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Autopilot information from Tesla.com misleading

Discussion in 'Model S' started by sumitkgarg, Sep 1, 2017.

  1. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    On Autopilot page, under the "Enhanced Autopilot" section, it says (relevant parts taken out and put below):
    • transition from one freeway to another
    • exit the freeway when your destination is near
    • Autopilot will watch for opportunities to move to a faster lane when you're caught behind slower traffic
    • When you reach your exit, your Tesla will depart the freeway, slow down and transition control back to you
    • Once on the freeway, your Tesla will determine which lane you need to be in and when
    • ensuring you reach your intended exit
    • With Smart Summon, your car will navigate more complex environments and parking spaces, maneuvering around objects as necessary to come find you
    And from what I understand (I can't validate first hand since my car is still scheduled for production), these capabilities do not exist with EAP. How come they can get away with advertising the things that are not available and have no timelines for either?
     
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  2. vkathuria

    vkathuria Member

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    Welcome to Tesla Family!

    You will get used to this :)
     
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  3. Bebop

    Bebop Member

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    Even worse is the FSD.
     
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  4. luckyj

    luckyj Member

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    Don't forget this imporatnt part:

    "Tesla’s Enhanced Autopilot software has begun rolling out and features will continue to be introduced as validation is completed, subject to regulatory approval."

    Which essentially means, some, none, or all of these features may be made, approved, or become available for you to use.

    :)
     
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  5. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    It's just like when you read:

    "Tea is free with paid entree."

    Then you just withhold the essential information off and when you ordered tea without an entree and was charged for it, you then ask how can they get away with saying:

    "Tea is free"!
     
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  6. TaoJones

    TaoJones Beyond Driven

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    Wow. I've owned an AP2 car for 5 months now (with both EAP and FSD paid for), and an AP1 car for 2.5 years prior thereto, and had no idea Autopilot could, or frankly, may *ever* with current AP2 hardware, do any of that.

    I'm still waiting for traffic light and stop sign reaction (versus mere recognition) that was referenced in the October 2014 timeframe, as well as for AP2 to read/react to speed limit signs on the road instead of relying upon oft-wrong information from some database, which is the case today.

    Wow a second time. Autopilot's going to watch for opportunities to move to a faster lane when I'm behind slower traffic, eh? Good luck with that in Los Angeles :). And it's going to exit the freeway when my destination is near? The last time it tried to do that was through the side of an overpass while approaching the Twin Falls, Idaho supercharger. Not good.

    I appreciate marketing as much as the next guy - we live in exciting times and Tesla leads the way several times over (see supercharging network, for example). However, as a shareholder and a multiple Tesla AP car owner, I'd appreciate much more if either Elon started hitting his time estimates (December 2016, anyone? 3-6 months, anyone?) or told the Marketing professionals on his team to tone it down just a tad - that disclaimer at the end clearly isn't enough to avoid setting inaccurate expectations.

    I certainly wouldn't have bought Tesla #2 when I did had things been stated more... accurately *polite cough* up front.
     
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  7. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    Not exactly. This is not the norm for advertising car features that costs close to $100k. It might be the norm for restaurant freebies though.

    Can you tell me which other car manufacturer does that?
     
  8. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    You can see TV advertisements about automatically braking just in time to avoid crashing into a pedestrians, cars, obstacles...

    It's conditional. It's only true when all conditions are met as specified by owners manual. It has speed restriction, sensor range restriction, not work in all scenarios and driver is still responsible if it hits something...
     
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  9. Mattzilla

    Mattzilla Member

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    And that's exactly why they won't change the sleazy marketing tactics with hyperbolic verbiage: It got you to buy a car, didn't it? Apparently the truth wouldn't have.
     
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  10. Tangible

    Tangible Member

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    All those promises were there as part of the EAP ordering process back in the fourth quarter of last year, when I bought it. The difference is that there were no disclaimers then - simply a statement that these features were awaiting final validation and were expected to be in production by December. That was an outright lie. The language has been changed now, but the claims are no closer to being true.

    Sadder and wiser now, I know this: Neither the Tesla S nor any other production car is likely to be doing these things for years to come. What passes for Autopilot now isn't even tied into the navigation system, so it can't begin to do things like get on and off the roads along my route by itself.

    My narrowed expectation now is that we will get simple, decent adaptive cruise control and lane-keeping, at the level now available in all other high-end brands. Maybe they'll even figure out rain sensing wipers, a few decades behind everyone else.

    The good news is that you're getting a high-performance electric car that's a pleasure to drive. Just understand that YOU will be doing the driving. The Autopilot is as real as the Yeti or the Loch Ness monster.
     
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  11. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    Again, this is not the same thing. At least they “try” to do what they advertise. It may or may not work well. On the other hand, Tesla is advertising something that they don’t even have yet (for months and months).

    Peace!
     
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  12. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    I am in complete agreement with the above observation.

    When they first announced that you could buy AP1 now in 2014 and you'll get all those wonderful features but I clearly heard "hardware" and I understood clearly that those promised features would mean nothing without a firmware which owners wouldn't get yet for an undetermined time.

    I also remembered that unbelievers didn't have to pay for it if they wanted to wait to make sure AP1 would work in future.

    Now we are in the middle of AP2 and it's still the same way: You don't need to pay now, you can wait if you are a doubter.

    The website, order page, blog page all gave the conditional clause: a promise pending software validations in an undetermined future.

    When you pay for something, you need to understand what you pay for.

    Just because I didn't read the disclosure on the order page, that does not mean I can blame the mistake on others.
     
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  13. David_Cary

    David_Cary Member

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    While lying helped sell a few cars, I have a hard time trusting them again. I have an AP1 car that I love. I will never buy a Tesla that isn't superior to what I have. Since I have a lease, I may get something from Tesla but it certainly won't have AP which is a shame. Chances are, I will buy out the lease.

    Amazing that my 2.5 year old car is significantly better in regards to AP compared to a new car. Now no one predicted that!

    I never expected AP2 to be so bad. I mean a year later and not to parity yet - unbelievable.
     
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  14. sumitkgarg

    sumitkgarg Member

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    #14 sumitkgarg, Sep 2, 2017
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2017
    This would be like Amazon advertising x min drone deliveries on any item that you order if you buy their Prime membership. Since they don't really offer it yet (but they do have plans to do it at some point), they don't advertise it on their Prime membership page even with a disclaimer, which is the right thing to do IMO. Although, even if they did, I'd probably still pay for it because I want their 2-day free delivery service and then complain about their sleazy marketing techniques. Same with the EAP - I want the current capabilities but don't like how they are setting the expectations with no delivery timeframes in sight. There is a difference between marketing features that are coming in the next few months vs. "maybe" in the next few years. What they're doing just seems wrong to me.

    Now, I like Tesla too, which is why I ordered my car but I feel like there is a need for more transparency than just having everything revolve around their quarterly numbers.
     
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  15. Matias

    Matias Active Member

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    Completely different thing. Those cars have those features. They may not work in every situation, but nevertheless those features exist. Tesla's EAP don't exist.
     
  16. ecarfan

    ecarfan Well-Known Member

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    @luckyj thank you for posting the language that Tesla clearly states on its website. It appears that some people missed reading it.
     
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  17. daktari

    daktari Member

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    What timeline would you say is reasonable to expect from that statement? 1 year, 2 years, 5 years, 10 years?
     
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  18. kdday

    kdday Member

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    At what point do owners that bought EAP for 2x the cost of AP1, much less FSD, start demanding refunds? I'm patient but good grief EAP is not showing signs of viability as marketed.

    I'm an owner, but if I had leased and I'd be 1/2 - 1/3 into my lease already and paid for these features I'd be unhappy.
     
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  19. Az_Rael

    Az_Rael Supporting Member

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    To Tesla's credit, it's not even done in smaller font or with an asterisk at the bottom of the page.


    IMG_0436.jpg
     
  20. R.S

    R.S Member

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    What I personally dislike isn't the design studio text, but rather the unreasonable expectations concerning the timeframe.

    I am currently in the middle of my AP1 Model S lease, now if I had waited a bit longer, my car would have had EAP and FSD and I am pretty sure I would have payed for FSD without ever using it until the end of my lease. In my case that would be 57€ every month, for something I can't use.

    I hope Tesla proves me wrong, but feel bad for anyone on a lease, who got FSD because of the "3-6 months" promise.
     

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