Autopilot collision: Autobahn driver claims his Tesla ran into a barrier on the A7

[calisnow]

Saw this story today and the original story is on Reddit - didn't see it mentioned here yet:

My Autopilot had an accident : teslamotors

 

[Max*]

IBT: It's the drivers fault/it's the drivers responsibility to control the vehicle/etc.

 

[cgiGuy]

Was in Germany a few weeks ago. The left lane in an Autobahn construction zone is extremely tight and nerve-racking, even while driving manually. Can't imagine thinking to myself "well, let's see how this beta Autopilot does here.."

 

[Spidy]

 

[Beryl]

Was in Germany a few weeks ago. The left lane in an Autobahn construction zone is extremely tight and nerve-racking, even while driving manually. Can't imagine thinking to myself "well, let's see how this beta Autopilot does here.."

Yep. Where is the common sense? There is an area like that everywhere. On Hwy 59 there is a stretch that I wouldn't use Autosteer. TACC worked fine though.

 

[dhanson865]

from the reddit thread

• I don't blame Tesla for anything. I just think this issue can be avoided using current sensors and technology, so I want to share my experience so the Autopilot can be improved.
• I may have had too high confidence in the Autopilot. In the future I will not activate it in places where I don't have time to correct its mistakes.
• The Autobahn construction zones often have sharp turns where you are actually led into the opposing lane. I did not let the Autopilot drive there.
• At least my manual (in danish) does not say anything about construction zones. It only says not to use it in cities or roads with pedestrians or cyclists but only on motorways with clear lane markings. It was night but the weather was clear.
• Elon Musk has stated that the Autopilot is probably a better driver than humans, and I still agree with that. It's not like humans never hit these barriers.
• It was not "dangerous". I got a few scratches on my car, but I did not put myself or others in any real danger.
• The car did not make a sudden turn towards the barrier, it just crept into it.
• Based on the damage and the noise, I am pretty sure that I only hit the reflectors. But is that still not too close to the wall? If the wall had been higher, I would have hit it with side mirrors before hitting the reflectors with the side of the car.
• I would like to give Tesla access to my telemetry data, but I don't know how I can do that without them contacting me.

• It was very close to the barrier all the time, but I was confident that as long as it could see the barrier it would not hit it. I yanked the wheel as soon as I heard the noises from the car hitting the barrier.
• I was hands-on with full alert, but the Autopilot had handled all the other construction lanes so perfectly that I had more confidence in the Autopilot than in my own abilities (that has changed a bit though).

I know that it is my responsibility and I have contacted my insurance company to get the car repaired. Fortunately I have a pretty good insurance with a low deductible.
I just feel like it could be fixed in the Autopilot with reasonable ease because the IR sensors could see the barrier all the time.

 

[Modeler]

Was in Germany a few weeks ago. The left lane in an Autobahn construction zone is extremely tight and nerve-racking, even while driving manually. Can't imagine thinking to myself "well, let's see how this beta Autopilot does here.."

Agree 100%. We have construction on Dulles toll road in DC area and they put a concrete barrier just half a foot away from the left edge of the left lane. This is an HOV lane that electric vehicles are allowed to use and I pretty much cruise in this lane for about 8 miles. The thought of enabling autopilot under these conditions seems nothing short of insane to me. Computers have glitches all the time and all it would take to hit the barrier is a slight twitch of a wheel. I'd be risking my own life as well as the lives of drivers around me. The thought that someone else is stupid enough to do it scares the hell out of me.

 

[S4WRXTTCS]

Does anyone have a Model S with AP where the ultrasonic sensors are perfect, and never fail to detect?

There are all sorts of cases where I've noticed the sensors simply not picking up what's there, but other times they work great. I've just never seen a level of consistency that would lead me to believe I could let autopilot drive in this situation.

Now I'm not saying they are defective or there is something wrong with them. I just believe that there aren't enough, and there is no way to detect things at different heights. Like sometimes they won't detect a big rig right next to me because the big rig is up higher than a normal car.

 

[martinwinlow]

Does anyone with local knowledge know what the OP means by 'reflectors'? Just wondering if they are flimsy things that the car's ultrasonics wouldn't be able to 'see'? Anyway, sounds like a very minor incident, thank goodness.

Edit: Just read some of the reddit thread. So, the reflectors are just 'flimsy', so no surprise they might not have been seen by the U/S sensors. But they are only about 80mm wide and directly attached to a metre high concrete wall...!

More than the fact that the AP *appears* to have 'malfunctioned', I am amazed by the number of posters on the reddit thread who happily admit to not keeping at one hand on the wheel when using AP. Surely everyone has had at least one 'moment' using AP? Bonkers... MW

 

[Whitmarsh]

The fellow waa a silly ass (donkey, not backside) to be using AS there, wasn't he? No sympathy for him at all.

 

[AwesomeAL]

Does anyone with local knowledge know what the OP means by 'reflectors'? Just wondering if they are flimsy things that the car's ultrasonics wouldn't be able to 'see'? Anyway, sounds like a very minor incident, thank goodness.

Edit: Just read some of the reddit thread. So, the reflectors are just 'flimsy', so no surprise they might not have been seen by the U/S sensors. But they are only about 80mm wide and directly attached to a metre high concrete wall...!

More than the fact that the AP *appears* to have 'malfunctioned', I am amazed by the number of posters on the reddit thread who happily admit to not keeping at one hand on the wheel when using AP. Surely everyone has had at least one 'moment' using AP? Bonkers... MW

Check out this image: http://bc02.rp-online.de/polopoly_f...1.jpg_gen/derivatives/d540x303/1370760101.jpg

The reflectors are the tiny orange dots on the small wall between the lanes (to oncoming traffic). The left lanes are REALLY narrow and should only be used by people who know how to drive. The right lanes are huge (because of trucks).

 

[Pinarello]

I use AP frequently and think its great, but not perfect. The driver must pay attention and be ready to make corrections at any time. It is usually the fringe cases where you should not expect AP to handle all situations. This includes construction zones, when the road widens into more lanes or narrows into fewer lanes, and roads where lane markings are very poor or non-existent. 99% of the time is works well, but that is no where near where it needs to be to for autonomous driving.

 

[AWDtsla]

Does anyone have a Model S with AP where the ultrasonic sensors are perfect, and never fail to detect?

There are all sorts of cases where I've noticed the sensors simply not picking up what's there, but other times they work great. I've just never seen a level of consistency that would lead me to believe I could let autopilot drive in this situation.

Now I'm not saying they are defective or there is something wrong with them. I just believe that there aren't enough, and there is no way to detect things at different heights. Like sometimes they won't detect a big rig right next to me because the big rig is up higher than a normal car.

Fail to detect? I've NEVER seen the car take appropriate action based on the ultrasonics. Neither concrete barriers nor vehicles in lane. They are clearly detected according to the display.

Let's see what this new firmware does..

 

[Max*]

Fail to detect? I've NEVER seen the car take appropriate action based on the ultrasonics. Neither concrete barriers nor vehicles in lane. They are clearly detected according to the display.

Let's see what this new firmware does..

I've had side-collision avoidance activate once. Pretty sure it was due to the ultrasonics when a bus tried to move an inch into my lane. I've had other MUCH closer calls when the side-collision avoidance didn't do anything, very odd behavior.

Side Collision Avoidance - disappointing?

 

[Muzzman1]

This is the contribution I made to that reddit post:

By reading the Release Notes you would see that you should NOT activate AP in adverse weather OR construction zones. It SUCKS that you've injured your beautiful car, but hopefully this is a lesson to all to RTFM. Page 84 of your Model S manual (for reference)

 

[Just a Reader]

Was in Germany a few weeks ago. The left lane in an Autobahn construction zone is extremely tight and nerve-racking, even while driving manually. Can't imagine thinking to myself "well, let's see how this beta Autopilot does here.."

Apparently it happened in Austria (Bad Gastein). Not much different there, though.

 

[EcoHeliGuy]

I get the impression he was being informative in the post while being careless in the situation. But this demonstrates why Tesla believes they need more hardware to obtain full Auto pilot. I believe the car "viewed" the reflectors as the lane markings, and because they were still visible to the camera being higher in view, the car was trying to get closer to that side.

 

[Kandiru]

IMHO when buying a Tesla one should prove that he generated the funds through own labor,
that way the brand can survive as common sense will prevail in situations like this.

 

[EcoHeliGuy]

Huh?

 

[jeffro01]

Fail to detect? I've NEVER seen the car take appropriate action based on the ultrasonics. Neither concrete barriers nor vehicles in lane. They are clearly detected according to the display.

Let's see what this new firmware does..

Interesting you say that. My car seems to react consistently to things it detects from the ultra sonics like when it gets close to the concrete barrier wall it'll move itself back away based on the ultra sonics, same goes with traffic in other lanes, etc...

Jeff