Autopilot: If changes require "hands on the wheel at all times" who will use, buy?

[ShotgunF15E]

Look People:

If your car crashes. Its your fault.

I don't care what feature you had engaged....Whether it was cruise control, Whether it was automatic headlights, Whether it was anything. It was the drivers fault.

Lets grow up people.
(they didn't tell me to steer my car)
(they didn't tell me I had to stay awake)
(they didn't tell me I had to stay in the front seat)
(they didn't tell me I had to pay attention)
(they didn't tell me.........)

Let me ask a question. If I sold a product and it was simply 2 wires that plug into the wall. If you decide to put the ends of the wire in your mouth and plug it into the wall.....would it be my fault that you killed yourself because: ( let me pause here for a second )..... I didn't write you a "note" to tell you not to?

Geeeeesh. Grow up. If your car crashes. Its your fault.

My car sat in it's parking spot all day and never once crashed into anything....

 

[Az_Rael]

Geeeeesh. Grow up. If your car crashes. Its your fault.

You can rail about this all you like, but it unfortunately doesn't change the realities of our current society. If Tesla starts getting named in lots of lawsuits related to stupid people, they are eventually going to take actions to try and reduce their exposure to those stupid people.

 

[Garlan Garner]

My car sat in it's parking spot all day and never once crashed into anything....

And mostly ALL of them will just sit there in their parking spot.

Its only when some people ( idiots ) "unpark" them that accidents start to happen. Garlan Garner

 

[EVie'sDad]

Everyone chill out.


The hysteria over Tesla’s Autopilot has been completely blown out of proportion

 

[Garlan Garner]

You can rail about this all you like, but it unfortunately doesn't change the realities of our current society. If Tesla starts getting named in lots of lawsuits related to stupid people, they are eventually going to take actions to try and reduce their exposure to those stupid people.

Nope. Wrong answer.

Guns are still available. No reduction in exposure there.

 

[Garlan Garner]

Everyone chill out.


The hysteria over Tesla’s Autopilot has been completely blown out of proportion

The truth is that it's blown out of proportion.
I'm standing for the Truth. Everyone should.

I've never been a person that simply lets the truth get trounced. To each his own I suppose.......

 

[EVie'sDad]

There are two meanings of "require" (or allow) in play. "Require" could mean "must do it or it won't function" or "require" could mean "must do it because we say so". AP requires hands on the wheel only in the second sense, except for needing to briefly tug the wheel every few minutes when it nags. And in the beginning it didn't even have nags. I think the disconnect between these, where the AP system they gave us works fine without hands on the wheel, frankly shows that Tesla introduced the whole "hands on the wheel" thing as a cynical ploy to try to reduce their liability exposure in case of an accident: something I cannot blame them for given our litigious society. I believe the company knows perfectly well that AP will mostly be used without hands on the wheel, and even intended AP to be used without hands on the wheel, but by saying we must have our hands on the wheel they are able to say the system was being misused by the driver if something went wrong. And I think most of us understand Tesla's motivation and thus have no fear or hesitation to use the system without our hands on the wheel, because we know that it was really designed to be used without our hands on the wheel. After all, if we all really believed the system wasn't designed that way, so it was really much less safe without our hands on the wheel, we would all be pretty stupid to use the system the way most of us do without our hands on the wheel, wouldn't we? So both the company and most of the owners play this sly, cynical game where we wink and nod at each other and use AP without hands on the wheel, just as it was designed to be used and just as the company would say it should be used if we lived in a world without product liability.

I fear the problem is that now that the regulators are involved, the inconsistency in our game will be scrutinized, the meanings of "require" will be forced to be converged, and AP will be made not to function without our hands on the wheel, even though it was never meant to be used that way.

Required means required. Otherwise liability lies with the driver.

 

[sillydriver]

I think it might be more useful to geofence autopilot to limited access roads only (what the system is currently designed for). I'll bet that what we end up with, though is more nags.

I think that if "hands on the wheel" isn't required by the regulators, then your geofence idea is absolutely correct: it has been my prediction in these posts:

#483

#44

 

[Garlan Garner]

AP is not malfunctioning.

Someone point to a case where AP malfunctioned and killed someone.


I'm waiting......

 

[sillydriver]

Required means required. Otherwise liability lies with the driver.

I don't think so. In order not to be repetitive or crosspost I'll point to where I made the argument here:

#1385

 

[Garlan Garner]

Oh no.....it didn't tell me to put my hands on the wheel!!!!! come on.

 

[X Yes?]

AP is not malfunctioning.

Someone point to a case where AP malfunctioned and killed someone.


I'm waiting......

You don't think where it didn't see the white semi against the blue sky applies?

 

[Garlan Garner]

You don't think where it didn't see the white semi against the blue sky applies?

Wait.... Who didn't see the truck? Are you asking about the driver?



What in the world was the driver doing?

 

[Garlan Garner]

A feature should NEVER absolve a driver.

 

[JohnSnowNW]

You don't think where it didn't see the white semi against the blue sky applies?

You're well aware, since it's been discussed, that this situation highlights the limitations of the technology...not a malfunction of the technology.

So, maybe stop simply trying to fan the flames...okay?

 

[WileyTheMan]

Requiring to have a hand on the wheel wouldn't necessarily deter me from getting the option. Having a hand on the wheel is natural and I like the idea of the car providing background steering and braking assistance over full hands-off control. Ultimately I probably won't buy it for my M3 initially because its not something I will need, and I will be conscious about the options I pick. In the future? Who knows.

 

[timk225]

Any sort of autopilot where you have to keep your hands on the wheel defeats the purpose of autopilot. And even if you do, you're not going to be concentrating on the road as much as if you were driving. The car might be halfway out of its lane, heading for the guard rail, and you let it go, thinking the autopilot will pull it back, and by then you are way past the point of which you would have already reacted on your own if you were driving.

And it is impossible to concentrate if you are trying to reach those last few french fries in the bottom of the bag that are hiding around and under the cheeseburger. You've GOT to get all the fries!!! One cannot be left!!!

 

[Garlan Garner]

I'm getting it because I can afford it. Not because I need it or think its the greatest thing in the world.

 

[EVie'sDad]

I'm getting it because I can afford it. Not because I need it or think its the greatest thing in the world.

I have had it for ten months and never had an incident. Well worth it and it is safer, which is why many other drivers next to it want to gawk and look and keep pace to see it. They have no fear the car will careen into them or off the road. Unless the driver chooses to ignore the rules of the road and the Autosteer warnings. Which can happen in any car, autosteer isn't going to change that.

 

[EVie'sDad]

Think of it this way, IF CR gets its way, then we will never get to autonomous driving. These are the necessary steps to go from advanced cruise control and auto steering to full autonomy in the next decade or two. If you inhibit it, it week never happen.
Now go test drive an AP Tesla before posting more gibberish.