AP just sent me under a truck

[MXWing]

I have been impressed with how well my EAP does lately in merging and accommodating merging traffic but I never assume it will be perfect. When I’m driving, at the “first sign” of a problem merging I take over to avoid dangerous situations instead of deliberately testing the limits of the system — as you did — and potentially put others at risk.

Or do it 7, 8, 9 times putting danger to the test like that poor chap in Mountain View which left a wife and two kids behind.

 

[Matias]

NoA turns off when leaving a highway.
..

Ok. I thought NoA was still active.

 

[MXWing]

Ok. I thought NoA was still active.

It’s explicit too. Navigation map shows the wheel missing (no NoA) and it warns you to take over as you are about to exit.

Regular autosteer remains in place.

 

[ElectricGhost]

and be patient. FSD will be feature complete this year and fully autonomous next year. in just months you will be able to sleep in your vehicle

Sleeping in the vehicle is likely the best way to counter these issues. If Im laying flat then my head wont get chopped of when my tesla runs under a semi... im sure tesla insurance will cover everything, lol

 

[insaneoctane]

This is a informative thread. I think it is indisputable that we have to stay in control of the vehicle at all times and therefore the OP would have been responsible for this potential accident. The key takeaways here are highlighting APs known limitations and making sure Tesla corrects them. IMO, while it was a close call that many people might not have let play out so closely, the OP *did* take over and prevented the collision. I am often guilty of expecting too much from this beta software. I am shocked that that AP would do what I saw in the video. If this happened to me, not only would I make sure Tesla saw this video but I would not relent until they told me why it happened.
Thanks to OP for sharing.

 

[JackieDonson]

You really need to read your owners manual and understand the limitations of Autopilot, and understand what features are/are not part of your firmware. Cliff note version: Beta software. Not FSD.

Completely agree but they sure market and promote it as fsd.

 

[VQTRVA]

Completely agree but they sure market and promote it as fsd.

Tylenol is marketed as a pain reliever but I don't go (over)taking it without understanding the label.

 

[bwilson4web]

Good catch and matches my tractor trailer testing.

Bob Wilson

 

[MentalNomad]

And by the way, how did you access that camera view?

From the USB stick he installed to enable Tesla Dashcam. Give a search - lots of threads on setting it up.

 

[Seven7]

And by the way, how did you access that camera view?

That's a very good question, or did the OP have a go pro attached to the front fender just for this?

 

[Seven7]

From the USB stick he installed to enable Tesla Dashcam. Give a search - lots of threads on setting it up.

I thought that it only gave you the front camera, not side and fender cameras as well.

 

[bedoig]

U got pwned

LOL. Go look around at the posts from people who have root and watch the network traffic. The triggers Tesla monitors are some miniscule fraction of 1% of disengagements. Karpathy admits this in non-committal language that toes the company line. When you use double qualifiers like "potentially likely" you're obviously backpedaling. As for reviewing every accident, well duh, of course they would. There have probably been a few hundred to a few thousand accidents compared to a few hundred million to a few billion disengagements.

 

[Dre78]

White trailers seem to be interpreted as an overpass. green on Twitter

 

[wwu123]

I guess I'm confused by the the whole thread as half the folks are talking about AP and the other half about NoA (which is either part of the old EAP or the new FSD).

The video seems to show the car merging into traffic from an on-ramp, or from a ramp-to-ramp freeway change. If we're talking about AP, which I think this car only has AP, it doesn't do merges just lane-keeping, and will never speed up or slow down to merge with traffic. If another car is at matched speed and next to you, wouldn't AP itself send you into the other car every time as it run out of detected lane space, or at best disengage because it can't find the lane lines? Aren't we instead talking about the side collision warning, which is a standard non-AP feature, or side collision avoidance SCA, which I think is an AP feature, but will only swerve left or right to avoid an imminent collision?

I do get that the bigger topic of interest is the NN not being able to detect the truck trailer at all, and further how that would impact NoA. But as far as AP goes, even if the truck were detected, the best that could happen is the SCA engages and swerves you into the guardrail, or the AP disengages and warns you to take over immediately since there's no lane left? Why are folks expecting AP would slow down to smoothly merge behind another car or truck?

 

[duanra]

I guess I'm confused by the the whole thread as half the folks are talking about AP and the other half about NoA (which is either part of the old EAP or the new FSD).

The video seems to show the car merging into traffic from an on-ramp, or from a ramp-to-ramp freeway change. If we're talking about AP, which I think this car only has AP, it doesn't do merges just lane-keeping, and will never speed up or slow down to merge with traffic. If another car is at matched speed and next to you, wouldn't AP itself send you into the other car every time as it run out of detected lane space, or at best disengage because it can't find the lane lines? Aren't we instead talking about the side collision warning, which is a standard non-AP feature, or side collision avoidance SCA, which I think is an AP feature, but will only swerve left or right to avoid an imminent collision?

I do get that the bigger topic of interest is the NN not being able to detect the truck trailer at all, and further how that would impact NoA. But as far as AP goes, even if the truck were detected, the best that could happen is the SCA engages and swerves you into the guardrail, or the AP disengages and warns you to take over immediately since there's no lane left? Why are folks expecting AP would slow down to smoothly merge behind another car or truck?

I agree, the AP should give you a warning and disengage.

 

[MXWing]

I guess I'm confused by the the whole thread as half the folks are talking about AP and the other half about NoA (which is either part of the old EAP or the new FSD).

The video seems to show the car merging into traffic from an on-ramp, or from a ramp-to-ramp freeway change. If we're talking about AP, which I think this car only has AP, it doesn't do merges just lane-keeping, and will never speed up or slow down to merge with traffic. If another car is at matched speed and next to you, wouldn't AP itself send you into the other car every time as it run out of detected lane space, or at best disengage because it can't find the lane lines? Aren't we instead talking about the side collision warning, which is a standard non-AP feature, or side collision avoidance SCA, which I think is an AP feature, but will only swerve left or right to avoid an imminent collision?

I do get that the bigger topic of interest is the NN not being able to detect the truck trailer at all, and further how that would impact NoA. But as far as AP goes, even if the truck were detected, the best that could happen is the SCA engages and swerves you into the guardrail, or the AP disengages and warns you to take over immediately since there's no lane left? Why are folks expecting AP would slow down to smoothly merge behind another car or truck?

You leave a gun out and your child shoots their sibling.

Do the parents blame the child?

Does the law go after the child?

Letting autosteer which is NOT FSD get thrown into in a merge situation with heavy traffic and the lane ending is gross negligence.

The autonomy day software is not on owner cars, someone owners think it is for some weird reason.

The whole premise is sensationalist garbage. People have been disagreeing but can’t articulate why.

I demanded better reasoning skills from my primary school age kids.

 

[Xcelerator]

Thanks for the post. The bottom line of where AP is now is, you are fully in charge of your car at all times. Tesla should probably be more explicit about this reality (not sure how), but, for anyone who hasn't read a million posts about this by now - you are the driver, period. True self driving is coming, it won't be a quickly as Elon says, but, his poor ability to predict the timing of things is certainly nothing new. But, until we have real FSD, you must never be lulled into thinking the car is in charge. Stay safe.

 

[doghousePVD]

I have had several experience on EAP where I thought I was too close to a truck. However, when I check both mirrors, I see that I am entirely in my lane, and the truck is entirely in his lane. I used to give trucks more space, but now that I was paying attention, I see that I used to swerve lightly out of my lane to make more space. Actually, not good driving on my part.

I don't like staying right next to a truck at highway speeds, so I'll usually overtake or drop back for more room.

I do agree with the thread comments about the NoA, which I usually find more stressful than doing maneuvers myself. In the East, many exits/intersections are not quite up to Interstate standards, with extra lanes, lane cutoffs, sharper exit angles, tor too close (multiple exits and entrances per mile). Officially Interstates, but squeezed into old cities and around pre-existing structures.

 

[ibGeek]

First of all, glad your OK. Secondly, you probably would not get any argument at all from anyone at Tesla. This is EXACTLY why they tell you to maintain control of the vehicle at all times until such time as they announce otherwise. You were paying attention and you maintained control. That's a win for everyone as the data from that deviation will help prevent them in the future.

In case anyone is under the assumption that improvements to Auto Pilot happen in real time. THEY DO NOT! They happen via over the air updates. And they don't happen with every update as it takes time to put the data together and validate it then to incorporate it in to the code base. So if your car has a bad habit, that habit will remain until an over the air update fixes it. I say this because there are a lot of misinformed folks out there.

I personally do not use the current Autopilot in the slow lane at all. Merging is not safe yet in my opinion. Move over one lane though and your fine. This is because the current iteration is too insistent on maintaining the middle of the lane. When a new lane merges in, that lane can double in width causing your car to try to split the difference. Probably what your car did. Even if it doesn't cause an accident, it's often no all that polite to the cars merging in from that lane. Just my 2 Cents.

 

[cwmagui]

Just a thought... I wonder if it's possible that AP saw the rear tires of the tractor and the rear tires of the trailer as two separate vehicles and tried to merge between them.