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AP2 minor accident

Discussion in 'Model S' started by davinci2017, May 31, 2017.

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  1. davinci2017

    davinci2017 Member

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    Well it has happened, my couple month old Model S has its battle scars from AP2, was just a matter of time I suppose.

    My reliance on AP2 during my Memorial day vacation backfired on my way back. Was on 101-N central coast area, on the right most lane with AP2 under speed limit behind a vehicle that was slower. Turns out the right lane was closed ahead, and I didnt catch a sign in advance. The vehicle in front pulled to the left last second and the car attempted to catch up back to speed limit, AP2 didn't see Lane delineator poles at all and just chugged through, by the time I noticed and could take over and swerve out it was too late, got hit by a couple of them.
    Screen Shot 2017-05-31 at 8.43.46 AM.png

    Have nasty dents and paint marks on the hood and bumper, looks to be expensive, local body shop says needs hood replacement, not sure if I should go insurance or out of pocket as I'm not clear what this would qualify as under insurance.

    Tesla needs to ensure the car can see hazard related stuff with the camera, especially when they are high visbility colors and reflectors, was a tad surprised that the car just ploughed through without any slow down, but there was fault on my end as well I acknowledge that.

    20170531_084231.jpg

    Oh well, I guess AP2 still has ways to go, and FSD? Who are you kidding!
     
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  2. oktane

    oktane Active Member

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    Ouch, sorry to see the battle scars on your car but glad you are OK.

    Yes despite the marketing hype this technology is only in infancy.

    If it were me, I would try an aggressive polishing compound applied with an orbital polisher first and then see what's left. I can't tell from the photo if it is dirty or a deep scratch on the hood? If deep scratch then you'll obviously need new paint.

    I think you might just be left with a dent that a paint-less dent removal guy can improve significantly. Hood replacement etc. will be expensive due to Tesla's outrageous pricing.
     
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  3. Az_Rael

    Az_Rael Supporting Member

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    Yikes. That is ugly. I am guessing it will be under the collision portion of your insurance vs comprehensive, but I might be wrong.
     
  4. davinci2017

    davinci2017 Member

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    Yeah its deep, I got it checked at the local detailer as well and he said its gone through all the way and its not worth fixing without repaint, the dent is fairly big as well like a ball shaped curved pit. I need to ask a few more folks about fixing the dent vs replacing hood
     
  5. BrettS

    BrettS Member

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    Ouch, that really sucks:( I'm wondering what the lane lines looked like at that location. AP (1 an 2) lives and dies by the lane lines and if the lines were unclear (or maybe even worse went straight into the obstacle) then the car would follow the lines and go straight. If the lines were repainted properly they would direct the car away from the obstacle. The AP system really doesn't notice small obstacles like that... at a distance I suspect that it would be difficult for the camera to distinguish from a mark in the road. (It is also my understanding that the AP cameras are black and white, so the bright color wouldn't really make a difference there)
     
  6. GlmnAlyAirCar

    GlmnAlyAirCar Member

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    Why would you expect auto steer, which keeps you in your lane, to handle this situation when lanes merge?
     
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  7. oktane

    oktane Active Member

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    Because the final FSD code is completing final validation and will be released in December 2016. Because of the 8 cameras. Because the car apparently can already detect pedestrians, road signs, lanes, brush, and drive itself around in the parking lot and on city streets. You mean that was just a scam when the car will be oblivious to what other cars are doing and won't see a 6 ft construction cone or merging lanes?

    Fault mostly Tesla's in this accident for poor programming. If lane markers were ambiguous the car should have followed the cars in front. This is ENHANCEDautoPILOT not autoSTEER. This is FULL-SELF-DRIVE with advanced NVIDIA technology that will drive completely unassisted, coast to coast, including charging stops, by the end of 2017.

    If there is a positive, maybe your video data from the crash will be uploaded to the "neural net" to train all future Tesla's not to plow into construction cones. But I suspect this crash will have to be repeated a few hundred times before the magic Tesla AI picks up on this.
     
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  8. GlmnAlyAirCar

    GlmnAlyAirCar Member

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    But those features are not advertised as available. Right now, autosteer is autosteer. Read your manual.
     
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  9. Pinot.Noir

    Pinot.Noir Member

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    Did your car brake at all? I would think AEB would at least engage at some point. Good thing there wasn't construction equipment on the other side of the delineators
     
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  10. davinci2017

    davinci2017 Member

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    I tend to agree a little bit with you which is why I dont completely blame the system for it. But I think hazard poles and signs should be a priority for any self driving system. Auto-steer even if it requires driver attention will still have to factor these in especially when on a freeway well before the more "advanced" stuff for FSD comes in.

    I was surprised that it did not see high visibility cones/poles at all and just rammed through, not attempting any correction. To me that seems like a big miss on Tesla to launch high speed auto-steer with zero ability to see high visibility hazard items.
     
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  11. davinci2017

    davinci2017 Member

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    No which is why i was quite surprised. AEB didnt kick in AT ALL. It ploughed through the poles not slowing down even after the first one hit.
     
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  12. alcibiades

    alcibiades Member

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    It hit one of those things nearly dead center on the hood. Kid height object. Kept going AFTER collision, too, without breaking.

    Terrifying.

    @JonMc Please show this incident to your boss.
     
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  13. Pinot.Noir

    Pinot.Noir Member

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    I presume you don't have a dashcam? Not that you would want to relive the event. Sounds like AEB needs a tweak to at least engage when an impact is detected.
     
  14. oktane

    oktane Active Member

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    Great points by everyone, didn't even remember about forward collision assist. My guess is the object was too small to trigger an alert. FCW is probably using radar rather than the cameras. You'd think camera data will eventually be used, but we all know Tesla's software is only half-baked right now, despite their marketing claims.
     
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  15. LuPapa

    LuPapa Member

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    AEB should definitely trigger on a collision of any kind. That's an obvious sign that the car needs to stop.
     
  16. davinci2017

    davinci2017 Member

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    Unfortunately I had forgotten it for this trip, it would have been ideal to look at it, I would have liked a second look as well.
     
  17. andrewket

    andrewket Well-Known Member

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    The current version of AEB only reduces the speed of an unavoidable accident with a CAR in front of you.
     
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  18. Max*

    Max* Not Banned

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    Man, you got some overgrown construction cones in your neck of the woods
     
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  19. croman

    croman Active Member

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    They are thin objects so it is harder to see (even though I agree its clearly visible to us (but these cameras don't see in color). It won't trigger the radar (which is likely the primary sensor for AEB). Even reflectors aren't reflecting the radar and clearly the Vision is not pulling its weight (much less carrying the operation like it should be).

    We have to remember EAP isn't even going to be anything beyond L2 even after its done. You can't keep your eyes off the road (a Founder's X was maybe totaled because of this and an overeliance on a giant screen to control things like rear seat heat). Bad things happen no matter what L2 system you use if you aren't paying attention. Even on a highway when its more reliable (and thus more likely to lull a driver), these kinds of situations end up popping up.
     
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  20. Max*

    Max* Not Banned

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    Except the car should distinguish between a kid and a pole, and should trigger AEB for a kid; whereas there might not be programming logic as to what to do when you're approaching a pole and/or an unrecognized object.
     
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