TMC is an independent, primarily volunteer organization that relies on ad revenue to cover its operating costs. Please consider whitelisting TMC on your ad blocker and becoming a Supporting Member. For more info: Support TMC

Are short sales legal? What can I do?

Discussion in 'TSLA Investor Discussions' started by felialcho, Jul 4, 2018.

  1. felialcho

    felialcho Member

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2017
    Messages:
    20
    Location:
    San Ramon, ca
    From SEC,
    Are short sales legal?
    Although the vast majority of short sales are legal, abusive short sale practices are illegal. Short sales used to manipulate the price of a stock are generally prohibited. Some examples of prohibited manipulation include:
    • engaging in a series of transactions to create actual or apparent active trading in a security; or
    • depressing the price of a security to induce other investors to purchase or sell the security.
    The $50 SP drop is clearly manipulated by organized short sellers and violates the above SEC rules. Without regulations, oil, traditional car companies and affiliates funded investment funds can drive a new competitor out of market with stock manipulation and mis-information, simply because they can lose billions of dollars.

    I wonder how to file SEC complaints on this, or if there is any on-going efforts(investigations or class actions against those firms) which I'll be grad to contribute.
     
  2. mblakele

    mblakele (つ ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)つ

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2016
    Messages:
    830
    Location:
    SF Bay Area
  3. neroden

    neroden Model S Owner and Frustrated Tesla Fan

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2011
    Messages:
    10,529
    Location:
    Ithaca, NY, USA
    The SEC has been super lackadaisical about market manipulation for the last couple of decades, but you could give it a shot. You'd probably have to assemble a full dossier of the hit pieces *and* minute-by-minute charts showing the abnormal trading activity (spikes of huge numbers of shares sold in seconds). Even then they'd probably do nothing.
     
  4. glide

    glide Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2018
    Messages:
    327
    Location:
    USA
    Is this seriously what people worry about in their free time?

    What proof do you have of any improprieties?
     
    • Like x 2
    • Funny x 1
  5. neroden

    neroden Model S Owner and Frustrated Tesla Fan

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2011
    Messages:
    10,529
    Location:
    Ithaca, NY, USA
    The phony "news" articles are proof of improprieties. That's documented.
     
  6. adaptabl

    adaptabl Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2018
    Messages:
    593
    Location:
    Canada
    You may also have to look at Elon's tweets to see if they have a effect on the stock value and if everything sent out is accurate and legal. His tweets can move the markets by millions of dollars. There should be some way of verifying the information. I think this is a very dangerous method of getting information out by a CEO. Most other companies have all news releases verified by a communications and legal team to be sure they are following the SEC rules.
     
    • Disagree x 2
  7. ggr

    ggr Roadster R80 537, SigS P85 29, M3P 80k

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2011
    Messages:
    4,663
    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    A few years ago the SEC basically ruled that his tweets were sufficiently widely distributed to be considered real disclosures. That means that they had better be real, because it would be much easier for the SEC to go after him if he made an actual false statement. But bear in mind that "aspirational goals" are exactly that. He's not committing to something, and then looking back if the goal is missed, and somehow turning that statement into a lie. Any official statement can move the market by millions... that is not market manipulation.
     
    • Like x 2
  8. nwdiver

    nwdiver Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2013
    Messages:
    4,226
    Location:
    United States
    ..... TSLA is just on sale; Buy more, worry less...
     
    • Like x 2
  9. Leopold Stotch

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2017
    Messages:
    132
    Location:
    Calgary, AB
    Buy time indeed!
     
    • Like x 1
  10. Eclectic

    Eclectic Member

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2014
    Messages:
    651
    Location:
    Bay Area & Montana
    You'd be wasting your time, and the SEC's time, if you file a complaint without specific facts that show a law was broken. You will need names, dates, specific actions that were taken, etc. What it would take is something like finding a short seller who faked a press release with negative news and sold shares as the stock was dropping. Vague allegations will get you a polite "thanks for reporting, nothing to see here" response.
     
    • Like x 1
    • Disagree x 1
  11. nwdiver

    nwdiver Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2013
    Messages:
    4,226
    Location:
    United States
    And... you realize that covering a short position makes the stock go UP... right?
     
  12. deonb

    deonb Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2013
    Messages:
    3,757
    Location:
    Redmond, WA
    • Helpful x 1
    • Like x 1
  13. GeorgeSymonds

    GeorgeSymonds Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2018
    Messages:
    192
    Location:
    NJ
    The drop in share price alone shows nothing “clearly’ other than the net of all the trading is that the shares can be bought for $50 less. A lot of smaller investors got carried away with the 5000 in a week news whipped up by Musk and the ‘we”ll show the shorters” rhetoric and pumped in cash and casually ignored the earlier shut down to be able to burst at 6000 and the quarter average of 2200. Meanwhile those with a cold dispassionate view look at it and think M3 production ramp and current structure is damn ugly fuelled by potential paint shop capacity limits, a tent, stories the tent is more efficient than the original line (just how bad is the original line that took so much cash to build that a thrown together tent is better?) etc. The story behind the 5000 in a week headline is not pretty, even though I rejoice at them actually achieving that goal. Share price, especially Tesla, is built on sentiment and potential, actual production numbers move the dial very little.
     
    • Like x 2

Share This Page

  • About Us

    Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.
  • Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


    SUPPORT TMC