Events with multiple people from the same neighbourhood going to a common destination, such as commuter rail train departure or school start, can result in very efficient trip combining.
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Autonomous Car Progress
- Thread starter stopcrazypp
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Events with multiple people from the same neighbourhood going to a common destination, such as commuter rail train departure or school start, can result in very efficient trip combining.
EVNow
Well-Known Member
Interesting side note : Our city+county provide free carpooling I.e. vehicles and fuel. Yet, few take it …. most people prefer individual cars since that saves time.
Agreed. Where I live the commuter rail offers free local transit as a connection which was largely unused until they also started charging a token amount for parking [land constraints forced the issue as you can only build so many parking garages]. Local transit increased noticeably but is still hamstrung by frequencies.
In a place like Manhattan, they'd probably get tens of thousands of car-pool style trips per day if the fare is reduced sufficiently. Less likely to be popular elsewhere for work commutes, though a fair number of large companies do run buses which get some use and those won't stay if they can be replaced with a car-pool comp instead.
School trips (10+ year old kids, no parents), is likely to generate huge carpooling opportunities, particularly if the kids can arrange in advance who will be in the trip (friends only).
A self driving School bus with no one monitoring the bus. Not a good idea
EVNow
Well-Known Member
I think robocars that takes older kids to various activities would be a hit.
diplomat33
Average guy who loves autonomous vehicles
Why would it be a bad idea? You would just need to make sure the self-driving bus were safe and reliable on its route. And considering that school buses usually follow a regular route within a certain area around the school, it would be ideal for the type of geofenced autonomous driving that Waymo and Cruise are doing. And it would be easy to HD map the routes that the school buses takes every day to help with reliability.
The main problem with a self-driving school bus will be the lack of control INSIDE the bus
diplomat33
Average guy who loves autonomous vehicles
Do you mean controlling the kids who might get unruly? You could have a school employee ride the self-driving bus to keep an eye on the kids.
Yes that is what I meant, and you're correct that there are solutions to that problem. It was a light hearted comment to say that I don't see any reason not to allow self-driving buses, or self-driving anything. So long as it's done right.
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
Laws will have to change
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) has called a self-driving school bus project in Florida “unlawful,” and the trial has been put on pause. It’s one of the most forceful interventions by the Department of Transportation in the early days of autonomous vehicles. The news was first reported by Jalopnik.
The North American arm of international transportation company Transdev was using one of its pod-like electric autonomous shuttles — called the EasyMile Easy10 Gen II — to carry school children three blocks on private roads. The test was taking place in Babcock Ranch, a tech-forward community in Florida that claims to be the country’s first solar-powered town.
“This small pilot was operating safely, without any issues, in a highly controlled environment,” Transdev said in a statement. The company says it still has not received the NHTSA’s letter ordering it to stop the program, and that it instead voluntarily stopped the pilot one week before it was scheduled to end anyway. “Transdev believed it was within the requirements of the testing and demonstration project previously approved by NHTSA for ridership by adults and children using the same route,” the company writes.
THE NHTSA SAYS TRANSDEV NEVER GOT APPROVAL TO TEST THE SHUTTLE AS A BUS
Transdev was granted permission in March to import the shuttle for “testing and demonstration purposes,” according to the NHTSA. It has also operated autonomous shuttles in Babcock Ranch since the beginning of the year. The government says Transdev never mentioned plans to use the shuttle as a school bus, though the company widely promoted the effort. “School buses are subject to rigorous Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards that take into account their unique purpose of transporting children, a vulnerable population,” the NHTSA writes.
Transdev’s pilot program had the shuttle pick up a maximum of five kids at a designated area and drop them off at school, all while traveling at around eight miles per hour (with a safety supervisor on board). The shuttle only operated one day per week, according to the company. Ultimately, according to Transdev, the goal is to make a service that is more demand-responsive, offering door-to-door rides via an app. But the pilot was only supposed to last 6 weeks.
“Families provided specific approval for their children to ride the school shuttle,” the company writes. “Again it was the same shuttle that parents and children have been using on weekends as part of the Babcock Ranch experience since November 2017.”
The intervention from the NHTSA is one of the first we’ve seen from the agency, which has taken a fairly hands-off approach to regulating the development and testing of self-driving veh dating back to the Obama administration.
“Innovation must not come at the risk of public safety,” Heidi King, deputy administrator of the NHTSA, said in a statement. “Using a non-compliant test vehicle to transport children is irresponsible, inappropriate, and in direct violation of the terms of Transdev’s approved test project.”
Lisa Hall, a spokesperson for Babcock Ranch, said in a statement to The Verge that students have only been able to ride the shuttle on specific days. Otherwise, they walk or ride bikes to school.
“[STUDENTS] HAVE ENJOYED BEING ‘PIONEERS’ OF THIS NEW TECHNOLOGY.”
“They will be disappointed as they have enjoyed being ‘pioneers’ of this new technology, and I am sure look forward, as we do, to resolving any concerns or misunderstandings about this project,” Hall says. “The shuttle is being piloted as public transportation offered by the community for the convenience of our residents. Safety has been and continues to be our top priority.”
Update October 23rd, 2:30PM ET: Added information from Transdev’s official statement.
The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) has called a self-driving school bus project in Florida “unlawful,” and the trial has been put on pause. It’s one of the most forceful interventions by the Department of Transportation in the early days of autonomous vehicles. The news was first reported by Jalopnik.
The North American arm of international transportation company Transdev was using one of its pod-like electric autonomous shuttles — called the EasyMile Easy10 Gen II — to carry school children three blocks on private roads. The test was taking place in Babcock Ranch, a tech-forward community in Florida that claims to be the country’s first solar-powered town.
“This small pilot was operating safely, without any issues, in a highly controlled environment,” Transdev said in a statement. The company says it still has not received the NHTSA’s letter ordering it to stop the program, and that it instead voluntarily stopped the pilot one week before it was scheduled to end anyway. “Transdev believed it was within the requirements of the testing and demonstration project previously approved by NHTSA for ridership by adults and children using the same route,” the company writes.
THE NHTSA SAYS TRANSDEV NEVER GOT APPROVAL TO TEST THE SHUTTLE AS A BUS
Transdev was granted permission in March to import the shuttle for “testing and demonstration purposes,” according to the NHTSA. It has also operated autonomous shuttles in Babcock Ranch since the beginning of the year. The government says Transdev never mentioned plans to use the shuttle as a school bus, though the company widely promoted the effort. “School buses are subject to rigorous Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards that take into account their unique purpose of transporting children, a vulnerable population,” the NHTSA writes.
Transdev’s pilot program had the shuttle pick up a maximum of five kids at a designated area and drop them off at school, all while traveling at around eight miles per hour (with a safety supervisor on board). The shuttle only operated one day per week, according to the company. Ultimately, according to Transdev, the goal is to make a service that is more demand-responsive, offering door-to-door rides via an app. But the pilot was only supposed to last 6 weeks.
“Families provided specific approval for their children to ride the school shuttle,” the company writes. “Again it was the same shuttle that parents and children have been using on weekends as part of the Babcock Ranch experience since November 2017.”
The intervention from the NHTSA is one of the first we’ve seen from the agency, which has taken a fairly hands-off approach to regulating the development and testing of self-driving veh dating back to the Obama administration.
“Innovation must not come at the risk of public safety,” Heidi King, deputy administrator of the NHTSA, said in a statement. “Using a non-compliant test vehicle to transport children is irresponsible, inappropriate, and in direct violation of the terms of Transdev’s approved test project.”
Lisa Hall, a spokesperson for Babcock Ranch, said in a statement to The Verge that students have only been able to ride the shuttle on specific days. Otherwise, they walk or ride bikes to school.
“[STUDENTS] HAVE ENJOYED BEING ‘PIONEERS’ OF THIS NEW TECHNOLOGY.”
“They will be disappointed as they have enjoyed being ‘pioneers’ of this new technology, and I am sure look forward, as we do, to resolving any concerns or misunderstandings about this project,” Hall says. “The shuttle is being piloted as public transportation offered by the community for the convenience of our residents. Safety has been and continues to be our top priority.”
Update October 23rd, 2:30PM ET: Added information from Transdev’s official statement.
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
We will have to wait for the letter--- but I bet it says there's something about their shuttle that doesn't mean the legal NHTSA requirements for "school bus"
and the 'autonomy' part does not enter into it at all.
I mentioned this because AFAIK there's no federal laws regarding autonomy they even could violate for the NHTSA to be trying to enforce here.
and the 'autonomy' part does not enter into it at all.
I mentioned this because AFAIK there's no federal laws regarding autonomy they even could violate for the NHTSA to be trying to enforce here.
So, we have a higher priced vehicle that saves no labor costs.
EVNow
Well-Known Member
voyager
Active Member
If people already own a car, anything else is just extra costs. Some cities (I already mentioned Amsterdam) are so expensive for having a personal car, that people opt for PT, and UBER or car sharing. Funny how "sharing a cab" when people from the same neighborhood are heading for the same destination, is close to what SF shuttle operator Chariot (bought by Ford then gone belly up) was doing, something in between PT and taxis.
Btw, I feel we need to start a new thread that's more focused at what's quintessentially playing:
Will Car Automation Disrupt the Personal Mobility market?
This thread is more of a collective bin for all ADS developments not directly focused on one particular subject.
In case this wasn't yet mentioned...
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Hmmm seeing media about Germany scrutinizing Tesla's lane-change feature
www.bnnbloomberg.ca
Tesla Faces Scrutiny by German Regulator Over Autopilot Feature - BNN Bloomberg
Tesla Inc. faces a review in Germany over an Autopilot feature, as regulatory scrutiny intensifies into the carmaker’s driver-assistance technology.
www.bnnbloomberg.ca
diplomat33
Average guy who loves autonomous vehicles
Waabi is a new start-up that thinks that the current approach of developing FSD has proven to be too costly and too slow. They think they can do better with simulation alone, with no real world testing until the very end:
www.technologyreview.com
This super-realistic virtual world is a driving school for AI
Startup Waabi is betting everything on a radical new approach to autonomous vehicles that ditches real cars.
www.technologyreview.com
EVNow
Well-Known Member
As long as they can show a few million miles of real-world testing ... should be fine. Ofcourse they will learn the hard way that simulation is only as good as the programmer's imagination. And as we all know, programmers never make mistakes
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