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Bait & Switch?? Help

Robostreak

Member
May 28, 2020
9
13
Sonoma CA
In December 2018 we purchased two Model X’s with “Enhanced Auto Pilot” and paid $5,000 per vehicle for EAP. I contacted Tesla service today as our vehicles aren’t recognizing traffic signals. I was advised by “Jairo” by text message we do not have “Full Self Driving” enabled. I contacted our salesperson. I explained to him he told us 1) we’d have lifetime free connectivity with vehicles, 2) we’d be able to use our phones by Bluetooth to access/open/start vehicle without keys on us and, 3) Tesla would be rolling out full self driving in 2020 and if we purchased EAP we’d have full self driving when released.

I just spoke to our salesperson “Omar” in Coral Gables FL who stated “We didn’t know at the time Tesla would roll out Premium Connectivity.... we didn’t know at the time they’d change EAP to Full Self Driving... Tesla was supposed to have Bluetooth access to vehicle by phone...”.

Now, a family member just bought a Model Y and the upgrade cost for full self drive is $7,000.

WTH is going on? Is anybody else experiencing this? Were we ripped off???

Help?
 
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Hebert

MXLR, Order 7/20, 5 seats/Blue/Black/20", EDD Jan
Apr 28, 2019
142
127
Peoria, AZ
I purchased my X in Dec 18 also. There were two options at that time, EAP and FSD. FSD seemed so far away that I chose EAP just like you did.

Later I upgraded to FSD for another $3k. I'm not sure what the upgrade price is now.
 

Robostreak

Member
May 28, 2020
9
13
Sonoma CA
When we purchased there were only two options - Dec 2018 - AutoPilot and Enhanced Auto Pilot. Those were the ONLY two options at the time. Same when I had ordered one online (still have my online order confirmation to show) - two options - AutoPilot and Enhanced AutoPilot. FSD didn’t come out until spring 2019.
 

Hebert

MXLR, Order 7/20, 5 seats/Blue/Black/20", EDD Jan
Apr 28, 2019
142
127
Peoria, AZ
There are lots of threads about FSD in Jan/Feb/Mar 19 when the price was changed. Search for FSD chart or FSD price change and look for the ones in that time frame. I seem to recall those who purchased FSD in 2018 and paid lots more than the new price has lots to say.

The features in each package did shift and those who bought EAP got a pretty good deal.
 
Last edited:

jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
Nov 28, 2018
9,513
10,695
Riverside Co. CA
When we purchased there were only two options - Dec 2018 - AutoPilot and Enhanced Auto Pilot. Those were the ONLY two options at the time. Same when I had ordered one online (still have my online order confirmation to show) - two options - AutoPilot and Enhanced AutoPilot. FSD didn’t come out until spring 2019.

I purchased a model 3 in december of 2018 and they were clear that "FSD" was not purchasable. During that specific time frame they were not offering it, HOWEVER there was never any promise that enhanced autopilot was "FSD".

It was super clear to me that FSD was going to be an additional purchase, of 3k on TOP OF the 5k I paid for EAP at that time. They had the same features, but it was clear that at some point EAP and FSD were going to have a divergence of features.

I decided later to purchase FSD at an additional cost, in my case because i bought it during a firesale I got it for 2k additional, not 3k, but it was always an additional cost.

What you are upset about is, there is finally some difference in the feature set, but you think that you purchased it, when you didnt.


There is no "bait and Switch", there is nothing to do to "help" you... if you want the stopping at stoplight feature which was NEVER promised for EAP, you will need to pay. IF you dont need that feature, keep your EAP which is no longer purchasable by anyone and has almost every feature that FSD does except for that (and getting the new HW 3.0 computer since you dont have that).
 

Tam

Well-Known Member
Nov 25, 2012
8,926
7,719
Visalia, CA
...Were we ripped off???...

What got what you paid for as displayed on your legal documents.

Your Monroney Sticker would list what options available in your car and your receipt would list how much did you pay for those features in "Motor Vehicle Purchase Agreement".

Enhanced Autopilot and Full Self-Driving Capability are two different features with different prices that are all listed on the website and other written documents so I don't see how you could not see that unless you did not pay attention, did not read and you depended on a salesperson to promise what you would get.

Depending on a salesperson is fine but whatever the verbal promises are, they need to be documented on the written legal paperwork. Tell the salesperson to put "included" on the line that says "Full Self-Driving Capability".
 

Krazaak

Member
Jul 30, 2017
903
1,000
Charlotte, NC
FSD upgrade from EAP should cost a lot less than FSD upgrade from AP (your family member's Y). You should be able to see the upgrade cost for your vehicle in the app and that cost will include the HW3 upgrade required for your vehicle.

At the time Tesla changed from selling EAP and FSD to AP and FSD, EAP included every feature that was currently released. When they switched to the lower cost AP, most advanced features that used to be part of EAP were moved to the FSD package. To reflect that EAP customers both paid more for the autopilot package and were getting fewer new features in FSD, the upgrade cost is substantially less than purchasing FSD on a new vehicle. It's been as low as $2,000 at one point and I think either $3 or $4k now.

The new visualizations require the HW3 computer, so you need to purchase the FSD package to get the upgraded hardware.

The cutoff for lifetime premium connectivity was Jun 30, 2018.
 

CapeOne

Member
Jun 14, 2016
887
573
New England
I'm not sure what your sales associate told you but EAP (for $5k) and FSD (for an additional $3k) were available options by December 2018 on the MX. If you had purchased both at the time, it would've cost $8k. Has Tesla told you what the cost would be to add FSD now?
 

mxnym

Member
Mar 9, 2018
904
333
Bloomington, IN
I purchased a model 3 in december of 2018 and they were clear that "FSD" was not purchasable. During that specific time frame they were not offering it, HOWEVER there was never any promise that enhanced autopilot was "FSD".

It was super clear to me that FSD was going to be an additional purchase, of 3k on TOP OF the 5k I paid for EAP at that time. They had the same features, but it was clear that at some point EAP and FSD were going to have a divergence of features.
To the OP: Exactly this. Your "salesperson" may have been misinformed, or you may have misunderstood/misinterpreted your salesperson, but EAP and FSD were offered as soon as they started selling AP 2.0, so it was obvious that EAP =/= FSD for anyone paying any attention. Sometime after I chose to purchase EAP and NOT FSD in 2017, the FSD option was removed "to reduce confusion." IIRC from seeing discussion about this in various places online, it could still be purchased for the difference either as an "off-menu" option (at time of purchase) and/or via your online account for a limited period of time after purchase (and thereafter at the going rate).
 

Silicon Desert

Active Member
Oct 1, 2018
3,482
3,331
Sparks Nevada / GF 1
FSD is an option that you chose when you order the car or buy an inventory so no you where not ripped off but more like you were not paying attention or you didn't understand.
Yes, and there were the same two options when I bought my car in 2017. I don't feel like I got baited and switched. Some people may not be doing their homework in advance to understand what they are buying. But also, for many people it is a complicated process to understand and they think they got hood-winked.
 

Robostreak

Member
May 28, 2020
9
13
Sonoma CA
Thanks for the replies. In speaking with our original salesperson and a few other folks at Tesla, our salesperson owned up to having misunderstood or having bad information. Very respectable he owned up to it. Nonetheless, disappointing. Bought two vehicles expecting them to have three ‘included’ features they ultimately don’t have, or don’t have without additional cost. Might be nice to ‘do research’, but that’s why there are salespersons - for those of us who don’t want to spend hours doing research. ;)
 

Tam

Well-Known Member
Nov 25, 2012
8,926
7,719
Visalia, CA
...that’s why there are salespersons - for those of us who don’t want to spend hours doing research. ;)

Car salespeople are ranked among the worst trusted (only 8% of Americans in this poll trust them):

20190111_Trusted_Professions.jpg



That's why we have a Monroney Sticker and Motor Vehicle Purchase Agreement to verify whether their verbal explanations are reflected in the legal paperwork.

So, no research needed, just have them document on the paperwork as "included".
 

Bigriver

Member
Mar 2, 2018
473
411
Pittsburgh, PA
our salesperson owned up to having misunderstood or having bad information.
Good to hear that he owned up to it.

we’d have lifetime free connectivity with vehicles
When we bought our model X in November 2017, we were told that at some point we would have to start paying for connectivity. We were told that had always been the plan, but 4-5 years into this Tesla had yet to charge anyone. It was June 2018 when Tesla made public their plan, and in a rare nod of appreciation to early purchasers, they made the connectivity free for everyone who bought (or ordered) their car by then. And for those who bought after that, only a limited time of it being free until a monthly fee applies.

Sometime after I chose to purchase EAP and NOT FSD in 2017, the FSD option was removed "to reduce confusion." IIRC from seeing discussion about this in various places online, it could still be purchased for the difference either as an "off-menu" option (at time of purchase) and/or via your online account for a limited period of time after purchase (and thereafter at the going rate).
Specifically, it was mid-October 2018 when FSD disappeared as an option in the online configurator. It was still available offline. We got it as an offline adder to our model 3 delivered in November 2018. I believe FSD did not return as an online option until March 2019 when Enhanced Autopilot disappeared and basic Autopilot appeared.
 

Plan B

Active Member
May 8, 2015
4,862
2,235
Portland OR
Thanks for the replies. In speaking with our original salesperson and a few other folks at Tesla, our salesperson owned up to having misunderstood or having bad information. Very respectable he owned up to it. Nonetheless, disappointing. Bought two vehicles expecting them to have three ‘included’ features they ultimately don’t have, or don’t have without additional cost. Might be nice to ‘do research’, but that’s why there are salespersons - for those of us who don’t want to spend hours doing research. ;)

Because you are new to Tesla, let me just tell you that not all Tesla employees are knowledgeable about what they sell, they expect you know get informed yourself. Sorry but that is just how it goes with Tesla.
 

MiddKid

Member
Jan 3, 2014
305
257
Seattle
Because you are new to Tesla, let me just tell you that not all Tesla employees are knowledgeable about what they sell, they expect you know get informed yourself. Sorry but that is just how it goes with Tesla.

True with every car dealer. The last few cars I’ve bought I’ve always taught the salesperson a thing or two about the vehicles that they didn’t know. This includes Tesla and other brands. Just bought my teenage daughter a car and had researched a height-adjusting cargo area. The “product expert” swore to me that this was an additional accessory. Nope...showed her how it worked.

I’d never trust a salesperson...especially when it comes what is/isn’t included with a given package.
 

Robostreak

Member
May 28, 2020
9
13
Sonoma CA
Update... as the salesperson in Coral Gables Tesla, Omar, owned up to his misrepresentation of the three things..... we expected Tesla to make it right. We expected at minimum to be offered to upgrade to FSD for cost at time we purchased our X’s. Even though, let me be clear, we were told at time of purchase our $5k Enhanced Auto Pilot was/would be Full Self Driving capable. And that has been confirmed again to us by the salesperson as his understanding at the time.

Nope. I spoke to “Keen(?)”, manager of the month (?) at Coral Gables Tesla just moments ago. He acknowledged Omar admitted ‘he didn’t know’ and ‘based information on Elon’s tweets’ at the time. And then proceeded to advise me they ‘took away FSD’ in end of 2018 but brought it back in Feb 2019. He then suggested we can now purchase it at a great reduced price currently on sale for $3k each vehicle! (Wow, I mean, what a deal!). He also confirmed they’ve made structure changes to the package because they didn’t anticipate capabilities back then and have continued to ‘adapt’. He tried suggesting $3k is a deal because we paid $5k and should be paying an additional $7k for FSD for a total of $12k for the upgrade. Does that sound right to y’all???

He then asked me to provide my verification of Omar’s misrepresentations.... before he’d commit to any consolation in this issue. Meaning - let us know what legal liability they have and potential for a lawsuit before they make this right. I repeated that at minimum we should be offered to upgrade for price at time of our purchase. He recanted. I had a nasty reply and hung up on him.

We purchased two vehicles based on misrepresented info of a Tesla employee. That Tesla employee owned up and admitted his misrepresentation. Now Tesla takes no accountability for it. Only because we’re just one of many customers that were sold that bad information and they don’t want a class action suit.

Pathetic. And what I’d expect from a sleazy dealer. Not Tesla.
 

dmurphy

Buster: 11/25/14 - 6/20/21. So sorely missed.
Dec 7, 2018
3,634
4,857
New Jersey - Morris County
Pathetic. And what I’d expect from a sleazy dealer. Not Tesla.

There's nothing sleazy or incorrect about it.

What you bought, paid for and received is Enhanced Auto Pilot. Those features are working, exactly as you paid for them.

If you wanted the Full-Self Driving package, that was an additional $3,000 at the time you bought your vehicle. You did not pay the $3k, so you did not receive that package.

If you want it right now, they are also offering it for the same $3,000. It *is* a deal, because up until about 2 weeks ago, that was a $7,000 upgrade.

Aside from the sales rep possibly conflating EAP and FSD, I don't think you've been duped, cheated, swindled, bamboozled or sleazed out of anything. *AT THE TIME* you bought your vehicle, EAP and FSD offered exactly the same functionality - FSD was a down payment on future functions, and nothing more. Those features are beginning to become reality now with the traffic light recognition and ability to stop at stop signs.

If you want those features, which did not exist at the time, and were not, never have been, and never will be part of the Enhanced Autopilot package .... pay the $3,000. It's *exactly* what you would have paid for FSD back then. This $3k will also cover an upgrade to your Autopilot computer in the car; Tesla will swap it for you at no cost.

The FSD upgrade will be going up to $4,000 come July 1st, so best to make a decision quickly.

I feel bad for you that the delivery advisor maybe didn't articulate the difference between EAP and FSD well, but you really haven't been swindled at all. You never paid for the future functions - you paid for exactly what you received.
 
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Krazaak

Member
Jul 30, 2017
903
1,000
Charlotte, NC
Update... as the salesperson in Coral Gables Tesla, Omar, owned up to his misrepresentation of the three things..... we expected Tesla to make it right. We expected at minimum to be offered to upgrade to FSD for cost at time we purchased our X’s. Even though, let me be clear, we were told at time of purchase our $5k Enhanced Auto Pilot was/would be Full Self Driving capable. And that has been confirmed again to us by the salesperson as his understanding at the time.

Nope. I spoke to “Keen(?)”, manager of the month (?) at Coral Gables Tesla just moments ago. He acknowledged Omar admitted ‘he didn’t know’ and ‘based information on Elon’s tweets’ at the time. And then proceeded to advise me they ‘took away FSD’ in end of 2018 but brought it back in Feb 2019. He then suggested we can now purchase it at a great reduced price currently on sale for $3k each vehicle! (Wow, I mean, what a deal!). He also confirmed they’ve made structure changes to the package because they didn’t anticipate capabilities back then and have continued to ‘adapt’. He tried suggesting $3k is a deal because we paid $5k and should be paying an additional $7k for FSD for a total of $12k for the upgrade. Does that sound right to y’all???

He then asked me to provide my verification of Omar’s misrepresentations.... before he’d commit to any consolation in this issue. Meaning - let us know what legal liability they have and potential for a lawsuit before they make this right. I repeated that at minimum we should be offered to upgrade for price at time of our purchase. He recanted. I had a nasty reply and hung up on him.

We purchased two vehicles based on misrepresented info of a Tesla employee. That Tesla employee owned up and admitted his misrepresentation. Now Tesla takes no accountability for it. Only because we’re just one of many customers that were sold that bad information and they don’t want a class action suit.

Pathetic. And what I’d expect from a sleazy dealer. Not Tesla.
I believe the after purchase upgrade from EAP to FSD costs $4k, although I think it is on sale for $3k at the moment.

FSD capable is a term that Tesla uses to refer to a vehicle that is eligible for FSD software purchase, it does not mean that FSD has been activated on the vehicle. It's clear that you thought it meant something else and your salesperson either didn't or couldn't explain it correctly, but the term is standard.
 

jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
Nov 28, 2018
9,513
10,695
Riverside Co. CA
Update... as the salesperson in Coral Gables Tesla, Omar, owned up to his misrepresentation of the three things..... we expected Tesla to make it right. We expected at minimum to be offered to upgrade to FSD for cost at time we purchased our X’s.

I repeated that at minimum we should be offered to upgrade for price at time of our purchase. He recanted. I had a nasty reply and hung up on him.

.


They are offering you what you said you wanted. The difference in price at the time of your purchase, for FSD, would have been an additional 3k. That IS the difference in price at the time of your purchase. EAP was 5k ( you bought this), FSD was an ADDITIONAL 3 thousand dollars and you didnt purchase it.

I am not sure what you are upset about because they are offering you the 3k price to purchase it, which is what you would have paid back then at that time. I am 10000000% sure of this, because I bought a tesla during the same month as you, and remember exactly how much it was to upgrade to FSD from EAP at the time (3k). Like you, it was not able to be purchased via a click on the website, but as I stated before I was told I could add it by the salesperson if i wanted.

Since they are offering you want you expressly said you wanted: ( " I repeated at a minimum we should be offered to upgrade for the price at our time of purchase") what is the issue?
 
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