks like a modern stylized big VW Golf GTI, something that particularly caught my eye,
while the new VW ID.3 and ID.4 look more like some older Koran cars, something I didn't like too much.
IMO, the ID.3 and ID.4 should have kept the VW look. And as German EVs I prefer the Audi e-Tron or Porsche Taycan style.

 

[zpaul]

I was a devoted VAG owner since 1983, until the "clean diesel" issues, bailed in 2016. 33 years. After having owned my Tesla MY for 4 months (this was in April?), I test drove the VW ID.4. Twice. I have only one word for the experience.

Meh.

I still think that my Passat TDI even with VW cheating was cleaner than most of the vehicles in the US.
On road trips I was getting 60-65mpg on diesel. I was forgetting what side I suppose to fill it up.
People are not measuring car pollution apples to apples. I could get from Baltimore to Miami on one tank of diesel show me another car that can do it. May be Prius but not the same comfort and size. And if you compare what most people drive here I don't think that 15mpg truck or SUV is cleaner than 60mpg diesel.
Also, I feel like AdBlue was working pretty good to mitigate exhaust.
now they are just rotting away 300,000 diesels

So clean diesel is not an issue with me.
The issue I have with German cars is the price to fix to fix them. And VW infortament system is total garbage. Same in Audi. It is so difficult to use or find anything in there for no reason. Glitchy too.
When you get in Tesla 99% is self explanatory.

 

[AlexHung]

I can tell you for sure, all the VW ID.4, Ford Mach-E, and Volvo or Polestar, have been designed
to use in the future a Fuel Cell Stack or a range extender, which explain why the frunk cannot
be open with an App or a button on the screen display, but only using an handle on the driver side.

I think it’s mostly legacy thinking at work. People laughed at Tesla many years ago when they didn’t hired auto manufacturers “experts” but that’s what needed to think about manufacturing EV from fresh.

 

[Pianewman]

I still think that my Passat TDI even with VW cheating was cleaner than most of the vehicles in the US.
On road trips I was getting 60-65mpg on diesel. I was forgetting what side I suppose to fill it up.
People are not measuring car pollution apples to apples. I could get from Baltimore to Miami on one tank of diesel show me another car that can do it. May be Prius but not the same comfort and size. And if you compare what most people drive here I don't think that 15mpg truck or SUV is cleaner than 60mpg diesel.
Also, I feel like AdBlue was working pretty good to mitigate exhaust.
now they are just rotting away 300,000 diesels

So clean diesel is not an issue with me.
The issue I have with German cars is the price to fix to fix them. And VW infortament system is total garbage. Same in Audi. It is so difficult to use or find anything in there for no reason. Glitchy too.
When you get in Tesla 99% is self explanatory.

Nitrogen Oxide: VW "clean diesels" emitted about 40 times what the EPA approved.

Diesel Vehicles and the Volkswagen Emissions Scandal​

Mary Caballero​

December 6, 2017​

Submitted as coursework for PH240, Stanford University, Fall 2017​

"The EPA regulates nitrogen oxides closely because of the detrimental health and environmental effects. NOx is a key contributor to the formation of ground level ozone, and in turn, creates smog. It also can cause nutrient enrichment problems in bodies of water, like excessive algae or phytoplankton. This can cause bodies of water to be uninhabitable by plants and marine life alike. Also, excessive amounts of NOx react with sulfur and ammonia in the air to create acid decompositions that return to earth in the form of acid rain. Boosted NOx levels increase the risk of the health issues that stem from pollutants. Those with asthma and respiratory problems experience worse and more frequent attacks and issues. [4] When inhaled, nitrogen oxides cause damage to the lung and respiratory system and cause diseases like emphysema and bronchitis. Also, lung cancer and other illnesses have been linked to excessive exposure to NOx."

 

[CyberTorque]

Similar experience, always gravitated towards the VW brand (Mk1-5 GTi, Sciroccos, etc) but the ID.4 was not as compelling as the Model Y. Hopefully one day I’ll be back to the brand but happy with our one-day old Y. Buddy just got his ID.4 is leaving the factory, so interested to see how that goes for him.

 

[eevee-fan]

ID.BUZZ would be very interesting, due 2025. Wonder if there would be a Tesla micro bus then.

 

[Reeler]

Similar experience, always gravitated towards the VW brand (Mk1-5 GTi, Sciroccos, etc) but the ID.4 was not as compelling as the Model Y. Hopefully one day I’ll be back to the brand but happy with our one-day old Y. Buddy just got his ID.4 is leaving the factory, so interested to see how that goes for him.

With the ID.4 being much cheaper than the Model Y (after tax rebate), it makes the decision easy. Plus, Carplay is a must-have feature for me. Playing podcasts on the proprietary Tesla nav sucks.

Maybe things will even out if rebates come back for Tesla. At the same price, the decision would be more difficult.

 

[Pianewman]

With the ID.4 being much cheaper than the Model Y (after tax rebate), it makes the decision easy. Plus, Carplay is a must-have feature for me. Playing podcasts on the proprietary Tesla nav sucks.

Maybe things will even out if rebates come back for Tesla. At the same price, the decision would be more difficult.

...IF you like the car and...IF you trust VAG electronics.

 

[El joe]

With the ID.4 being much cheaper than the Model Y (after tax rebate), it makes the decision easy. Plus, Carplay is a must-have feature for me. Playing podcasts on the proprietary Tesla nav sucks.

Maybe things will even out if rebates come back for Tesla. At the same price, the decision would be more difficult.

At the same price, it’d be a Tesla hands-down for me. But with the price difference, man, the ID looks really enticing.

 

[mark95476]

Agreed.

If something electrical goes wrong with any German car then you need to get rid of it ASAP as it'll turn into a nightmare and money sink. People used to laugh about Jaguars (Lucas Electrical) and I don't have any personal experience, but Germans auto manufacturers seemingly don't understand anything electrical or electronic.

The issue I have with German cars is the price to fix to fix them. And VW infortament system is total garbage. Same in Audi. It is so difficult to use or find anything in there for no reason. Glitchy too.

 

[DanDi58]

At the same price, it’d be a Tesla hands-down for me. But with the price difference, man, the ID looks really enticing.

I think I'd wait a year, let them work out the navigation and general UI bugs/slowness.

 

[El joe]

I think I'd wait a year, let them work out the navigation and general UI bugs/slowness.

Funny, the one thing that would really annoy me is screen lag and I’ve seen that from all non-Tesla screens when watching reviews. That one issue would probably keep me away for the time-being.

 

[timeshifter]

I think I'd wait a year, let them work out the navigation and general UI bugs/slowness.

Take this for what it's worth, but the salesman said that's been improved. He said he'd seen lots of those reviews and worried about that before they got their first shipments. He said in his experience it looks like they've fixed some of that. Also, I didn't notice slowness or lag in the UI. But he may have been lying and I didn't spend enough time with it to know how to work it. The Tesla interface seems so clean and understandable, but to be fair, the Tesla screen was a bit mysterious to me on the first few test drives. It wasn't until I was taking delivery or had the car for a bit before it all clicked.

 

[WADan]

Keep in mind that we still don’t know enough about their battery and motor yet. Tesla has those things down.