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Autopilot error (dashcam for evidence)

Discussion in 'Model 3: Driving Dynamics' started by bigroo42, Sep 6, 2019.

  1. bigroo42

    bigroo42 Member

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    So, i feel like Michael Scott in the Office when he said "technology tried to kill me, Jim. technology tried to drive me into a lake" (when referring to following GPS navigation some years back).

    I am curious how often something this, for lack of a better word, potentially catastrophic happens. I was driving in the left lane on autopilot and the wheel suddenly jerked to the left, right into the lane of oncoming traffic. I don't know how far it would have gone over or if it would have corrected or not, since i grabbed the wheel as fast as i could.

    Video below

    Animated GIF - Find & Share on GIPHY

    my trust in autopilot went from about 90 percent trust down to about 50. and i know, i know we should have our hands on the wheel at all times....it's driver assist, not autopilot, yada yada yada.

    the point of my post is to see how 'bad' this error is or if it's quite common. Thanks for any input.
     
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  2. quikshifter

    quikshifter Member

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    are you on v32? it seems to do that.
     
  3. derotam

    derotam Member

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    You are using autosteer in an environment in which it is not designed to work appropriately.

    Now that that is out of the way... you entered an intersection with no straight line lane markings(common), and the computer lost track of where the lane was..and guessed wrong.

    It happens occasionally for me too but I always prepare myself whenever I am going through an intersection just in case it gets confused.

    It's nothing new and it might go through that intersection fine the next time, maybe not...and it might change with the next release.
     
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  4. bigroo42

    bigroo42 Member

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    don't know how to check that... :/
     
  5. derotam

    derotam Member

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    It doesn't matter what version you are on...all versions will do the same thing in different scenarios that can't be predicted because autosteer isn't programmed to deal with this fully yet.

    But, you can tap the tesla logo at the top of your screen and it will tell you at the bottom of the popup what version you are on.
     
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  6. bigroo42

    bigroo42 Member

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    i get that for sure. but i would just think that 1 of 2 things would happen in this scenerio. 1. it would just 'coast' or not aggressively steer in any one direction, or 2. (safest choice) beep at me, disengage auto steer and TACC and basically start to decelerate and force me to take control. last thing i would want it to do is 'guess'. it's not like it was trying to drive me into a HOV lane onramp that was closed at that current time. it was, for no apparant reason, veering across the lane.

    I was just wondering what would have happened had i not taken control. definitely using auto steer more cautiously on city streets.
     
  7. AdamVIP

    AdamVIP Member

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    AP likes very much to see the lines in the street. It also very much favors the left so it doesn't drive you off an off ramp. It doesn't like intersections yet as it hasn't been formally trained on those yet. It likely thought it was a highway and the started searching for a left line.

    The simple and serious answer is don't use it there anymore because at best it would have slammed the brakes stopping you infornt of that guy there and at worse there would be injuries. You don't want to forget where you are and have it do it a second time while not paying attention.
     
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  8. brkaus

    brkaus Well-Known Member

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    I love AP. Use it all the time.

    I never take my hand off the wheel.
     
  9. ilyak

    ilyak Member

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    It's not "guessing", not beyond a particular threshold anyway. This is how machine decision making works - weigh all available inputs against preset criteria and decide on an action. An intersection like this presents an environment it is not currently designed to operate in, so neither the inputs, nor the criteria, nor the outcome actions will be appropriate sometimes. And then there's the obligatory RTFM:

     
  10. derotam

    derotam Member

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    Yeah, but there isn't any "failsafe" option for an "unknown scenario" because it is continuously analyzing the environment and making decisions...there is always an answer, it's just that it might be wrong. As per the Tesla Autonomy Day presentation I am going to assume that if you have it allowed, the car sent data and video of that scenario when you took over back to Tesla for them to review.

    This is kind of like at a merge or when a lane gets wider all of a sudden for whatever reason. For the most part(but not always), the car will recenter aggressively where I think it would be more appropriate to just continue to follow the lane line that isn't going away relative to the other one. I have been hoping they would have made an adjustment by now but it still happens more often than not.

    I have seen the intersection navigation improve over time and I will note that if you are closer to the car in front of you, Tesla does take that into account as far as where to go, however not all the time and not consistently as far as I can figure out. My car made a left turn through an intersection a few weeks ago a couple car lengths at most behind another vehicle after being stopped at a light.
     
  11. StealthP3D

    StealthP3D Active Member

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    Public releases are not designed for city streets yet. If you use it in complex environments be extra vigilant.

    I love AP, especially on long road trips.
     
  12. jjrandorin

    jjrandorin Another BMW convert

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    #12 jjrandorin, Sep 7, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2019
    ^^^this + 1000%

    OP, your confidence in autopilot in the circumstance in which you were using it should be 10-20%, not 50% (or 90%) because its not designed for it yet, full stop. Yet, if you had a collision, you would be here blaming autopilot (and so would the media).

    Please do not use this on city streets until it is supposed to be used there! Driving in general is complicated, and for some reason people loose sight of the fact that they are hurtling around in a machine that could cause instant death to not only them but to others in their surroundings if not properly operated. Yes, I am being "that guy". dont use autopilot where it is not supposed to be used... period... hands on wheel or not.

    The thread title should be at a very minimum "Autopilot error while being used on City streets"
     
  13. Fossil Fool

    Fossil Fool Member

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    Mine does exactly the same every time on Hwy 69 in Prescott Valley at a particular intersection. I just hold on and correct it.
     
  14. MP3Mike

    MP3Mike Well-Known Member

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    To me it looks like because the lane lines disappeared it found the next visible line which was the white one to the left of the SUV in the turn lane so it went to adjust it's position next to that line.

    As others have said, inappropriate use of AP.
     
  15. NoMoGas

    NoMoGas Supporting Member

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    It's not designed for city streets just yet. It's made for freeway at this time.

    Also, your SW version doesn't have much to do with AP. This is a common misconception. The AP computer updates without a firmware update (notice when folks purchased FSD there was no FW update, it just started working). They sometimes rollout changes in tandem with updates but usually its separate and in the background.
     
  16. eustachio

    eustachio Member

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    "Warning: Autosteer is intended for use only on highways and limited-access roads with a fully attentive driver"
    That's from the manual.



    I turn AP off if there are unclear white lines.

    Use it as intended.

    (Suggest mods change title, it wasn't an autopilot error, but an unsuitable environment for its use)
     
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  17. bigroo42

    bigroo42 Member

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    Th
    Thanks for the quote from the manual and ignoring my questions. A real value add. I'm sure you keep your hands on the wheel during ap 100 percent of the time like it says to do right?

    And feel free to edit the title of my post. Semantics.

    Way to foster community
     
  18. Daniel in SD

    Daniel in SD Active Member

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    :eek:
    I’m amazed that there have been no autopilot accidents on city streets. Maybe everyone is following the manual but this forum makes me doubtful.
     
  19. bigroo42

    bigroo42 Member

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    I guess my Counterpoint to using Auto steer on city streets is that Tesla obviously knows when I'm driving on a city street. It limits my auto-steer to only 5 miles per hour above the speed limit. On a highway it does not limit my auto steer to 5 miles an hour above the speed limit. So my thinking is auto-steer is not recommended for City driving but the future is still enabled obviously. If the future was truly dangerous Tesla should disable the feature when it recognizes a driver is on a city street. It simply gives the driver overconfidence that he shouldn't have on city streets. It would almost be like if seatbelts didn't work in a crash above 80 miles an hour. Well we still wear seatbelts and sometimes have crashes going a hundred miles an hour. So should we just take our seat belts off if we go above 80 miles an hour because they're not going to work properly at 120 miles an hour? Of course not we still wear her seatbelt. Obviously not an apples-to-apples comparison but it's just something that came to mind
     
  20. NoMoGas

    NoMoGas Supporting Member

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    Great... we lose more functionality because people CAN'T FOLLOW DIRECTIONS and need to be protected from themselves.

    The feature isn't dangerous when used AS DIRECTED.
     
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