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Autopilot lane keeping still not available over 6 months after delivery

Max*

Charging
Apr 8, 2015
6,670
3,719
NoVa
I think a lot of you misunderstand my gripe. I don't want them rushing an unfinished feature. I want to know why they gave the perception and sales material that made it appear to be just about ready (demonstration and statement of several months).

Basically if they can't stick to their time line, give us a heads up. If Tesla had given any indication at the time of purchase that it wouldn't be available this summer, I wouldn't have had an issue.

I understand it, it's a typical Musk PR stunt.
 

JMG

Member
Feb 26, 2015
386
263
NE Texas
I'd kind of have to agree that it seems a little drastic to threaten a class action lawsuit because the feature isn't available yet. It seems very strange to me to purchase a car ahead than your normally would for a feature, yet to be available, you want to use for a specific time frame 10 months in the future. That is almost like going ahead and making arrangements, writing Tesla a check for your Model X before you get an actual delivery date or even production date and then get angry when it isn't delivered by their non-specific timeline. I understand they said "a few months" but that is very ambiguous. This is probably why they don't assign specific release dates for certain features, because who knows what is going on behind the scenes. Perhaps it's been close to release and then during beta testing someone had a fairly significant event.

I'll be very interested to see all the fine details of the auto steering. With as many false alarms I get on the lane departure warning, it's made me think several times just how reliable it may be.

I will give you this though, I do agree that Tesla (and Elon) should cool down on the hyperbolic claims for a few things until they are known as 100% fact. "End range anxiety" = a super buggy navigation system. "A few months" = a LOT of months :wink:
 

MsElectric

Active Member
Oct 11, 2014
1,604
18
New York
I think the OP would be satisfied with being on the beta testing list (with signed NDA). Since he's a hardware/software dev himself, wouldn't his input be both more comprehensive (8000 miles of terrain that the Tesla team might not have encountered) and complete (detailed with all relevant environment variables)? Sounds like if Tesla's reading this posting that they should consider the idea?

I think Tesla should be free to pick their beta testers without being forced to accept someone s a beta tester on a public forum. You do bring up a good point though about them giving a glimpse of the present state of the technology with a quick video.
 

slevit1md

Member
Jun 22, 2015
295
175
Oregon
Class action lawsuit? WTF??? Why is it in America when people don't get their way as they perceive it to be, they immediately jump into litigation? Furthermore, buying a car because of a "promised" feature with no set launch date and then bitching about it after the fact is just dumb. Totally dumb. Tesla sells the car to you when you buy it based on what's available at that time. If you don't like it, then don't buy it. If you truly threw away money to upgrade your car based on a feature that didn't exist yet then the only one you can blame is yourself.

I really don't get it, what exactly are you upset about? Tesla never promised a date, just gave an extremely vague timeline. If you took that as literal then I have a bridge to sell you.

Jeff
This.
 

wk057

Senior Tinkerer
Feb 23, 2014
5,655
11,388
Hickory, NC, USA
On a side note, if Tesla were to take action against me in some way based on a forum post about easily avoided legal action from a courteous and respectful 3x (so far) repeat customer... then I think my respect for them may be misplaced.

- - - Updated - - -

I think the OP would be satisfied with being on the beta testing list (with signed NDA). Since he's a hardware/software dev himself, wouldn't his input be both more comprehensive (8000 miles of terrain that the Tesla team might not have encountered) and complete (detailed with all relevant environment variables)? Sounds like if Tesla's reading this posting that they should consider the idea?

Edit: Following OP's last post, so would an announcement in Mar 2015 that, "we've encountered technical difficulties and won't be able to release auto-steering until Q1 2016" have been sufficient?

I personal don't care either way about being a beta tester or not. I've never requested to be. I've been recommended by others at Tesla. I think it would be more to their benefit than mine, honestly, given the amount of driving I do. But I'm not asking for anything along those lines and don't expect anything there.

As for a March announcement of difficulty, yeah that would have been nice if it were the case and I'd definitely be given them a lot more benefit of the doubt. At this point though it looks more like a ploy to boost Q4'14 sales than technical difficulties though.
 

MsElectric

Active Member
Oct 11, 2014
1,604
18
New York
On a side note, if Tesla were to take action against me in some way based on a forum post about easily avoided legal action from a courteous and respectful 3x (so far) repeat customer... then I think my respect for them may be misplaced.

No other automaker presently offers full autopilot capability that Tesla has advertised because it is not easy.

Please allow Tesla the time to get this right and safe before they release it. They've said for a while that they plan to have this out over the summer so why not just give them a few more months? This is not technology you want them to rush out the door...
 

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
7,678
5,697
Merced, CA
Class action lawsuit? WTF??? Why is it in America when people don't get their way as they perceive it to be, they immediately jump into litigation? Furthermore, buying a car because of a "promised" feature with no set launch date and then bitching about it after the fact is just dumb. Totally dumb. Tesla sells the car to you when you buy it based on what's available at that time. If you don't like it, then don't buy it. If you truly threw away money to upgrade your car based on a feature that didn't exist yet then the only one you can blame is yourself.

I really don't get it, what exactly are you upset about? Tesla never promised a date, just gave an extremely vague timeline. If you took that as literal then I have a bridge to sell you.

Jeff

Immediately? You think waiting 7 months past a few (few being 3 months) is jumping into a lawsuit? Do you know what it takes to get the ball rolling on something like that. How long it takes to find lawyers, how long it takes to find a class, how long it takes to merge classes and firms when judges order it. It an take years to really get it started.

This is not the only issue that is boiling. I agree that it is well past time for Tesla to live up to their auto pilot promises. I've been occupied with 691 other issues because that was a feature that we were buying that was supposed to be part of the vehicle already rather than something that wasn't yet released that's just late.
 

eye.surgeon

Active Member
Nov 18, 2014
1,368
2,014
California
I'ts not that we aren't willing to give Tesla time to get it right. it's that they tell us they've got it right, but they don't, at least not a ready-for release version.

Simply put: don't promise if you can't deliver.

They've been promoting autopilot features that don't even exist on the website for 6+ months. The marketing people and the engineers need to get on the same page.

Love my car, zero regrets.
 
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ecarfan

Well-Known Member
Sep 21, 2013
19,198
13,846
San Mateo, CA
To the OP: Taking legal action over a promised future feature with no specific time frame promised is...irrational. You buy the car based on the features that will be delivered with the car. Yes, the car has hardware that is intended for use with the future Autopilot software, and at some point it will be released. But do you want Tesla to get it right, or just get it out there? We know that it is under active development and it has to be as close to perfect as possible before being released. Lives are at stake. Including yours.

In my opinion your position is unjustified logically and legally.
 

sorka

Well-Known Member
Feb 28, 2015
7,678
5,697
Merced, CA
I understand they said "a few months" but that is very ambiguous.

Most people including most definitions say 2 or 3, so I don't think its ambiguous at all. If he's said in the near future or the future(more likely) then that would be ambiguous for sure but that's not not what he said.
 

MsElectric

Active Member
Oct 11, 2014
1,604
18
New York
Immediately? You think waiting 7 months past a few (few being 3 months) is jumping into a lawsuit? Do you know what it takes to get the ball rolling on something like that. How long it takes to find lawyers, how long it takes to find a class, how long it takes to merge classes and firms when judges order it. It an take years to really get it started.

This is not the only issue that is boiling. I agree that it is well past time for Tesla to live up to their auto pilot promises. I've been occupied with 691 other issues because that was a feature that we were buying that was supposed to be part of the vehicle already rather than something that wasn't yet released that's just late.

I understand your frustration but you do realize that when they announced the Auto Pilot capabilities they were to be released in stages? It's not like they have done *nothing* for 7 months. Instead they have activated and implemented these features every few months when it is safe to do. So I think the premise that customers have been waiting 7 months for nothing is not fair.

What they are about to release no other automaker present is offering. If this was easy someone else would have done this already. If they need 2 more months to get this right do you really want them to rush this out?
 

wk057

Senior Tinkerer
Feb 23, 2014
5,655
11,388
Hickory, NC, USA
To the OP: Taking legal action over a promised future feature with no specific time frame promised is...irrational. You buy the car based on the features that will be delivered with the car. Yes, the car has hardware that is intended for use with the future Autopilot software, and at some point it will be released. But do you want Tesla to get it right, or just get it out there? We know that it is under active development and it has to be as close to perfect as possible before being released. Lives are at stake. Including yours.

In my opinion your position is unjustified logically and legally.

I already stated up thread that they need to get it right. At the very least early adopters should be offered a refund of the cost for autopilot convenience features with the option to pay for activation later, like the options current purchasers have. That is where legal action would be justified to accomplish.

My problem is with the misrepresentation, not necessarily with rushing out the feature.
 

wk057

Senior Tinkerer
Feb 23, 2014
5,655
11,388
Hickory, NC, USA
I understand your frustration but you do realize that when they announced the Auto Pilot capabilities they were to be released in stages? It's not like they have done *nothing* for 7 months. Instead they have activated and implemented these features every few months when it is safe to do. So I think the premise that customers have been waiting 7 months for nothing is not fair.

What they are about to release no other automaker present is offering. If this was easy someone else would have done this already. If they need 2 more months to get this right do you really want them to rush this out?

If they need two more months to get it right then I expect them to own up and state, "We need two more months to get it right."

As for it being unique to Tesla, I've seen videos of normal people demonstrating this on other brands.
 

MsElectric

Active Member
Oct 11, 2014
1,604
18
New York
I already stated up thread that they need to get it right. At the very least early adopters should be offered a refund of the cost for autopilot convenience features with the option to pay for activation later, like the options current purchasers have.

My problem is with the misrepresentation, not necessarily with rushing out the feature.

So what you are now demanding is that they deactivate your Autopilot features altogether and give you $2,500? You don't want *any* of the Autopilot features because they are working on refining the steering software to ensure it is safe?

- - - Updated - - -

If they need two more months to get it right then I expect them to own up and state, "We need two more months to get it right."

But isn't that essentially what Elon said at the Shareholders meeting? He said in the June/July period they are going to start beta testing Autopilot, that Elon himself is beta testing it but that we are still months from having it released and that they still expect it to be released this summer?

I'm pretty sure we will see Autopilot released before the Model X rolls out so they can demonstrate that capability in the Model X.
 

BoldSharpe

Member
Jan 3, 2015
153
40
Wisconsin
wk057 has a legitimate gripe based on Musk's comments and likely those of Sales staff (who, from my experience, know less than many folks here on the forum).

Fully understanding legal action is not the preferred path forward, please let me know where if anyone has seen something from Tesla in writing that states anything other than the functionality will be available with 'future software releases.' Musk's comments are most likely protected by a Safe Harbor statement so his statements are merely speculative. This comes down to your personal definition of 'future.'

Years ago, a buddy of mine told me he was getting a boat. As I relayed the information to my roommate at the time, his was response was, "I'll believe it when I'm skiing behind it." Sure enough, my buddy never did end up getting that boat and I learned it's often best not to believe things until you've seen them yourself.
 

wk057

Senior Tinkerer
Feb 23, 2014
5,655
11,388
Hickory, NC, USA
So what you are now demanding is that they deactivate your Autopilot features altogether and give you $2,500? You don't want *any* of the Autopilot features because they are working on refining the steering software to ensure it is safe?

- - - Updated - - -



But isn't that essentially what Elon said at the Shareholders meeting? He said in the June/July period they are going to start beta testing Autopilot, that Elon himself is beta testing it but that we are still months from having it released and that they still expect it to be released this summer?

I'm pretty sure we will see Autopilot released before the Model X rolls out so they can demonstrate that capability in the Model X.

That would be a fair resolution as opposed to thousands of customers giving Tesla 0% interest loans. Would I opt for it? Maybe. The option in itself would be a gesture of good will at least.

As for Elon's statement it was that they hoped to get testers on board by thr end of June. I mentioned in my OP that this has no bearing on my gripes.
 

zro ltr

Member
Jul 16, 2014
68
21
United States
You'd certainly have a solid gripe if Tesla hadn't said anything about autopilot since they initially announced it. I'm 99% certain that, several months ago, they said the features would be released "by the end of the summer".
 

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