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AWD Option Cost

Discussion in 'Model X' started by WhiteKnight, Feb 12, 2012.

  1. WhiteKnight

    WhiteKnight _____ P85 #549 _____ Sig Red / Sig White

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    Looking at competitors:

    Acura
    Audi
    BMW
    Infiniti
    Land Rover
    Lexus
    Mercedes

    With the exception of Infiniti, every luxury SUV/CUV priced at $40,000 or higher has AWD standard.

    For luxury SUVs/CUVs under $40,000 (and for Infiniti) adding the AWD option costs about $1,400 - $3,100.

    The Model X is starting at $59,900 (after rebate) a level that ought to come standard with AWD but it does not.

    How high can they go in charging for AWD?

    I know that it involves the addition of the second motor and that it also enables many of the killer features of the Model X (fast 0-60 time, tight turning radius, best AWD performance, better range / more regen) but I don't think this option should be more than $5,000.
     
  2. NigelM

    NigelM Recovering Member

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    I heard in one of the videos the driver accelerated and said that "this isn't even the performance version"... or something similar. But that car(s) did include AWD. So it's possible that AWD and "Performance" are separate options?

    I don't have a good guess on the pricing of an extra motor, but common sense would suggest it's going to cost more than an AWD option in an ICE.
     
  3. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    Induction motors are generally pretty expensive to produce. Even mass produced ones of roughly the same size easily get into the $5000 range. That is because it takes a long time to make the windings. And I believe the squirrel cage in the Tesla ones are copper not aluminum, and they need to operate at relatively high speed, so that is more added cost. I bet it cost's Tesla about $3k-$4k to produce a working tested motor (at Model S production scale) I bet they price it out as an option that is basically 'at cost' to Tesla. But I bet it the option is $7,500-10,000 bucks, assuming the RWD vehicle is basically the same cost as a equivalently specified Model S. You also have to think about another controller/inverter for the new motor. Wireing for the new motor. Drive linkages for the front wheels are not that simple.

    I could see them raise the base price of the X versus a comparable S about $7k-$10k even though actual cost to produce probably wont be near that much of an increase to subsidize the AWD. I think Tesla will have 1k in front differential and drive suspension costs, with motor and electronics cost. So $1k+$5K=$6k in cost. Probably tack on a little of money for slight assembly time and build complexity increase. And well some buffer for the inevitable warranty problems with more stuff.
     
  4. Mycroft

    Mycroft Life happens

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    If you plan on $10k to upgrade to AWD and an additional $10k for performance, then you'll be planning conservatively. Remember, pessimists are never disappointed! :wink:

    A maxed out Sig Model S Perf is $110k. Plan on a maxed out Sig Model X Perf to be $120k.
     
  5. qwk

    qwk Model S P2681

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    $5k? Not a chance. I bet the extra motor will be an additional $15k and the sport awd will be no less than $20k extra.
     
  6. onlinespending

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    Yeah, I feel they should make AWD standard on the Model X. It is an SUV after all. They should simplify their production line and not even allow the option to NOT have AWD.
     
  7. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    There are many people in the south that probably don't need AWD so if leaving that motor out makes the Model X a few thousand dollars cheaper, that probably makes sense.
     
  8. Eberhard

    Eberhard #421 Model S #S32

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    putting a smaller motor in front keeps cost lower as well. Performance version will have AWD at no extra cost.
     
  9. WhiteKnight

    WhiteKnight _____ P85 #549 _____ Sig Red / Sig White

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    For me, AWD is a must-have option.

    If you don't have AWD then your 0-60 times are going to be significantly worse than the Model S
    If you don't have AWD then you're not going to have the best traction control system on the planet.
    If you don't have AWD then you're not going to get such great handling, with the great turning radius
    If you don't have AWD then you're not going to get the additional regen and your range will suffer accordingly

    I really hope it's not astronomically priced. An Audi Q7 with AWD starts at $46K. Sounds like a Model X with AWD is going to start in the $65K-$70K range which is quite a difference.
     
  10. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    I love the fact that we're busily comparing features of an EV to various ICE vehicles. I love the fact that when a friend was car shopping, he *happened* upon Tesla Model S & Model X, and ended up putting a deposit down (he previously had zero interest in electric). I love that we're not preaching the benefits of EV, but that these EVs are being compared on their immediate merits.

    I heart all this.
     
  11. mikevbf

    mikevbf Member

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    I started a thread on tesla motors site projecting the cost of the various big options i.e. battery pack size, awd, and performance awd based on an cnbc interview where Elon agreed whole heartily that the model x would cost in the 60k to 85k range. Based on the options and range in cost, what made sense to me was that the awd option would cost 5k. Others have felt just like this thread it will be closer to 10k. My intuition says that people who are buying the x argue on the 5k and lower side and people buying the s and not the x are more in the 10k camp because that feels more fare to them. If you have not guessed, I have the reserved a model x bias. Here are the links:

    Tesla Unveils First SUV: Model X - US Business News Blogs - CNBC

    best price projections | Forums | Tesla Motors
     
  12. mikevbf

    mikevbf Member

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    Oh yeah I should have added I hope the model s car gets the awd option as well and by the time the model x rolls out the model s is cheaper or has longer ranges due to battery packs getting cheaper. I have a model s reservation too :wink:
     
  13. WhiteKnight

    WhiteKnight _____ P85 #549 _____ Sig Red / Sig White

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    I'm a Tesla fan and an EV fan, however I am looking at these prices and thinking Tesla has a bit of a problem (if the prices hold up).

    The Model X has been touted as "more functionality than a minivan, more style and performance than an SUV."

    And then they compare it to the Honda Odyssey and the Audi Q7.

    Well apparently the 85 kWh based Model X with AWD is going to start (before any options) at $69,900 + $5,000-$10,000 for AWD (call is $7,500) so a total of $77,400.

    If that's the case they are going to need to add a tag line "because it costs more than a minivan and an SUV combined!"

    A base Odyssey is $28,225 and a base Q7 is $46,250 for a total of $74,475!

    I am really hoping that the promised 7-9% reduction in battery costs per year for the next 2-3 years will allow Tesla to reduce the price on the Model X to the point where AWD is included or reasonably priced (under $5,000).
     
  14. Trnsl8r

    Trnsl8r Blue 85kwh since 12/8/12

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    They are. Here is from TM's site for Model X:
    Skärmavbild 2012-02-12 kl. 14.55.01.png

    Model X | Tesla Motors
     
  15. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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    Why are they red?

    "Hand wound"?
     
  16. AnOutsider

    AnOutsider S532 # XS27

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    The power of passion! Fire! FIERCE!


    ...or, to stand out.
     
  17. Thumper

    Thumper Member

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    I'm skeptical that a second drive unit can recover more regen. There is only so much kinetic energy to be converted to electricity. If the rear drive converts all except mechanical losses,which I think it will, then there is no magical way for the front unit to convert more energy from somewhere. The exception might be in very slippery conditions where the rear unit's regen is limited by grip not mechanical losses.
     
  18. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    Yeah but you also have to think that the fuel costs in a Q7 are going to be signifcantly higher than a say A6. Looking at the Q7 is 18mpg combined, the A6 3.0 is 22mpg. That is a 22% fuel savings. The 2.0 has 28mpg combined, a 56% fuel savings. So you would be saving 22% or 55% more per month in fuel than the Model S over an A6.

    And at 7.7 seconds the Q7 isn't really the competitor. With a minimum of 60kWh battery the X is going to do about 6 seconds 0-60. I am thinking Tesla is taking aim at the Cayenne (Turbo), and the X5/X6 xDrive50i. For a real competitor you are looking at around $65k. But the Model X is that SUV with minivan abilities that none of them can even hope to provide.
     
  19. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    It's a fact that they are on the front wheels more than anything. You can pull a lot more energy out of the fronts when stopping. You won't have to use the friction brakes at I bet.
     
  20. WarpedOne

    WarpedOne Supreme Premier

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    It is not just very slipper conditions but also ordinary driving through a corner at 50 mph and lifting your foot. 40 kW regen in such a scenario means instant pirouette. On a warm, dry and clean asphalt.
    There is a reason front brake discs are usually quite larger than rear, 60:40 or even 70:30 braking force distribution. For precisely this reason.
     

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