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Over the past few years, I think if Elon would have skipped tweeting completely and instead did a 1 hour video interview every 2 weeks that was recorded and posted publicly, then Tesla would be in a much better place than it is now in terms of public and investor sentiment.
copyhacker
Member
Just had the thought that Jerome might be the perfect candidate for the much-needed role of Tesla COO aka "Tesla's Gwynne Shotwell".
Does that really matter if they are at 6000/week and looking to get to 8000/week soon? Once they deliver the Q3 it should be pretty damned obvious that they are not gonna go bankrupt anytime soon. Then in late Q4 release of a faster to build, higher margin, better spec Model 3 making 2019 a year of $2B profit even with gigafactories capex.
How could it be better? Tesla is top in customer satifaction -- hard to be better than the best. Teslas are highly desired, with demand continuing to outpace production. This is despite artificially low demand thanks to years of anti-Tesla, and decades of anti-renewable FUD. Tesla's performance on the stock market has handily outpaced the market. The products themselves are years ahead of competition, and the gap appears to be widening. They are dominating their market segments. Not much to complain about. Twitter vs interviews wouldnt have changed much, if anything that matters.
marvinat0rz
Member
DaveT is talking about sentiment, not the concrete financial position the company is currently in, which is indeed very promising. It's not too far out there to say that Tesla and Musk gets plenty of undeserved bad PR, and a certain amount of bad PR which is deserved. It stands to reason that this could have been better countered with more in-depth commentary than the soundbites that Twitter allows. I hadn't thought about this in the terms how how Tesla/Musk have managed their public commentary before, but it makes sense. In retrospect, it seems obvious that plenty of things could have been done better. Skipping the pedo comment, to give one example. (Not that it was unprovoked, but it's a completely unnecessary distraction that doesn't exactly boost sentiment).
Let's say it was a video interview instead, where someone asked "This guy said you should stick the submarine up your butt. What are your thoughts about that?" and the response was "I really wish people wouldn't feel so provoked and attack us when we were spending tens of thousands of dollars preparing custom equipment for an eventuality which would have saved lives if it occurred."
It's quite painful to see the bashing that Tesla and Musk receives in the media. They've unfortunately provided plenty of material for plausible-sounding lies and excessively negative speculation. I am also of the mind that there is a concerted disinformation and negative publicity campaign going on, but you have to be more than a casual observer to dig beneath the plausible-sounding skepticism. This is not the kind of free publicity that is valuable to Tesla, unfortunately.
Let's say it was a video interview instead, where someone asked "This guy said you should stick the submarine up your butt. What are your thoughts about that?" and the response was "I really wish people wouldn't feel so provoked and attack us when we were spending tens of thousands of dollars preparing custom equipment for an eventuality which would have saved lives if it occurred."
It's quite painful to see the bashing that Tesla and Musk receives in the media. They've unfortunately provided plenty of material for plausible-sounding lies and excessively negative speculation. I am also of the mind that there is a concerted disinformation and negative publicity campaign going on, but you have to be more than a casual observer to dig beneath the plausible-sounding skepticism. This is not the kind of free publicity that is valuable to Tesla, unfortunately.
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Great idea and Jerome is probably my 'favorite' Tesla employee...But, he already needed one leave of absence a couple years ago. being EM's COO might just push him over the edge.
Exactly. It's difficult to hate Elon after an in-depth video interview. Elon comes across sincere, thoughtful, and with good intentions. However, on Twitter much of the nuance is lost and at times he comes across like someone who is tweeting impulsively. His arguments and resulting insults he has tweeted are especially divisive.
This NY Times article is a disgrace (Elon Musk Confronts a Fateful Tweet and an ‘Excruciating’ Year). Elon takes valuable time out of his schedule to give an interview, and they portray him as unstable, on drugs, and obsessed with shorts.
Now if this interview was actually video recorded and posted online for everyone to see, I can bet that a different story would be told. Elon would come across as thoughtful, sincere, and more stable.
I don’t understand why Elon keeps giving interviews like this without requiring that these interviews be video recorded and posted online for free.
Elon has the leverage with these videos. He can determine the location, the time, the length, etc of the interview. However, the reporter has full say over the actual article. So, Elon needs to REQUIRE that any interview he gives, the interviewer must video record the ENTIRE video and post it online for free. This way, it will honor Elon’s actual words, tone, context and intent.
So much of Elon’s interviews are put to waste like this NY Times article with reporters taking quotes out of context and adding FUD into the article. It’s truly terrible.
However, reporters are just humans that are easily influenced by others (ie., FUD and negative propaganda) and it’s rare to find those who are truly objective. But I don’t think it’s a good idea for Elon to stop giving interviews. I think he needs to choose reporters that are more objective, or he can just do interviews with his favorite reporter or person… kind of like how Warren Buffett has his favorite few people who interview him. But in whatever case, Elon should require that all interviews be video recorded and posted online for free.
Now if this interview was actually video recorded and posted online for everyone to see, I can bet that a different story would be told. Elon would come across as thoughtful, sincere, and more stable.
I don’t understand why Elon keeps giving interviews like this without requiring that these interviews be video recorded and posted online for free.
Elon has the leverage with these videos. He can determine the location, the time, the length, etc of the interview. However, the reporter has full say over the actual article. So, Elon needs to REQUIRE that any interview he gives, the interviewer must video record the ENTIRE video and post it online for free. This way, it will honor Elon’s actual words, tone, context and intent.
So much of Elon’s interviews are put to waste like this NY Times article with reporters taking quotes out of context and adding FUD into the article. It’s truly terrible.
However, reporters are just humans that are easily influenced by others (ie., FUD and negative propaganda) and it’s rare to find those who are truly objective. But I don’t think it’s a good idea for Elon to stop giving interviews. I think he needs to choose reporters that are more objective, or he can just do interviews with his favorite reporter or person… kind of like how Warren Buffett has his favorite few people who interview him. But in whatever case, Elon should require that all interviews be video recorded and posted online for free.
On the topic of Tesla needing a COO.
Elon is an amazing visionary. He’s an amazing decision-maker, who tries to see things objectively and is not afraid to take risks when warranted. He’s probably an amazing engineer, when he has the time to dig into things.
However, Elon is probably subpar with operations. Operations requires keeping a handle on a hundred moving parts, and keeping in constant contact with dozens of teams and processes. This is definitely an area Elon needs to find a world class talent in and empower that person to do their job.
Also, I think Elon is subpar in keeping track of all the details that are required in an intense process like budding a new car. The Model X suffered from a delay due to them having to redesign the falcon wing doors and associated parts of the car. And the Model 3 suffered from a delay from various production processes not being ready. These kind of problems can often be solved if processes and parts are tested far in advance, and there is a top executive in charge of the whole process and who takes vigorous control of the whole thing. In Tesla’s case, Elon probably controls too much of the operations with too many people directly reporting to him. He and Tesla would be better served by having a COO who can rigorously develop, test and keep accountable the hundreds of processes involved. Also, currently many crises directly go to Elon… but I think that just burns Elon out. 95% of those crises can go to a COO, and Elon can handle the remaining 5%.
Anyway, I’ve been saying Tesla needs a COO for years, and I hope they find a great one.
Elon is an amazing visionary. He’s an amazing decision-maker, who tries to see things objectively and is not afraid to take risks when warranted. He’s probably an amazing engineer, when he has the time to dig into things.
However, Elon is probably subpar with operations. Operations requires keeping a handle on a hundred moving parts, and keeping in constant contact with dozens of teams and processes. This is definitely an area Elon needs to find a world class talent in and empower that person to do their job.
Also, I think Elon is subpar in keeping track of all the details that are required in an intense process like budding a new car. The Model X suffered from a delay due to them having to redesign the falcon wing doors and associated parts of the car. And the Model 3 suffered from a delay from various production processes not being ready. These kind of problems can often be solved if processes and parts are tested far in advance, and there is a top executive in charge of the whole process and who takes vigorous control of the whole thing. In Tesla’s case, Elon probably controls too much of the operations with too many people directly reporting to him. He and Tesla would be better served by having a COO who can rigorously develop, test and keep accountable the hundreds of processes involved. Also, currently many crises directly go to Elon… but I think that just burns Elon out. 95% of those crises can go to a COO, and Elon can handle the remaining 5%.
Anyway, I’ve been saying Tesla needs a COO for years, and I hope they find a great one.
Customer satisfaction and demand reflect sentiment for most of the people that matter -- customers and those about to be customers.
Amazing cutting edge products reflect sentiment of those who work or want to work at Tesla. Leadership, engineers and designers -- they join to Tesla to do their best work and contribute to an important and inspiring mission.
Stock performance has been excellent, which reflects sentiment of investors.
Wishing he did interviews these past 2 years doesnt change these things at all. All evidence indicates this is how Elon is going to continue to behave, barring a complete breakdown from chronic lack of sleep. I see no point in complaining about what could have been, especially when the actual performance of the company has been strong.
It almost sounds like you're complaining about the smear campaign against Elon/Tesla as if it is his doing. The type of "negative sentiment" present mostly on Twitter and the financial news seems to be conjured soley to detract from the the positive sentiment of those that matter, as listed above, and to get under Elon's skin. Interviews will just be twisted, same as the tweets. That is the nature of a smear campaign. Even if the whole, unedited video is posted, there will still be articles and headlines twisting his words. No one but fans will watch the 1hr long interview, and regular people who need to watch it will just catch headlines.
Style of defense (tweets vs interview) doesnt matter much in a smear campaign. That is why Elon wants to go private; it mostly eliminates that attack vector.
Amazing cutting edge products reflect sentiment of those who work or want to work at Tesla. Leadership, engineers and designers -- they join to Tesla to do their best work and contribute to an important and inspiring mission.
Stock performance has been excellent, which reflects sentiment of investors.
Wishing he did interviews these past 2 years doesnt change these things at all. All evidence indicates this is how Elon is going to continue to behave, barring a complete breakdown from chronic lack of sleep. I see no point in complaining about what could have been, especially when the actual performance of the company has been strong.
It almost sounds like you're complaining about the smear campaign against Elon/Tesla as if it is his doing. The type of "negative sentiment" present mostly on Twitter and the financial news seems to be conjured soley to detract from the the positive sentiment of those that matter, as listed above, and to get under Elon's skin. Interviews will just be twisted, same as the tweets. That is the nature of a smear campaign. Even if the whole, unedited video is posted, there will still be articles and headlines twisting his words. No one but fans will watch the 1hr long interview, and regular people who need to watch it will just catch headlines.
Style of defense (tweets vs interview) doesnt matter much in a smear campaign. That is why Elon wants to go private; it mostly eliminates that attack vector.
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Zhelko Dimic
Careful bull
I think he'd benefit from COO, or CEO.
I can see Sheryl Sandberg being an amazing CEO, with bias towards operations, rather than vision. And he may have to surrender that title in order to get best of the best. I think it would be hard recruiting type A as a COO, as she knows it would be too hard working for Elon from that position.
I disagree on almost everything you wrote here but don’t have time at the moment to write in detail. But regarding stock performance, it’s been pitiful over the past 4 years. Just take exactly 4 years ago until now and you’ll see what I’m talking about.
A critical post at this point would be a pile-on. So I am hesitat the do this but still doing it because I think it's relavent and timely.
The fundamental reason I invested multiple years in a row, no less "all in", was because I was hugely impressed with Elon back in 2013/14. I watched every single video interview out there and continued to watch on an ongoing basis - like you said like church goers listening to sermons. Musk always felt quite genuine, truthful and sincere... As a fellow engineer, really appreciated the engineering-centric logic-driven way he would express things.
However, over time that has fundamentally changed somehow. Change in the medium is just coincidence in my view... He went remarkably hyperbolic over time, border on outright lying. If you step back and see, since the S's success, everything Musk proclaimed has been a total load of bullshit. Where do I ever start or what do I list? Remember all these - X "sculpted" 2nd row seats (which literally no one praised once released), the pace and magnitude of success of Storage, remember that announcement to "end the range anxiety forever"? That maps update turned out to be a total disaster, synergies with SCTY merger, Model-3 timeline, FSD claims, countless other things or pretty much anything and everything Musk proclaimed... all turned out to be hyperbolic bullshit.
With Semi announcement, Chanos said that Musk has "crossed the rubicon" (meaning went beyond point of no return) because he is saying things which he knows he can't achieve - that's just a nice way of saying Musk is lying. He is indeed right about the Semi timeline and is countinuing to be right about Musk's character... Why do you think SEC is investigating M3 timeline? Were they honest misses or did Musk clearly know that the timelines were not possible but was still dishing them out, and no less raised 1.8Bil debt on the back of it?
The tweets "funding secured" and "Only reason why this is not certain is that it’s contingent on a shareholder vote" have put to light that Musk is indeed restorting to outright lies... He did not have Saudi support to take up "every and all" shares that would be turned in. Where is the Saudi statement? We see that Musk is infact shopping for buyers of the deal... There are no two explanations to this. He lied.
Now the NYT article published last night, and more importantly the update with the new paragraph, shows in broad day light that Musk has become a pathological liar... Snippets here:
**
Mr. Musk said in the interview that board members had not complained to him about his tweet. “I don’t recall getting any communications from the board at all,” he said. “I definitely did not get calls from irate directors.”
But shortly after the Times published its interview with Mr. Musk, he added through a Tesla spokeswoman that Antonio Gracias, Tesla’s lead independent director, had indeed contacted him to discuss the Aug. 7 Twitter post, and that he had agreed not to tweet again about the possible privatization deal unless he had discussed it with the board.
**
The second paragraph was addition in the morning update. This should seal the deal for anyone who is not certain that Musk lies.
So if folks are still pinning up hopes on TSLA, based on Musk's claims that Tesla is entering a phase of perpetual profits or cashflows. .. Good luck with that... Note that top-5 markets of Tesla are all having or just had tax rebate/subsidy issues...
but more importantly can anyone really trust ANYTHING musk says? My answer is no.
The fundamental reason I invested multiple years in a row, no less "all in", was because I was hugely impressed with Elon back in 2013/14. I watched every single video interview out there and continued to watch on an ongoing basis - like you said like church goers listening to sermons. Musk always felt quite genuine, truthful and sincere... As a fellow engineer, really appreciated the engineering-centric logic-driven way he would express things.
However, over time that has fundamentally changed somehow. Change in the medium is just coincidence in my view... He went remarkably hyperbolic over time, border on outright lying. If you step back and see, since the S's success, everything Musk proclaimed has been a total load of bullshit. Where do I ever start or what do I list? Remember all these - X "sculpted" 2nd row seats (which literally no one praised once released), the pace and magnitude of success of Storage, remember that announcement to "end the range anxiety forever"? That maps update turned out to be a total disaster, synergies with SCTY merger, Model-3 timeline, FSD claims, countless other things or pretty much anything and everything Musk proclaimed... all turned out to be hyperbolic bullshit.
With Semi announcement, Chanos said that Musk has "crossed the rubicon" (meaning went beyond point of no return) because he is saying things which he knows he can't achieve - that's just a nice way of saying Musk is lying. He is indeed right about the Semi timeline and is countinuing to be right about Musk's character... Why do you think SEC is investigating M3 timeline? Were they honest misses or did Musk clearly know that the timelines were not possible but was still dishing them out, and no less raised 1.8Bil debt on the back of it?
The tweets "funding secured" and "Only reason why this is not certain is that it’s contingent on a shareholder vote" have put to light that Musk is indeed restorting to outright lies... He did not have Saudi support to take up "every and all" shares that would be turned in. Where is the Saudi statement? We see that Musk is infact shopping for buyers of the deal... There are no two explanations to this. He lied.
Now the NYT article published last night, and more importantly the update with the new paragraph, shows in broad day light that Musk has become a pathological liar... Snippets here:
**
Mr. Musk said in the interview that board members had not complained to him about his tweet. “I don’t recall getting any communications from the board at all,” he said. “I definitely did not get calls from irate directors.”
But shortly after the Times published its interview with Mr. Musk, he added through a Tesla spokeswoman that Antonio Gracias, Tesla’s lead independent director, had indeed contacted him to discuss the Aug. 7 Twitter post, and that he had agreed not to tweet again about the possible privatization deal unless he had discussed it with the board.
**
The second paragraph was addition in the morning update. This should seal the deal for anyone who is not certain that Musk lies.
So if folks are still pinning up hopes on TSLA, based on Musk's claims that Tesla is entering a phase of perpetual profits or cashflows. .. Good luck with that... Note that top-5 markets of Tesla are all having or just had tax rebate/subsidy issues...
but more importantly can anyone really trust ANYTHING musk says? My answer is no.
Ouch. Harsh words. But appreciate them nonetheless. I still like the car too much to let go this easily.
BozieBeMe2
May I have this dance?
Please read this ONE bit of information and then ask yourself. Why are the shorters resorting to all of this??
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Bozie, I don't understand why people have to attack others personally (I feel sorry for you IS a personal attack). If you have anything you disagree with SBenson on, counter the points.
That said, as a collective, we all need to circle the wagons and not post the negatives. We'll be out of the crisis soon enough, it does no good to pile on.
Also, SBenson, while I certainly feel your points, Elon's problem is not so much that he is a liar but rather he exaggerates. 5K M3 did come, just 9 months after what he claimed. Everything else will come as well (including even the buyout). I suggest that we all pause the attacks, unite as a group, but don't forget to come back and have these productive discussions later.
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