Article: How Tesla Keeps a Monopoly on Fixing it's Cars.

[lolachampcar]

Tesla can get away with this "our way or the highway" approach to service data for now. The day will come when they reach a critical mass where they will be forced by law to provide service support. I'll cite all OEM's being required to provide pass through programming capabilities for their vehicles such that independent shops can update emissions as one example of how this stuff comes about. I know, Tesla does over the air updates and their are no emissions requirements. I provided just one example of how the independent repair group got access to technology and information the OEMs did not want to provide. MA's right to repair law is another.

The argument that electricity is different from gas has merit. They are different but then that is where the argument falls apart. Gas and fires can kill you just as quick as high voltage. All transportation will move to high voltage electric power so we simply need to start the transition on the independent service side of things. It is not if but when.

For those crying troll, check my sig and do a search for how many years I have been advocating for Tesla to document their product.

 

[thegruf]

What happens when you take your Audi/BMW/MB into a dealer?

If is is manufacturer approved dealer/shop who have invested in the right equipment/training then your car gets connected to the factory for diagnosis and software updates.
If not, it doesn't.

and the difference to Tesla is ... no dealers.

Don't get me wrong though, I do believe Tesla's position will have to evolve as the cars get older and their used market value drops.
The justifiable complaints at not being able to swap out eg a faulty door handle, piece of trim DIY will actually hurt the resale cost.
The problem is how to deal with coding of "smart" replacment parts.

imho Tesla will move on this - in time.

 

[JohnQ]

So are ICE cars and EVs, that's the entire point.

I don't believe we'll ever see eye to eye on this. The only way for an independent repair network to emerge is for Tesla to make the manuals and training available. Refusing to do so because there are no trained individuals out there is self-serving of them.

How do you know what is going to be precisely the same and what is not?

While there will be revisions, do you really believe that there will be such a fundamental difference between the battery pack architecture, charging method and drivetrain between the two vehicles that it would prevent an individual from working on both vehicles? The same basic skills will apply.

 

[uberanalyst]

I have to share my recent experience in getting our P85D repaired:

When the car was only 4 months old, we got rear-ended at a stoplight that caused minor damage to the rear bumper. The good news is that the truck that hit me had insurance from Allstate, and the car was still drivable.

When I called Allstate they had me drive our Tesla to a nearby body shop with a dedicated Allstate claims adjuster. It was a waste of time: he told me that he couldn't write up the claim because Tesla doesn't make its parts catalog or pricing available. So he told me to talk to a local Telsa Service Center (yes, I actually live only 10 miles from a Tesla store/service center in Northern Virginia/DC area -- one of the reasons I bought the car).

But Tesla wouldn't work on my car because they don't do "body shop" type repairs. But they did suggest that I call a "Tesla-approved" body shop 2+ hours away to send a flat-bed truck to pick up my Telsa and drive it to their facilities in Richmond, VA!!! (I live in the Washington, DC metro area.) I thought that was crazy and asked if there was anyone closer to the DC area. They then suggested another Tesla-approved body shop in Annapolis, MD, "only" 90 minutes away (non-rush-hour traffic). Finally, I got them to give me contact info for an approved body shop in Gaithersburg, MD, only an hour drive away.

So I was forced to take my car to a body shop in Gaithersburg, MD. But it was still a hassle because I had to drive there multiple times for an estimate, for the parts to be ordered from Tesla, and for Allstate to approve the repair.

This all would have been much easier and smoother (and likely cheaper for the insurance company) if Tesla had made their parts catalog available and I could have used a local body shop for a simple bumper repair. The good news is that the replacement rear bumper paint job is perfect.

 

[tga]

So are ICE cars and EVs, that's the entire point.

Wrong. Propulsion systems aside, ICE's and EV's are identical. If Tesla released parts and repair info, any qualified mechanic (or owner) could repair/replace coolant, brake fluid, CV joints/axles, suspension components, tires, alignments, headlight ballasts, brake pads/rotors, etc, etc, etc.

So for a moment let's exclude the battery and drive unit. Can you get door handles, interior trim, brake pads, brake rotors, wheel bearing, struts, springs, steering racks, tie rods, control arms, door locks, interior trim, various relays, control modules, latches, tail lamps, headlights, exterior trim pieces, etc. from Tesla over the counter as a consumer like, you know, almost every other car?

Yeah, what he said!

 

[JonathanD]

Wrong. Propulsion systems aside

Oh yeah, those little things!

 

[omgwtfbyobbq]

Tesla is following standard procedure for all EV makers. Last I checked, my Leaf's battery can't be served at my local mechanic either.

I'm not sure about the Leaf, but the i has a FSM available, which makes replacement of cells by a 3rd party feasible.

Mitsubishi I-Miev Forum View topic - Single LEV50-cell wanted for our Citroen C-Zero

 

[aus]

This thread has two groups of people.
One group is fixated on the battery and drive units, and the other group is just interested in doing routine maintenance and simple non battery/drive unit repair.
I don't think anyone is interested in bringing the car in for battery/drive unit issue to the corner mechanic but why can't we bring it there for everything else??

I still want to know what Tesla is doing for the $600 annual service???

.

 

[lolachampcar]

Buds at a local shop recently did a Prius battery........

 

[omgwtfbyobbq]

Prius batteries are crazy easy. I've had more trouble replacing rusty halfshafts with triple-square bolts than I did replacing a pair of cells in my old Prius. Shoot, with an inexpensive OBDII bluetooth adapter, a close quarters drill, and a friend to help lift the pack out/drop it back in, it takes 2 hours or less to replace cells if you know your way around a factory service manual.

 

[Whitmarsh]

I know this is trivial but could you please remove the apostrophe from 'it's' in the title of this post? It's incorrect and it hits me in the eye, especially as this is now the title of the thread.

 

[3mp_kwh]

Since economics drive just about everything, evolution with the wider release of the manual may take a long time. Safe to say people who spend >30k on their used car typically aren't into repairing it, themselves.

As a MA resident having seen it, I can say there is very little about propulsion, even if you are granted access. The first level service.teslamotors.com gives you is really about what's been mentioned; suspension, brakes, torques, sunroofs, doors, etc. You need "Toolbox" software, which itself has an instruction set, for wider access. With a laptop, you could theoretically go all the way with factory repair, re-initializing, etc. If Tesla continues to resist granting this access, as it also tries to own as much of their used market as possible, I wouldn't be surprised if the hack to isolate and program each the battery and motor hardware weren't developed first. I think their reluctance could hasten what could be a worse outcome. Cars that might be inferior, but that they lose all control of.

Part of the reason to be in a newer car is not having to worry about carrying this torch. That still doesn't stop me from wanting to re-torque a lowered suspension, or from wishing the new AP V7 graphics would go away. Something gained, something lost.

 

[jaguar36]

Safe to say people who spend >30k on their used car typically aren't into repairing it, themselves.

I seriously disagree with that.

At some point Tesla will open up their manuals and software, or someone else will develop workarounds for it as has happened with every other manufacturer. It may be due to a lawsuit, I'm surprised there hasn't been one from MA yet, as they clearly aren't in compliance with the right to repair law even with the manuals being available there. Their policy of only supplying body parts to certified shops will also clearly come to an end, either because of anti-trust lawsuit, or by being forced to by crazy repair rates and ridiculous wait times.

I just hope that Tesla does the right thing without being forced to.

 

[digitaltim]

Because they can...capitalist, free market.