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AP 2.0 Retrofit sounds possible - or Am I crazy

Discussion in 'Model X' started by Pennstlong, Oct 19, 2016.

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  1. Pennstlong

    Pennstlong Member

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    I am confused, Must be late, is it retrofit-able or is it not? Was today's announcement for AP+ or AP2.0?
     
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  2. Shumdit

    Shumdit Member

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    I think your probably getting bad info. Think about it. The camera, the sensors and the CPU would all have to be upgraded and I have a feeling the connectors from the old mobile eye based system and the new nvidia based one are different too. When the Dual motor came out and AP1 came out, there were Tesla employees telling people it "might" be retrofittable too. I think even "if" it were possible it would be unbelievably expensive but I still am going to stick with my feeling it will. It be offered.
     
  3. Shumdit

    Shumdit Member

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    Pennstlong- He is saying the autopilot+ should be retrofitable (I disagree) to give the enhanced features but not the full autonomy of AP2.0 which is the extra $3000 option over and above the $5000 "base" option effective today.
     
  4. Pennstlong

    Pennstlong Member

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    So Enhanced Autopilot = AP+, Fully Self drive = AP 2.0. I am thinking that is just software difference and not a hardware difference ( except for active v.s disabled cameras)
     
  5. Troy

    Troy Active Member

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    Elon said a retrofit is not possible. Listen HERE after 18:03. It is not just the cameras. Elon also said they are using the Nvidia Titan GPU and the processing power is 40 times faster than the current hardware.

     
  6. Pennstlong

    Pennstlong Member

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    So, he said Self driving needs 8 cameras and more processing power. Not about the enhanced Auto-pilot.
     
  7. Shumdit

    Shumdit Member

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    I don't think the 4 camera system and long range sensors will work without the upgraded CPU either. I think the current system was/is pushing it's limits at this point.
     
  8. Troy

    Troy Active Member

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    #28 Troy, Oct 19, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2016
    @Pennstlong, all cars produced this week have the new hardware. This includes 8 cameras, 8 meters ultrasonic sensors (instead 4 meters) and the Nvidia Titan GPU. There won't be any Teslas that have half the hardware, like 4 cameras.
     
  9. Canuck

    Canuck Well-Known Member

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    But when you buy one today, you can activate "Full Self Driving Capability" which means all new vehicles have the 8 cameras and more processing power. So they must be using the processor for enhanced auto-pilot -- it makes no sense otherwise. They are also probably using all the hardware too - and just limiting features.
     
  10. EV-lutioin

    EV-lutioin Active Member

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    If it is any solace, AP 2.0 cars will be also be "old" when AP 3.0 comes out.
     
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  11. outie

    outie Active Member

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    True, but if AP2 can do level 5 full autonomy, what can AP3 do?
     
  12. Canuck

    Canuck Well-Known Member

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    The drone propellers fold out and fly you over the traffic home. Imagine the threads here by people who just bought before that comes out.
     
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  13. indy360

    indy360 Member

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    There is always going to be better. AP2 can detect 10 cars on the road, AP3 maybe 20. AP2 can react, maybe AP3 can do some basic predicting based on car movement. Maybe AP4 can see intent based on what the driver is looking at in another car. Just because it's Level 5 doesn't mean it can't get smarter or better.
     
  14. keytalker

    keytalker Member

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    like the others said, you can just change to order to by paying $500 change fee to get a differently configured car.

    Or I think you can always come with some excuse to push the delivery for a few months, then I think they will happily sell this car to someone else and build another car for you.
     
  15. shokunin

    shokunin P85 & M3

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    Who's saying AP+? From the call there is no AP+ just AP 2.0 or Hardware 2 as Elon calls it. The software on top of the entire Hardware 2 / AP2.0 platform is offered as Enhanced AP for $5K and full self-driving for $3K.
     
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  16. MP3Mike

    MP3Mike Well-Known Member

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    Besides the fact that Elon said no-retrofits, I highly doubt it would be that easy. He said that the cameras are integrated into the bodywork that nothing sticks out. So, as far as I can tell, it would require new front fenders and B pillars as part of the retrofit. And the Titan GPU is probably added in to the liquid cooling loop, so there would be a lot of re-work to get a retrofit.

    Could it be done? Sure. (Just like @wk057 put AP in a classic Models S.) Will Tesla do it? Not a chance.
     
  17. spentan

    spentan Active Member

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    The way I look at it, it wouldn't be that difficult.

    6 new cameras (there's already a front and rear facing camera), couldn't be more than $100 each. And $100 for a couple of plastic housings. = $700.

    Ultrasonics, maybe about $500

    Processor/GPU around $1000.

    That's $2200 in hardware. $300 for wiring harnesses and new wiring.

    And $2500 in labor buys you a lot of hours to take apart the car and retrofit it.

    We paid $3000 for AP. Paying a $5k retrofit, would bring it in line with the total of $8000 they're charging on new cars. Even $7k would be way better than the level of depreciation we'll see on trading up to a new car.
     
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  18. Matias

    Matias Active Member

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    Even if Tesla wanted to do retrofit, it is not possible due to service center capacity. SC:s are allready now full. What would happen, if there would suddenly be tens of thousands of cars requiring several hours-days work.
     
  19. ggnykk

    ggnykk Active Member

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    Elon from Twitter: "Should mention that retrofitting to full self-driving hardware is very difficult. Cost delta is more than buying a new car. Wish it weren't."
     
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  20. BLKTSLA

    BLKTSLA Member

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    I didnt say it would be inexpensive, I said POSSIBLE, and I absolutely think that the newer cars within the last few months definitely have the ability to have SOME of the hardware retrofitted. Think about Tesla's history of manufacturing, any new hardware they add, gets added or provisions for that hardware are added to all cars prior to announcing said features. This comes in the form of an update to the production line in order to start delivering that hardware at the time of the announcement. Thats the reason why you have SOME RWD cars with APv1 hardware and some just prior to the update in the production line do not and cannot have that hardware.

    Additionally, Tesla has never been keen on offering retrofits in general due to the extra burden it puts on their Service Center, plus the fact that any item that "cannot be retrofitted" becomes a value proposition to buy a "new" car in Tesla's POV. In the case of hardware its usually cost prohibitive, meaning its so costly you might as well buy a new car. This announcement in general is just another demand lever that Elon pulls to drive more sales in Q4 which results in new orders, trade-ins, and resale of the trade-ins to boost the numbers in Q4. So of course Elon will say "no retrofits".
     

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