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Apple Working Toward Fully Autonomous Car With No Steering Wheel or Pedals, Aiming to Launch in 2025
- Thread starter emmz0r
- Start date
EVNow
Well-Known Member
Do you think Cook will come out one of these days and announce you can buy a driverless Apple Car from next Monday without anyone noticing any major testing effort ?
EVNow
Well-Known Member
BTW, Apple Car was supposed to come in ... Sep, 2021.
appleinsider.com
ps : They were even laying off engineers in 2019.
mashable.com
And is now headed by the genius who built BMW i3 ?
www.engadget.com
And they don't have the batteries.
www.macrumors.com
Just for completeness ... here is what Cook said about Elon & Tesla.
Dubious supply chain report claims 'Apple Car' will arrive in September 2021 | AppleInsider
The often-rumored 'Apple Car' could arrive earlier than expected, a dubious report claims, with Apple apparently planning to introduce the self-designed vehicle in September 2021.
appleinsider.com
ps : They were even laying off engineers in 2019.
Apple confirms self-driving car layoffs, says it mostly fired engineers
Apple's self-driving car ambitions might be smaller than we thought.
mashable.com
And is now headed by the genius who built BMW i3 ?
Apple hires former BMW and Faraday Future exec to EV team
Apple has hired former BMW executive Ulrich Kranz to join its automotive team.
www.engadget.com
And they don't have the batteries.
Apple Car Battery Talks Stall in Another Blow to Electric Vehicle Project
Apple's negotiations with the Chinese companies CATL and BYD about supplying batteries for its rumored electric vehicle have mostly stalled,...
www.macrumors.com
Just for completeness ... here is what Cook said about Elon & Tesla.
“I’ve never spoken to Elon, although I have great admiration and respect for the company he’s built,” Cook told the New York Times. “I think Tesla has done an unbelievable job of not only establishing the lead, but keeping the lead for such a long period of time in the EV space.”
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I think the idea of anyone having consumer cars without steering wheels by 2025 is ludicrous unless they’re specifically designed for a very narrow purpose
But I’d bet Apple’s tech and AI are further ahead than we might imagine, they just don’t usually put stuff out there at all until it’s fully baked. And Apple tends to go for really polished simplified versions of what others are doing, so I’d be curious what this would even look like.
You can see Apple clearly pushing in that direction though in CarPlay, they’ve been updating the maps and they look and function great
EVNow
Well-Known Member
I know there are a lot of Apple fans who think they can do no wrong and can walk on water.
But the fact is - building cars, that too an EV - and that too an AV can't be done in secrecy. Its just not possible.
ps : Apple acquired a autonomous vehicle startup Drive.ai in 2019. That is basically what they have now.
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roblab
Active Member
My Model S is quite usable. This worry about driving autonomously is a little unnecessary.
Not unnecessary for some people. I am benefiting from the L2 automation now, but I can see in a few years that I will need something more. And there are countless people who need it now, some who realize/admit it and some who don't.
I'm not intending to push back on you, I agree that for most people it's an interesting benefit if it works smoothly but it's not a necessity. I'm just pointing out that for some, full automation will actually be a significant enabler, even a key to independent living.
You can’t expect a company to keep coming up with tons of original ideas that change things. Cisco is a classic case of that with VoIP. They bought a company and renamed it Call Manager 20yrs ago. They might have invented the router we all know and jumped into other games like switching and wireless. But they had 1 idea.
Give Apple credit for building their own silicon and dumping Intel who has floundered the past 8-10yrs with mediocrity. They did design and build that. Their M2 chips nothing compares to it in the consumer world along with their mobile chips.
Driverless tech, yeah buy it likely. They have the cash to burn nearly 1T of it.
jakimo
Member
One thing that I couldn’t see happening: no wheel or pedals.
I bought in with Tesla purely for software, the tech, and the autonomous development path are such a joy to be a part of! I’ve beta tested and used tech since the Commodore 64, and so my first ’more like a human’ path was speech synthesis. Yet even today the best video games are recording actors for voice overs
As much as this journey is intriguing, even more so: now one wants to have zero availing to control. We want the choice!
Apple will launch their car with FSD ability, not as a beta. But it’ll definitely be a car, with the ability for a human driver to control it manually. Otherwise, it would never sell!
I use FSD often, but not so I can lose the joy of driving altogether! Why would I ever pay to downgrade my entire experience? Even every sci-fi show of auto-pilot and android use has the moment where the character says “I’ll take it from here, I’m going in!”
I bought in with Tesla purely for software, the tech, and the autonomous development path are such a joy to be a part of! I’ve beta tested and used tech since the Commodore 64, and so my first ’more like a human’ path was speech synthesis. Yet even today the best video games are recording actors for voice overs
As much as this journey is intriguing, even more so: now one wants to have zero availing to control. We want the choice!
Apple will launch their car with FSD ability, not as a beta. But it’ll definitely be a car, with the ability for a human driver to control it manually. Otherwise, it would never sell!
I use FSD often, but not so I can lose the joy of driving altogether! Why would I ever pay to downgrade my entire experience? Even every sci-fi show of auto-pilot and android use has the moment where the character says “I’ll take it from here, I’m going in!”
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
I think the US, EU, China, Korea and Japan already do or plan to well before then. That’s a big enough market.
I wonder if Musk thinks that they will achieve level 5 in 2022 instead of 2021
Elon Musk says Tesla's Full Self-Driving tech will have Level 5 autonomy by the end of 2021
Tesla's CEO also confirmed that customers won't be able to transfer previous FSD purchases between old and new cars.
What has two thumbs and thinks Full-Self Driving will be Level 5 capable by the end of 2021? This guy.
Self-Driving system. According to Musk, the FSD will be capable of Level 5 autonomy by the end of 2021.
Now, that's a really big claim, and it's hard to see how the system will go from its current beta state -- which isn't even reliably Level 3 autonomous -- to being "at least 100% safer than a human driver," according to the CEO. Musk also claims FSD will be capable of driving the car anywhere under any conditions with no need for human interaction. Tall order, indeed.
The key to getting to that magic Level 5 point involves transferring Tesla's neural network to use surround-view camera footage and then automating the processing of that footage. Tesla is working on a supercomputer called Dojo that is supposed to take on that task, but it's still a big job.
We also learned a few things about the business side of FSD. First, Musk reiterated his stance that Tesla "isn't a walled garden," which means that he's open to licensing the company's tech. This would extend beyond Supercharging, which he's spoken about before, all the way to Full Self-Driving and even to the aforementioned Dojo computer. Musk claimed that he's been in talks with other manufacturers already about licensing Autopilot and FSD.
We also learned that Tesla has no plans to let Tesla owners transfer their FSD purchase to another Tesla vehicle. That means that a customer who shelled out $7,000 a few years ago for technology that didn't exist will now have to spend another $10,000 on the same technology that still isn't ready for public consumption. One could see how that might chafe the faithful. As a consolation (kind of), Musk stated that FSD functionality would be offered as a subscription to Tesla customers in the next couple of months.
Beyond FSD, we learned that Tesla's delays in the production of the Semi and other future models are the result of battery supply constraints, and that even though Tesla has started production on its own cells, it is asking its battery partners (Panasonic, CATL, etc.) to increase output further to help.
EVNow
Well-Known Member
Lagging factor is technology, not law - in US several states will allow AVs. Infact many already do.
Florida doesn't require permits for driverless cars
Uber hit the road with self-driving cars in San Francisco in December, but California regulators quickly hit the brakes.
www.politifact.com
Sometimes really super smart people don’t know obvious day to day things like the date! 2021 ends next months, I won’t have completed my list of to do things around my house by then. Unless he means that in the lab on his supercomputer it’s a reality (or rather virtual reality).I wonder if Musk thinks that they will achieve level 5 in 2022 instead of 2021
Elon Musk says Tesla's Full Self-Driving tech will have Level 5 autonomy by the end of 2021
Tesla's CEO also confirmed that customers won't be able to transfer previous FSD purchases between old and new cars.
What has two thumbs and thinks Full-Self Driving will be Level 5 capable by the end of 2021? This guy.
Self-Driving system. According to Musk, the FSD will be capable of Level 5 autonomy by the end of 2021.
Now, that's a really big claim, and it's hard to see how the system will go from its current beta state -- which isn't even reliably Level 3 autonomous -- to being "at least 100% safer than a human driver," according to the CEO. Musk also claims FSD will be capable of driving the car anywhere under any conditions with no need for human interaction. Tall order, indeed.
The key to getting to that magic Level 5 point involves transferring Tesla's neural network to use surround-view camera footage and then automating the processing of that footage. Tesla is working on a supercomputer called Dojo that is supposed to take on that task, but it's still a big job.
We also learned a few things about the business side of FSD. First, Musk reiterated his stance that Tesla "isn't a walled garden," which means that he's open to licensing the company's tech. This would extend beyond Supercharging, which he's spoken about before, all the way to Full Self-Driving and even to the aforementioned Dojo computer. Musk claimed that he's been in talks with other manufacturers already about licensing Autopilot and FSD.
We also learned that Tesla has no plans to let Tesla owners transfer their FSD purchase to another Tesla vehicle. That means that a customer who shelled out $7,000 a few years ago for technology that didn't exist will now have to spend another $10,000 on the same technology that still isn't ready for public consumption. One could see how that might chafe the faithful. As a consolation (kind of), Musk stated that FSD functionality would be offered as a subscription to Tesla customers in the next couple of months.
Beyond FSD, we learned that Tesla's delays in the production of the Semi and other future models are the result of battery supply constraints, and that even though Tesla has started production on its own cells, it is asking its battery partners (Panasonic, CATL, etc.) to increase output further to help.
To be honest, I never expected level five or to use my car as an Uber while I sleep. But please Mr Musk what I would really love is 360 degree camera view for parking and transferable FSD. In other words only those things that I told my wife the car already has before she let me buy it
Knowing that the son of Apple's chair of the board holds a Stanford Ph.D. (autonomous driving algorithms),
and was a principal at Zoox, they could have purchased them early on. It would have been nice to be a fly on
the wall for dinner table conversations between Jesse Levinson and his father ...
... But alas, Zoox is now a completely owned subsidiary of Amazon, who may have applied
golden handcuffs to Jesse if they work the way most acquiring companies do.
Separately, Apple (still?) has a cool billion invested in Didi Chuxing, but the odds of
a partnership there are uncertain. As others have said here on the forum, it's not
about hardware so much as software. The "analysts" on Wall St. and elsewhere
aren't AI specialists, so the reporting about Apple has been more about "speeds and feeds"
and the fact that the A15 chip will follow the A14 (just as night follows day) for consumer
products.
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I’ll be honest and I’ve always wondered why companies would want to do self driving. Self driving will be safer than humans driving of that I have no doubt (in fact monkeys would be safer than many humans on the road). In fact I think that self driving cars will be an order of magnitude safer. But none the less, there will be accidents, statistically there has to be. And people are going to sue, for huge companies with deep pockets they are going to get sued for a lot. And every jumped up Jack McCoy is going to want to see some executives go to jail.
Just my thoughts
Just my thoughts
EVNow
Well-Known Member
There is big money to be made. For large tech companies, there is the FOMO.
They will have solid legal strategies to limit damages - more over, I think initially a lot of accidents might be caused by other (human) drivers. Robotaxis are more likely to follow all the traffic laws and would be less likely to be the faulty party.
So what if they have the money? What company that has level 5 for them to buy? Nope, such company does not exist!
They still logged more autonomous miles than Tesla, tho. Maybe they work on something super secret
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