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AU Pricing
- Thread starter Marec
- Start date
EcoCloudIT
Active Member
i really hope you're right...
Here's my calculations: NSW model 3 calculator
Lands a fully optioned max spec at about $130k in NSW.
Shock-On-T
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Hmm, you can now get the standard range Model S for $135K in NSW.
I doubt $130k would be a competitive price point for the P3D, but I'm going by gut (which is surprisingly accurate!).
Thats because they were trying to upsell everyone to a model s rather than wait.....the same staff who assured me as a ‘new customer’ that I can click a button on my model s and the car would put the garage door up, drive out to the street, and wait for me there to come out and jump in. They assured me this was absolutely currently available. It was early last year.
Not here, because it’s an Excel spreasheet on my computer at home
However, I have referred to it in the past in a post to this thread... Tesla Model 3 in Australia
I too have gotten used to planning around the time taken for DC charging. I generally don't mind it, but I'm very conscious of what has happened in the US as more and more Teslas hit the road. It's all very well to anticipate having a decent lunch while the car takes a charge, but if you turn up and all bays are full then a 1 hour stop can easily turn into 2.
Faster charging gives you more options, such as being able to have a quick coffee or some junk food rather than an hour in a restaurant. More options are always better.
We only have to wait til tomorrow to find out what Supercharger V3 has in store. In general anything that can speed up the charging process is welcome in my book (whether it be 800V over 400V, or less tapering as the battery fills up). It's all about options and hopefully minimising the chance of unexpected delays.
Shock-On-T
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Faster is always better, I won't disagree with that
Generally the time I'm really waiting is when on a road trip, and those SCs usually have plenty of spaces free.
The taper is what hurts me the most. With a 75 battery I need to get up to 90% often, and nowadays my battery starts tapering from about 48% onwards.
360C
Member
You guys seem awfuly calm about the butt reaming that Tesla has just handed existing owners again with this latest, and largest price drop. I'm an early adopter having first bought a P85D Model S 4 years ago and later fitting it with Ludicrous for $$$. I am currently running my 2nd (P100D Model S) and my 3rd Tesla (P100D Model X) as the family daily drivers. We have been totally Tesla EV's for 3 years now with no back up ICE vehicle for family duties.
My Model X P100D was ordered early and was in the 1st shipment to arrive. Every option ticked and it was $320k OTR in Victoria. Today the same car in as close to the same spec as you can now get is $213,259 OTR, A Price PLUNGE of $106,741. From my readings of the thread above I'm not sure you are across the point that Tesla have handed you an instant depreciation of (in my case) $106,741 before you experience the expected depreciation you get with any used vehicle. Lets not forget that Tesla has a habit of offering new "inventory vehicles" and near new "Demo vehicles" at huge discounts off new recommended retail prices. This practice will continue as Tesla needs to shift metal and get those production numbers up and the price point down to where more and more buyers can afford them.
I suspect my fully loaded 2 and a bit year old Model X P100D with 40,000km's probably now has a wholesale value of something in the order of $125,000 given the above price cutting plus normal vehicle depreciation. That's a loss of $195,000 in 2 years and 40,000km's.
I've owned a few very expensive exotic and luxury road cars in my time and this is the biggest depreciation tear up of any of them by far.
Now my Model S P100D was listed as $290k OTR brand new in Victoria when it was purchased circa 18 months ago. The current price of a new car optioned to as close as possible to the same Specification is $192,740 OTR in Victoria. An instant depreciation courtesy of Tesla of $97,260 before the expected depreciation of a used vehicle. Now fortunately I bought this one as a used demo; but it still cost some $30,000 more than the price now for a brand new vehicle. It now has about 20,000km's on it and I reckon it has a true wholeslae value of the same $125,000 of my Model X. So I am looking at a loss of $97,740 on the Model S in 18 months and 20,000km's.
So in just the two P100D's that I currently run the depreciation is a massive $292,740 on fully loaded cars that are between 18mths to 2 years old with average km's. Throw in the loss on my P85D which was largely the expected used car depreciation of circa $90,000 including the extra cost ludicrous conversion and the total Tesla fleet depreciation over 3 cars is $382,740. Remembering that the lions share of
that is directly due to price drops and massive price discounting on inventory and demo vehicles that destroy resale values for existing owners.
Now this situation isn't without precedent in other manufacturers; but they normally compensate existing owners in some fashion. For example, a few years back McLaren introduced the MP4-12C. After 18mths on the market they dropped the new car price by $100,000; but they compensated existing owners by offering them that price discount on trading the existing car in for a new McLaren. A pretty fair arrangement that keeps customers loyal and avoids reputational damage to the brand.
Tesla OTOH do absolutely nothing and I am very surprised how blasé you guys are about it.
I absolutely love the Tesla product and am a big believer; but I have a Model 3 on order which I will now be cancelling. I was also planning on buying the Roadster 2 when it eventually arrives. That won't be happening now either.
For those of you that heavily finance your cars, you are now heavily underwater as the residual finance value will almost certainly massively exceed the market value of your car. Something to consider perhaps?
My Model X P100D was ordered early and was in the 1st shipment to arrive. Every option ticked and it was $320k OTR in Victoria. Today the same car in as close to the same spec as you can now get is $213,259 OTR, A Price PLUNGE of $106,741. From my readings of the thread above I'm not sure you are across the point that Tesla have handed you an instant depreciation of (in my case) $106,741 before you experience the expected depreciation you get with any used vehicle. Lets not forget that Tesla has a habit of offering new "inventory vehicles" and near new "Demo vehicles" at huge discounts off new recommended retail prices. This practice will continue as Tesla needs to shift metal and get those production numbers up and the price point down to where more and more buyers can afford them.
I suspect my fully loaded 2 and a bit year old Model X P100D with 40,000km's probably now has a wholesale value of something in the order of $125,000 given the above price cutting plus normal vehicle depreciation. That's a loss of $195,000 in 2 years and 40,000km's.
I've owned a few very expensive exotic and luxury road cars in my time and this is the biggest depreciation tear up of any of them by far.
Now my Model S P100D was listed as $290k OTR brand new in Victoria when it was purchased circa 18 months ago. The current price of a new car optioned to as close as possible to the same Specification is $192,740 OTR in Victoria. An instant depreciation courtesy of Tesla of $97,260 before the expected depreciation of a used vehicle. Now fortunately I bought this one as a used demo; but it still cost some $30,000 more than the price now for a brand new vehicle. It now has about 20,000km's on it and I reckon it has a true wholeslae value of the same $125,000 of my Model X. So I am looking at a loss of $97,740 on the Model S in 18 months and 20,000km's.
So in just the two P100D's that I currently run the depreciation is a massive $292,740 on fully loaded cars that are between 18mths to 2 years old with average km's. Throw in the loss on my P85D which was largely the expected used car depreciation of circa $90,000 including the extra cost ludicrous conversion and the total Tesla fleet depreciation over 3 cars is $382,740. Remembering that the lions share of
that is directly due to price drops and massive price discounting on inventory and demo vehicles that destroy resale values for existing owners.
Now this situation isn't without precedent in other manufacturers; but they normally compensate existing owners in some fashion. For example, a few years back McLaren introduced the MP4-12C. After 18mths on the market they dropped the new car price by $100,000; but they compensated existing owners by offering them that price discount on trading the existing car in for a new McLaren. A pretty fair arrangement that keeps customers loyal and avoids reputational damage to the brand.
Tesla OTOH do absolutely nothing and I am very surprised how blasé you guys are about it.
I absolutely love the Tesla product and am a big believer; but I have a Model 3 on order which I will now be cancelling. I was also planning on buying the Roadster 2 when it eventually arrives. That won't be happening now either.
For those of you that heavily finance your cars, you are now heavily underwater as the residual finance value will almost certainly massively exceed the market value of your car. Something to consider perhaps?
Sure it sucks but the same thing could have happened if Tesla held the USD price and the AUD went back up from 70 cents to a dollar.
At the end of the day you've gotten to drive two of the fastest production cars ever made. The cars are still as good today as they were last week.
I think it's a shame to go off Tesla completely simply because they've made their cars more accessible. Where else are you going to get Roadster performance for the price?
At the end of the day you've gotten to drive two of the fastest production cars ever made. The cars are still as good today as they were last week.
I think it's a shame to go off Tesla completely simply because they've made their cars more accessible. Where else are you going to get Roadster performance for the price?
I'm in the same boat as you (also Model S P85DL), but I look at it this way:
I've had the absolute pleasure of driving an extraordinary vehicle for 4 years which I paid $200K for. The grin remains ear-to-ear every time I drive it.
A Model S P100DL was more than $300,000 last time I looked, making the "wife acceptance factor" for the trade-up an insurmountable hurdle.
Now that a brand new one is $170,000....soooo tempting.
As for the depreciation - we bought a computer on wheels. That $1,000 graphics card you bought 4 years ago - you're lucky if you get $50 for it now. Now THAT's depreciation.
nigwil
P3D-
price volatility seems to be a feature of disruptive car manufacturers, checkout the Ford Model T (1909 - 1927):
Ford Model T - Wikipedia
Spare a thought for the people who won and lost on that pricing rollercoaster; even though the pricing swings must have been visible to buyers at the time Ford went on to sell 14 million Model T. I expect the excitement of being part of a profound revolution in personal transport softened the anguish somewhat.
Ford Model T - Wikipedia
Spare a thought for the people who won and lost on that pricing rollercoaster; even though the pricing swings must have been visible to buyers at the time Ford went on to sell 14 million Model T. I expect the excitement of being part of a profound revolution in personal transport softened the anguish somewhat.
To be fair, the price on non ‘P’ models has minimally dropped. Making a tesla go from 0-100 in 1.2 seconds less time is something that has minimal cost to tesla, so charging $100k (a lot of that is tax) more for it was never a good value proposition for owners. Indeed I’ve never understood why someone would pay that much for the thrill of showing off to a few friends for something that was clearly never going to depreciate well, as it was mostly tax.
360C...I hear you and I don't disagree. I bought a model S 100D back in August for $191k...same car now is $151k (almost...no free supercharging or lifetime connectivity), so that's a drop of $40k on the new car price in only 6 months. I don't have any regrets in buying as I love the car, but when I saw the price decrease on the weekend I had to do a double take. I seriously thought they had made a mistake on the website. I do admit though it has reduced my goodwill towards Tesla (and I'm also a PW2 owner and Tesla shareholder)
No that's incorrect. See my post above - $191k to $151k with same options in 6 months
EcoCloudIT
Active Member
I was told my late 2015 Gen 2 Model S would also open the garage door, drive out and wait for me when I bought my car all the way back in late 2015...that turned out total BS and will never happen for a AP1 car (not to mention it doesn't even have the hardware to do HomeLink installed!).....
@360C I'm quite torn on this but I think I'm leaning more towards your camp. Paid $274k for my P100D outright (thank god I didn't finance...) and almost exactly one year later the same car (albeit no longer available in Obsidian Black/Cream Interior) is $178k, a near $100k drop.
On the one hand, there's the argument that the buyer pays $X at time of purchase and thus the buyer explicitly accepts the price as being sufficiently reasonable such that they splashed the cash and bought the car.
On the other hand, there's no waving away that primal knee-jerk reaction to a 100k price drop in just one year. I can only imagine how much more annoyed I would be if I bought the same car just two weeks ago. I would almost definitely return it and ask for a difference (not sure how successful that'd be). There is also the fact that new buyers buy the same car for much cheaper, which makes me feel like I've stretched (almost unecessarily) much further.
If I had driven my tesla for 4+ years, I probably wouldn't mind the 25k/year annualised depreciation (though that's still obviously an outlier).
In saying all this, I'll probably still get a Roadster depending on the price. As per my first point - if I think it's a price worth paying (just like how you bought two P-models at previous prices and must've concluded it'd be worth it then) then I'll still splash down.
On the one hand, there's the argument that the buyer pays $X at time of purchase and thus the buyer explicitly accepts the price as being sufficiently reasonable such that they splashed the cash and bought the car.
On the other hand, there's no waving away that primal knee-jerk reaction to a 100k price drop in just one year. I can only imagine how much more annoyed I would be if I bought the same car just two weeks ago. I would almost definitely return it and ask for a difference (not sure how successful that'd be). There is also the fact that new buyers buy the same car for much cheaper, which makes me feel like I've stretched (almost unecessarily) much further.
If I had driven my tesla for 4+ years, I probably wouldn't mind the 25k/year annualised depreciation (though that's still obviously an outlier).
In saying all this, I'll probably still get a Roadster depending on the price. As per my first point - if I think it's a price worth paying (just like how you bought two P-models at previous prices and must've concluded it'd be worth it then) then I'll still splash down.
Not going to make anyone feel better I'll grant, but from the outside looking in (to the P market anyway) it just seems that the P-models were overpriced, and they weren't selling enough of them. Considering the difference is a bit bigger motor and that's about it.
Shock-On-T
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I'm in a similar boat.
I wanted to trade up to a P100D for next car, but it was going to be too hard to get it past the financial controller.
Now I will probably go for the $170K performance car.
