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Autonomous Technology and Patents

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croman

Well-Known Member
Nov 21, 2016
5,299
8,325
Chicago, IL
There is a clear new trend among automotive companies. They are now innovating again. Tesla is a big driving force in this industry. While I wouldn't say they are "disrupting" the entrenched players, their pace of innovation and acceptance of risk while innovating is certainly pushing big automakers out of their comfort zone and encouraging them to either innovate in house (ala Nissan) or acquire talent and tech (ala GM/Cruise and now GM's solid state lidar).

There is an interesting trend that dovetails what other industries have undergone as they innovate -- patent portfolios are growing but also established portfolios from other industries, seemingly unconnected to self driving car technology, are asserting licenses and claims to technology. This, in turn, drives patent trolls to acquire portfolios from dying (or dead) tech companies such as Nokia or Kodak for pennies on the dollar and assert them in creative ways against emerging tech companies. While the Innovation Act might become law, SCOTUS has partially blunted the appeal of troll litigation in Octane Fitness but troll litigation still poses a dire threat to self driving tech companies.

Tesla's patent strategy is one of non-enforcement. They favor broad licensing and will not assert their patent portfolio in a traditional manner. This is a curious one and I do not necessarily think Tesla should adopt this position until it has firmly established control of the tech space but that's what Mr. Musk has decided and it means that Tesla will have to steer clear of others while still convincing its stakeholders of its portfolio's value as a shield and not a sword.

This is such a large topic that I do not think this first post could really intelligently uncover it all but I wanted to separate out the general patent talk into a potential discussion on self driving tech patents, licensing schemes, specifically FRAND (fair reasonable non-discriminatory) licenses for essential industry technology and the intersection of innovation and reality in terms of patent litigation and injunctive relief for infringement.

Tesla's portfolio seems to mainly focus on electric battery drivetrain technology which mostly will be industry specific essential tech (IMO) and therefore Tesla's permissive licensing just reinforces the existing RAND scheme. However, I do not believe other industry players will be so quick to cede potential royalties or strategic advantages with declaratory/injunctive relief from purported infringement. The costs and lost time due to patent litigation is a powerful weapon in rapidly advancing tech. Just a look at Waymo's trade secret litigation against Uber reveals how devastating and costly litigation can be for emerging tech companies. I believe Tesla's IP strategy is worthy of its own thread as it might have more influence on the advancement (or lack thereof) of autonomous technology than the actual engineering efforts behind the scenes (that we are not privy to).

For some (mostly relevant) discussion of the essential tension between innovation and patent royalties (and whether something should be FRAND vs. regular negotiated royalty), this article isn't horrible.

FRAND And Patents - The Economic Problem Behind The Apple And Qualcomm Lawsuit

Sorry, there really aren't great discussion of patent law that aren't usually filled with jargon and patent law but I'll look and put up what I find.
 
Interesting thread.

Google Racking Up More Patents Than Most Automakers On Connected And Self-Driving Cars

Forbes-Infographic_v4-1200x801.jpg


I'm sure intel has racked up alot of patents now with their mobileye acquisition.
 
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Reactions: lunitiks
For some (mostly relevant) discussion of the essential tension between innovation and patent royalties (and whether something should be FRAND vs. regular negotiated royalty), this article isn't horrible.

FRAND And Patents - The Economic Problem Behind The Apple And Qualcomm Lawsuit

Sorry, there really aren't great discussion of patent law that aren't usually filled with jargon and patent law but I'll look and put up what I find.
The FRAND angle I find interesting and I think it's relevant to both the EV and autonomous vehicles. My understanding is FRAND only happens voluntarily and when a patent is related to a standard. So technology involving charging standards and the V2V communication standards for example would be covered.

However, a lot of the technology both an EVs and autonomous vehicles are not under standards, but rather are proprietary. If I am understanding correctly, that allows certain players with certain technology to keep everything to themselves (and sue others they deem violating their patent) or charge exorbitant prices for licensing it.
 
The FRAND angle I find interesting and I think it's relevant to both the EV and autonomous vehicles. My understanding is FRAND only happens voluntarily and when a patent is related to a standard. So technology involving charging standards and the V2V communication standards for example would be covered.

However, a lot of the technology both an EVs and autonomous vehicles are not under standards, but rather are proprietary. If I am understanding correctly, that allows certain players with certain technology to keep everything to themselves (and sue others they deem violating their patent) or charge exorbitant prices for licensing it.

So FRAND is a creature of the telecom industry at present. It was created because telecom needed standardization (it was too fragmented to be useful for anyone -- its already bad enough with GSM/CDMA and other regional issues). The industry itself decided that they'd have enough for the fighting and inability to deliver quality services across the fiefdoms (both in terms of cellular networks but also in terms of technological standards for the hardware). Thus, they consented to create a third party council of tech experts. Tech companies submitted their patents to be considered as embodying the standard used across the industry. If the council agreed, the royalty rates would be capped to a fair and reasonable amount and the industry would license it and move on. The dichotomy of this strategy is that if the previous fiefdom had been maintained the individual licenses obtained would be richer but the number of licensed entities would be very low (i.e. only those that absolutely could not escape the patent would have to pay up). By establishing a FRAND system, the number of licensees skyrockets because you've got a lot more to lose by avoiding the standard tech than gain by dodging it and recreating the wheel from scratch (or risk liability by not licensing and then being targeted for enforcement).

I see a direct need in this sphere as well which is why I brought up FRAND licensing. I don't see why the emerging autonomous vehicle space, particularly BEV, can't use some maturity and standardization. I'm sick of CSS/chademo/J1172/Tesla/mennekes-2, etc. I'm sick of reading 50 different patents about the exact same stuff but done slightly differently. The point of the patent system is to reward innovators and therefore spur innovation. Currently I don't see that. I see innovation as being hampered because we're creating 50 ways to self drive a vehicle rather than breaking that innovation down into tiny subparts and acknowledging that someone's method is the best (or industry standard) method for doing something. Then each company can just pay that company a license and move on and build new layers of methods on top of that. That way no one is wasting time duplicating work and the eventual system that is created is the best that the best minds across companies could have created. The synergy is essential to a bigger societal benefit.

Unfortunately the patent system can be a detriment to innovation and I think reform is on the horizon but its really unfortunate that technology that will save lives is being hampered by short sighted monpolistic activity.
 
I wonder how much FRAND as a topic is going to be relevant to the self driving space. In industry you generally get FRAND terms being required when you've got an interoperability standard that the industry as a whole needs to adopt in order to meet customer needs. If the standard is generated through a standards process (as opposed to de-facto) then participants generally come up with some kind of FRAND requirement in order to avoid handing the whole market to one player. I'm not aware of other places where FRAND gets employed, though I'm not an expert.

Reasonable and non-discriminatory licensing - Wikipedia

Interoperability requirements for initial ADAS and SDC is dominated by their need to interoperate with other human drivers and existing road infrastructure. And of course there isn't patent protection on the protocol that a human driver uses to interact with his surroundings while driving a vehicle, so a vehicle using that protocol isn't going to be forced to use any particular developer's technology. There are interoperability protocols for subsystems - for instance radar frequencies and output powers must be FCC approved, lidar has to meet eye safety standards and so forth - but these almost never involve standards-essential patents.
 
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Today IP laws seem to more focuses on creating wealth for investors rather than enhance new technology development. Some of the most valuable IP is not patented today.

Patents are just one way to protect IP. Depending on what the IP is copyrights, trademarks, or, particularly, trade secret protection make more sense or are combined to best monetize the asset. Patents, though, are ideal for a lot of IP and I disagree that most of the valuable IP is not patented. If its truly innovative, patent term is usually more than adequate and protecting a trade secret is very difficult and risky (we're not talking about the Coke recipe (or KFC which was recently disclosed)).

Most technology is hard to protect any other way. If its a trade secret, its vulnerable to reverse engineering. You've got to keep it out of people's hands and there's the whole deal with securing the secret against theft or discovery (Waymo thought it could trust Levandoski and had adequate procedures in place to detect theft (hence the case being brought)).

Copyrights are life+70 years, so the longest formal federal recognition. Trademarks can be maintained indefinitely but they are both limited vehicles for mostly non-tech purposes. Basically I wouldn't advise anyone that had anything of value to not consider their options and a patent is definitely one of the most attractive options for protecting valuable IP that will erode quickly. The fact details are publicly shared generally doesn't adversely affect value -- rather, it proves that the tech is novel and innovative and therefore is actually valuable (rather than taking any company's word about its novelty or value).

I'm sure I'm biased but I deal with all kinds of IP and I'm not a patent attorney, so I don't even get people patents so I'm not that biased.
 
So I'm looking at this possibly highly interesting patent by the reputable HIDROTECNOAGUA, S.L.:
"Conjunto Adaptado A Un Descargador De Cisternas Para Indoros".

Can't figure out what it *means*, though. Drawings are *not* available on the webpage
 
FYI, I obtained an industry trade magazine that describes autonomous safety patents and, indeed, it noted that safety innovations were shared among the industry, often without a specific fee schedule, because of an inculcated tradition of sharing technology that saves lives. The example cited was that Volvo had invented the modern belt buckle and immediately shared that technology with all car manufacturers. So that does dovetail with what I was analogizing to earlier in this thread and follows a pattern across industries.

This is a similar article that is publicly available: Why Volvo gave away the patent for their most important invention

I can't imagine that Tesla should not follow a similar model with their tech but I fear for Tesla because their patent portfolio is not being curated or created to act as a good shield or sword against competitors and thieves. Since Elon doesn't understand them, he doesn't hire people to manage and protect the company but that's for another thread.

There is a good reason that companies use and utilize patents. Patents provide the power to exclude. The system was created by the US to address issues with British royal patents and literally spurred the US' technological dominance (and was exploited by those such as Thomas Edison and underutilized (ironically) by Tesla (the man)).

Tesla (the company) should utilize that power to exclude competitors while they are still nascent. The time for magnanimous sharing can happen after its existence is no longer in doubt.
 
Also, if you want a good laugh, check out what made it into a patent published recently on automotive tech: (lesson: don't use dictation software to draft patents).

US9346394B1 - Method and apparatus for installing and operating an auxiliary lighting system using a vehicle light plug - Google Patents

In another embodiment the sensor 408 works with a relay in a known manner I'm sorry babe, but I may actually have to be here late. I've got to get this patent application filed today. Thankfully, Traci is willing to stay late to help me get it done.

____________________

The above made it through prosecution (somehow) and is published.