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Auto Express Top 29 New Car Makers
- Thread starter up_north
- Start date
You’re right about people saying a survey is rubbish if Tesla aren’t top, and bang on the money if they are.
Even people taking the survey seem to contradict themselves, great for running costs but low for value? To me they’re two sides of the same coin, all part of ownership costs.
Overall though, it sounds reasonable to me, the only thing I’d like someone to do a better look at is safety. Tesla get often get praised but I do wonder if they’re as good as they make out (that’s not saying they’re bad, just are they the best). Take simple things like blind spot monitoring, there’s better system out there,
Even people taking the survey seem to contradict themselves, great for running costs but low for value? To me they’re two sides of the same coin, all part of ownership costs.
Overall though, it sounds reasonable to me, the only thing I’d like someone to do a better look at is safety. Tesla get often get praised but I do wonder if they’re as good as they make out (that’s not saying they’re bad, just are they the best). Take simple things like blind spot monitoring, there’s better system out there,
That's actually a good example: it's nice to have blind spot camera on the Tesla, put it at the very top but the only other implementation I can think of: Hyundai/Kia is implemented far far better. I actually am so frustrated with Tesla. As far as ideas and innovation go there probably at the top of the automotive food chain. Implementing these? Not so good
I doubt it. There are sensors all around the car like every other car. I have gotten audible warnings even when the cars were not visible in the mirror or the mini popup view. If you were referring to the position of the popup sure a customisable option would be nice.
Tesla, by aspiring for top safety, has more false positives than other cars so I doubt if Tesla misses any.
I can only compare to our BMW, the blind spot warning uses radars in the rear bumpers to see further back and alert you on the proximity. It was mentioned on a different thread, the BMW is much better at telling you so you don't try changing lane with somebody in your blind spot, whereas the Tesla system tries to save you when you do. It also has cross collision warnings to tell you if you're about to pull out or reverse out of a spot and something is coming, thats saved me once.
Zilla91
Active Member
Blind spot monitoring, cross collision warning, 360 parking camera, HUD, infotainment system, windscreen wipers, headlights, cruise control… all things Tesla don’t have or implement badly yet somehow the same line about them being the most technologically advanced cars keeps getting thrown about by the motoring press
agreed with this. Yes the technology for the battery/design/range etc is great, but the small things are massively outdated or just crap. Having headlights/windscreen wipers not working properly this day and age is pathetically bad.
Infotainment I prefer, 360 parking how can that not be implemented with cameras all around?? Blind Spot too.
Its like they can't be arsed.
Technologically advanced doesn't mean a kitchen sink of features. I encounter this all the time at work too. If you believe the German cars are more technologically advanced than a Tesla then it means you do not understand technology.
I had personally turned off blind-spot monitoring on my X5 since it was over reporting and distracting me. I dont feel any less safe with a Tesla so dont understand how any of these features that are missing such as hud etc compromise safety.
This is such an interesting topic to me. And it makes me think back to how i-drive was always (and still is, outside of Tesla) the best infotainment / vehicle interface hands down. Hardware and software. It was just dialled, and made every other car I ever got in feel 10 years behind the curve.
But it's all about implementation IMO. None of these are new ideas, but their utility benefit is so easily negated by poor implementation (reliability, UI, how you activate and interact with the various features). Maybe I'm just a UI and design snob, but... the kia's and vw's competing with Tesla mostly aim to tick the boxes in order to compete with Tesla on paper, but often in reality just fall far short for me. They are so far behind the curve and even ignore basic accessibility and UI best practices to make things look "shiny" which reeks of layers of out-of-touch middle management misunderstanding (and both not giving a toss about customers feedback) and it makes them absolutely frustrating to use.
I think this all ties in with the Tesla offering and how it's both "stripped back" but also "forward looking". IMO, It's the hardcore interpretation of various methodologies that are rooted in software principles, (by which the company seems to operate) which means that Tesla have gained credit for re-thinking how and when these things should be done if at all.
Obviously, some of the Tesla 'special sauce' is PR show and gimmickry, (which luckily for them given how sloth-like legacy auto have been for the last 50 years just works because it's fun and shareable) but at the root, what they've done is take all the best ideas, take all the brightest and best from the industry and packaged them together well. Just like the original iPhone.
I think the iPhone vs Samsung analogy applies to here really well.
NB - This is ignoring all the tech that isn't 'visible' to the driver too, most of which Tesla are undeniably leading currently even if some brands are catching up (Porsche).
No excuse for them. They're just not finished and need more time.
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I feel like the fact it has a minimalist interior and a big iPad on the dash is the extent of the critical thinking that is applied.
As you say, when you scratch below the surface, the missing or poorly performing features for a car at this price point is frankly embarassing and irritating as an owner.
All of my colleagues are convinced that my car drives itself around, so I can well believe non-owners just take it as read that Tesla - the uber tech company - would have all of the convenience stuff they're used to, and then some.
None of this stuff is really life or death, but taken as a whole it's pretty shocking. What innovations have there been in the past few years that you can put your finger on? Removing passenger lumbar support? Matrix headlights that don't do anything besides project "TESLA" when the car is parked? Boombox fart noises? Meanwhile the competition is leaping forwards with each generation. Once they get the battery efficiency nailed, i can't see an obvious reason to stick with Tesla. They are not Apple, who at least have a build quality and features/ecosystem to match their price.
absolutely agree with this. Once you dig deeper and people realise what they are like, they aren't magic cars that are amazing. yeah it has some fun features and imo drives great and looks pretty cool. But in the end, its a car and for what you get is reasonably priced when comparing to other EV's with the same features. Like you say, once alternatives nail the battery/efficiency, Tesla are going to have a massive shock.
The only reason I went with Tesla was because of the network and the drive, other than that all other alternatives ticked most of the boxes.
I think that's harsh mate
.I don't completely disagree with you @Durzel, but no one was doing OTA updates with any regularity or success until Tesla popularised it. Now other brands won't shut up about it and for Tesla it's just business as usual...
- Dealership model was never questioned before Tesla
- OTA updates - "what? we improve your car for you, for free, with no inconvenience? HAHAHAH"
- Acceleration boost - software add ons? When did that happen before Tesla
- Vehicle apps - Tesla popularised this too - they forced everyones hand on this - legacy arel still cobbling stuff together to tick boxes by comparison
- I love the build quality on our Y, and the eco system is why I bought a Tesla in the first place. Any notion of legacy manufacturers having an 'eco system' is a figment of marketing imagination currently
- I think there's more
Is it possible some of us are just past the honeymoon stage? It's easy to rag on the one that stands out from the crowd. I think that's highly possible.
Yeah, Tesla accelerated the perception of cars as being basically treated more like smart phones or laptops. The dealership model is definitely something that has proven to be effective, as has the mobile service option, but it not without its issues either.
I would perhaps argue that as cars became more and more internet connected OTA updates would have been a natural progression.
In the respects you've mentioned I'm glad that Tesla has dragged the rest of the industry along. For me though it feels at this point that Tesla are mostly treading water, endlessly obsessed with end of quarter sales figures, whilst their competitors are rapidly accelerating their EV platforms, with the benefit of already knowing customer expectations.
I could reasonably see an outcome where Tesla become less and less of a halo brand and more a historical byword of the company that transformed perceptions and uptake of EVs. That is arguably what their mission statement has been all along, so wouldn't be a "bad thing".
I do think it's a shame though, because the stuff that irks me about the car could be fixed easily. There's no reason the car shouldn't have a $5 Bosch rain sensor that would make the wipers work perfectly, or some development effort put towards the car identifying distant rear lights or oncoming ones more efficiently, making the auto headlights stuff work better. Tesla do not seem remotely interested in either of these problem domains, though, since I can't put my finger on any improvements to either in all of the time I've owned the car (some people claim random updates have "fixed" these problems, but it is invariably unscientific testing).
I would perhaps argue that as cars became more and more internet connected OTA updates would have been a natural progression.
In the respects you've mentioned I'm glad that Tesla has dragged the rest of the industry along. For me though it feels at this point that Tesla are mostly treading water, endlessly obsessed with end of quarter sales figures, whilst their competitors are rapidly accelerating their EV platforms, with the benefit of already knowing customer expectations.
I could reasonably see an outcome where Tesla become less and less of a halo brand and more a historical byword of the company that transformed perceptions and uptake of EVs. That is arguably what their mission statement has been all along, so wouldn't be a "bad thing".
I do think it's a shame though, because the stuff that irks me about the car could be fixed easily. There's no reason the car shouldn't have a $5 Bosch rain sensor that would make the wipers work perfectly, or some development effort put towards the car identifying distant rear lights or oncoming ones more efficiently, making the auto headlights stuff work better. Tesla do not seem remotely interested in either of these problem domains, though, since I can't put my finger on any improvements to either in all of the time I've owned the car (some people claim random updates have "fixed" these problems, but it is invariably unscientific testing).
Zilla91
Active Member
In my opinion even the Tesla UI/UX isn’t that great once you get into it.
I’m not even talking about the changes for v11 but just the basic premise of having big target areas for your finger to touch when trying to interact with the screen.
Trying to go from my radio favourites to the list of stations while on the move is a challenge because you’re trying to tap an area that’s tiny do you end up hitting the wrong thing 9 times out of 10
Another really poor bit of UI/UX is the stuff that’s just hidden behind another screen. For example dipping the wing mirrors when reversing, you can only set that inside of the settings modal but there are times where I want the mirrors dipped and times where I don’t but I can’t quickly change that without having to go through those screens to get to that setting which is not ideas if you’re in a car park and people are queuing behind you…
If you want to see a whistle stop tour through the tech difference and what the competition are doing now, then take a look at this
The summary is on the money - basically Tesla tech is geared around entertainment when stationary, the competition is geared towards driving the car.
The summary is on the money - basically Tesla tech is geared around entertainment when stationary, the competition is geared towards driving the car.
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