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  • The latest TMC Podcast (#14) is now available on YouTube and all major podcast networks. We covered FSD Beta's exciting v11 update, Enhanced Autopilot coming to the U.S. and Canada, and more!

AP/phantom braking.

This is no longer appropriate. After 2022.8.2 and later, my MY no longer PHs. I'm super happy with the current performance of AP.
100% this. I was a loud vocal critic of TACC/AP phantom braking. With the latest updates, both are very usable at this point. There has been a drastic, huge improvement as of late. Where I would cringe using TACC on anything other than split highways, I can use it almost anywhere without incident. I think that the NHSTA opening an investigation into Tesla phantom braking finally got them taking this issue seriously. Kudos to whomever at Tesla who made the decision to push out the TACC improvments in this recent update. I imagine that a lot of improvements came from the FSD testing that's been going on.
 
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2101Guy

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Jan 6, 2020
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100% this. I was a loud vocal critic of TACC/AP phantom braking. With the latest updates, both are very usable at this point. There has been a drastic, huge improvement as of late. Where I would cringe using TACC on anything other than split highways, I can use it almost anywhere without incident. I think that the NHSTA opening an investigation into Tesla phantom braking finally got them taking this issue seriously. Kudos to whomever at Tesla who made the decision to push out the TACC improvments in this recent update. I imagine that a lot of improvements came from the FSD testing that's been going on.
And sometimes....this is what it takes (Government action) to push Tesla to do the proper thing...
 
And sometimes....this is what it takes (Government action) to push Tesla to do the proper thing...
Yes - although it’s unclear if it was government action, user complaints or just system improvements that they were already working on.

In the end, I don’t care what the cause was - I’m happy it’s getting better!
 
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And sometimes....this is what it takes (Government action) to push Tesla to do the proper thing...
Government action did not make this happen. Very unlikely. Tesla is not in the game like the others who don’t even move until pushed. Inertia. Tesla is always in a state of motion unless someone stops it.
 

Battpower

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Supporting Member
Oct 10, 2019
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Not to dampen the mood, but much as I want / long to see progress, I'm not convinced. (I have MS R LR Raven in UK). The first and most drastic pb event I had (not long after getting the car) was coming out of a long tunnel with overhead signs, long shadows, bright sun. Really scarey. Very harsh. Not gradual slowing.

Over the months I've got used to bracing myself for harsh braking while passing curtain-sided trucks but generally these pb events seem to have become less common. Slowing for speed changes or incorrect map data etc just as random and common as ever, but not such a problem.

The other day (on 2022.12. 3.2) I did a 500 mile round trip. Every had been going smoothly for 100 miles or so, then coming out from a short tunnel in to low sun and long strong shadows had a very harsh pb event

No other vehicles around. This [email protected] really takes the edge off an otherwise decent car.

When I get chance I want to look at Teslamate data. While the braking felt harsh, I believe I noticed that it triggered high momentary regen so it should be possible to pinpoint exactly where the event happened and to some extent if it maxed out regen limit.

Since Tesla werent sophisticated enough to implement blended braking, any sudden (extreme beyond taking foot off accelerator) deceleration / regen peak on a level stretch of road must be triggered by the car.
 
Not to dampen the mood, but much as I want / long to see progress, I'm not convinced. (I have MS R LR Raven in UK). The first and most drastic pb event I had (not long after getting the car) was coming out of a long tunnel with overhead signs, long shadows, bright sun. Really scarey. Very harsh. Not gradual slowing.

Over the months I've got used to bracing myself for harsh braking while passing curtain-sided trucks but generally these pb events seem to have become less common. Slowing for speed changes or incorrect map data etc just as random and common as ever, but not such a problem.

The other day (on 2022.12. 3.2) I did a 500 mile round trip. Every had been going smoothly for 100 miles or so, then coming out from a short tunnel in to low sun and long strong shadows had a very harsh pb event

No other vehicles around. This [email protected] really takes the edge off an otherwise decent car.

When I get chance I want to look at Teslamate data. While the braking felt harsh, I believe I noticed that it triggered high momentary regen so it should be possible to pinpoint exactly where the event happened and to some extent if it maxed out regen limit.

Since Tesla werent sophisticated enough to implement blended braking, any sudden (extreme beyond taking foot off accelerator) deceleration / regen peak on a level stretch of road must be triggered by the car.
Truly sorry you experienced this; I had thought Model S was more immune to this annoyance.
 
I've had a 2018 Model 3 with EAP, and believe me- when the radar was turned off the PB incidents increased exponentially - it is most definitely NOT safe (sorry Elon; this is an issue Tesla's going to be sued over when less experienced drivers overreact to these PB events). Frankly, I love the car. But I honestly expect- and we Tesla fans have always believed in- continuous improvement. This is not continuous improvement - and yes, I'm operating on 2022.12.3.2 currently. Considering I use AP considerably (never use Navigate on Autopilot as it loves to change lanes), the PB events have become not only worrisome, but downright scary. Come on, Tesla- get this fixed up - either Vision works or it doesn't. Don't experiment on me and my family, please.
 
I've had a 2018 Model 3 with EAP, and believe me- when the radar was turned off the PB incidents increased exponentially - it is most definitely NOT safe (sorry Elon; this is an issue Tesla's going to be sued over when less experienced drivers overreact to these PB events). Frankly, I love the car. But I honestly expect- and we Tesla fans have always believed in- continuous improvement. This is not continuous improvement - and yes, I'm operating on 2022.12.3.2 currently. Considering I use AP considerably (never use Navigate on Autopilot as it loves to change lanes), the PB events have become not only worrisome, but downright scary. Come on, Tesla- get this fixed up - either Vision works or it doesn't. Don't experiment on me and my family, please.
Are you sure you are on vision because your car is a 2018 model 3 ???
 
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novox77

Active Member
Nov 25, 2017
2,715
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I've had a 2018 Model 3 with EAP, and believe me- when the radar was turned off the PB incidents increased exponentially - it is most definitely NOT safe (sorry Elon; this is an issue Tesla's going to be sued over when less experienced drivers overreact to these PB events). Frankly, I love the car. But I honestly expect- and we Tesla fans have always believed in- continuous improvement. This is not continuous improvement - and yes, I'm operating on 2022.12.3.2 currently. Considering I use AP considerably (never use Navigate on Autopilot as it loves to change lanes), the PB events have become not only worrisome, but downright scary. Come on, Tesla- get this fixed up - either Vision works or it doesn't. Don't experiment on me and my family, please.

Based on your firmware (not FSD beta), your radar is still on. Only cars that came off the line without radars or are running FSD beta firmware are vision-only.

I also have a 2018 Model 3 and am in FSD beta. My radar is disabled. I no longer get phantom braking from overpasses and road signs, ever. Those were definitely radar false positives.

If you're on vision-only, you won't be able to set your follow distance to 1 anymore, and your max speed during AP will be 80mph (soon to be 85mph). Radar cars can go to 90mph before car complains.
 
I've had a 2018 Model 3 with EAP, and believe me- when the radar was turned off the PB incidents increased exponentially - it is most definitely NOT safe (sorry Elon; this is an issue Tesla's going to be sued over when less experienced drivers overreact to these PB events). Frankly, I love the car. But I honestly expect- and we Tesla fans have always believed in- continuous improvement. This is not continuous improvement - and yes, I'm operating on 2022.12.3.2 currently. Considering I use AP considerably (never use Navigate on Autopilot as it loves to change lanes), the PB events have become not only worrisome, but downright scary. Come on, Tesla- get this fixed up - either Vision works or it doesn't. Don't experiment on me and my family, please.
2021 Model 3 with no radar installed and no AP phantom braking since January.
 
One thing I've noticed recently is the car tends to brake when someone is approaching and passing you on the left. I was driving to our cabin a few weeks ago on a 2 lane state highway and on 2 or 3 occasions when a car was passing me the car would brake fairly aggressively about the time the passing car entered my blind spot. I noticed the same behavior again on the interstate the other day - I was in the middle lane and a car approached and passed in the left lane going about 10 MPH faster than me. In both cases the car was completely in the other lane, there was no traffic ahead of me or any other reason to brake. I will often let off the accelerator if someone is passing me on a 2 lane road to let them in, however Tesla actually started accelerating back to the set speed before the other car had finished passing me so I can't explain it by the car trying to be polite and that wouldn't apply to the interstate, anyway.
 
One thing I've noticed recently is the car tends to brake when someone is approaching and passing you on the left. I was driving to our cabin a few weeks ago on a 2 lane state highway and on 2 or 3 occasions when a car was passing me the car would brake fairly aggressively about the time the passing car entered my blind spot. I noticed the same behavior again on the interstate the other day - I was in the middle lane and a car approached and passed in the left lane going about 10 MPH faster than me. In both cases the car was completely in the other lane, there was no traffic ahead of me or any other reason to brake. I will often let off the accelerator if someone is passing me on a 2 lane road to let them in, however Tesla actually started accelerating back to the set speed before the other car had finished passing me so I can't explain it by the car trying to be polite and that wouldn't apply to the interstate, anyway.
I drive with AutoSteer(beta) regularly on 3 lane highways and never experienced slowdown due to traffic in other lanes. The only time it alows down is when the vehicle ahead of me slows down.
 
I drive with AutoSteer(beta) regularly on 3 lane highways and never experienced slowdown due to traffic in other lanes. The only time it alows down is when the vehicle ahead of me slows down.
🤷‍♂️Usually it doesn't for me, either, but I do get random slowdowns on the interstate. Had I not had the recent drive on the state highway and made the association with people passing me I probably wouldn't have made the connection with the last case I had on the interstate. It may have something to do with how fast the car is approaching from behind. In the episode I referenced, the car passing in the lane to my left was moving quite a bit faster than I was.
 
🤷‍♂️Usually it doesn't for me, either, but I do get random slowdowns on the interstate. Had I not had the recent drive on the state highway and made the association with people passing me I probably wouldn't have made the connection with the last case I had on the interstate. It may have something to do with how fast the car is approaching from behind. In the episode I referenced, the car passing in the lane to my left was moving quite a bit faster than I was.
I will keep that in mind. The speed limit here is 70mph and everyone is doing 85mph. I am generally in the middle lane doing 75mph.
 

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